Rules Primer- State-based Effects
Features
KrazyCaley
14 February 2010
2054 views
14 February 2010
2054 views
Had a lot of questions from people who don't know what state-based stuff is. It's really quite simple, and not as scary and technical as it sounds, so let's review briefly as I put off scoring the latest Deckbuilders' Challenge.
First, a brief review of priority. Players may only take actions when they have priority. Priority is given at some stage during every step of a turn except for the untap and cleanup steps. During the draw phase, for instance, the active player (the player whose turn it is) draws a card, any triggered effects are put onto the stack, and then the active player receives priority to do stuff.
The thing to understand about state-based actions is that they always automatically happen whenever a player would receive priority. Right before a player would receive priority, the game "checks" to see if any of the state-based actions need to be performed, and if they do, the game does them before that player receives priority. So what are the state-based actions? Direct from CR 704.5, the handy dandy list, along with some illustrations:
1- Players with 0 or less life lose the game.
Example- I am at 1 life. My opponent has a Rod of Ruin and activates its ability targeting me, during his turn. As you will recall from the last article, this causes an effect to go onto the stack that says Rod of Ruin deals 1 damage to Caley, that poor bastard. I have a Reverse Polarity in my hand. Assuming I have not taken any other damage from artifacts this turn, can I use the Reverse Polarity to keep from dying?
Answer- No. As soon as Rod of Ruin's activated ability goes on the stack, my opponent would receive priority again. The game checks my life; it's still at 1. Not dead yet. My opponent receives priority. He passes it. If I cast Reverse Polarity now, I will gain no life, since Reverse Polarity resolves before Rod of Ruin's ability does because of the last-in, first-out rule. So I have to wait until Rod of Ruin's ability resolves. But right after it does, my opponent WOULD receive priority. The game checks, and lo and behold, I have zero life. I immediately lose, before I or my opponent can do anything else. This would be true even if I was the active player and would have been the one to receive priority.
2- Players who had to draw a card from an empty library since the last time state-based actions were checked lose the game.
The first part is self-explanatory, the tricky part is "since the last time state-based actions were checked..."
Consider- During my opponent's end step, he casts Sign in Blood targeting me. It resolves. I have no cards in my library. I have now tried to draw on an empty library. My opponent would receive priority. The game checks to see if I have tried to draw on an empty library since the last time it checked state-based actions, and indeed I have, so I should lose. However, I control a Platinum Angel which prevents me from losing. So instead of the game ending, it continues apace and my opponent again receives priority. He realizes his mistake and Terminates the Platinum Angel. The Terminate resolves and Platinum Angel dies. My opponent would now once again receive priority and the game checks state-based actions. Do I lose?
Answer- No. The mill state only checks whether you've tried to draw on an empty library SINCE THE LAST TIME THE GAME CHECKED IT. The last time it checked was when Terminate was pending on the stack and I was about to receive priority to respond to it. I haven't tried to draw any cards since then, so I don't lose.
3- Players with ten or more poison counters lose the game.
Easy enough without an example.
4- Tokens that are in any game zone besides "on the battlefield" (namely a hand, a graveyard, exiled, in the library, phased out, etc.) cease to exist.
Example- I Unsummon a beast token. Technically, it exists in my opponent's hand until state-based actions are checked and it is banished to the token void. (Note, however, that a token in your hand does not affect stuff that depends on "cards in hand" since tokens are not "cards" even if you have a token card).
5- A copy of a spell that is anywhere besides on the stack ceases to exist.
Example- This rarely comes up, but it's possible. Consider- I cast Lightning Bolt, then I cast Twincast on the Lightning Bolt. Twincast resolves and I create a copy of Lightning Bolt, which then itself goes on the stack. My opponent casts Remand targeting the COPY of Lightning Bolt. It resolves. The copy goes to my hand, but as with a token, it only exists there until state based actions are checked and it disappears. A copy of a spell is also not a "card."
6- A copy of a card that is anywhere besides the stack or the battlefield ceases to exist.
Getting the hang of it?
7- Creatures with toughnesses of 0 or less go to the graveyard.
Point that has little to do with state-based actions but is still important - don't confuse this with a creature dying due to lethal damage. A 2/2 that takes a Shock dies because of lethal damage- its toughness is STILL 2 after the shock, it's just taken 2 or more damage. A 2/2 that dies to Infest dies because its toughness is 0 or less, NOT because of lethal damage.
8- Creatures that have taken lethal damage go to the graveyard.
9- Planeswalkers with 0 loyalty go to the graveyard.
10- If two or more legendary permanents with the same name (or two or more planeswalkers with the same subtype) are on the battlefield, all of them to the graveyard.
The list goes on and on, and most of the remaining stuff isn't that important. For the full list, see the magic comprehensive rules, available here under rule 704.5: http://www.wizards.com/magic/comprules/MagicCompRules_20100201.pdf
Questions? Other rules stuff you'd like explained? Need a resolution to a rules dispute? Comment here, or e-mail [email protected]
-C
Darkness1835 says... #2
Looks good. I think your really helping out some of the players. I have a rule question though; I'm certain i know the outcome, but my opponent insists he is right. He has Omnath, Locus of Mana out with a Canopy Cover and an Indestructibility on it. However, no green mana is in his mana pool, making Omnath a 1/1. My turn, I drop Festering March . Omnath is dead, yes?
February 15, 2010 2:59 a.m.
mattlohkamp says... #3
Omnath, Locus of Mana is totally dead - Canopy Cover makes it untargetable, and Festering March doesn't target, it applies to all. Black Knight dying to Wrath of God is the age-old example.
February 15, 2010 3:37 a.m.
KrazyCaley says... #4
Yep, Darkness, you're right. Omnath is neither "destroyed" nor "targeted" by Festering March . (Destroy means sent to the graveyard via lethal damage or a "destroy" effect), it's just put into the graveyard for having 0 or less toughness.
February 15, 2010 3:46 a.m.
Unless he taps a green mana in response to your casting festering march :)
February 15, 2010 12:19 p.m.
Darkness1835 says... #6
nah he was tapped out. :D now to go back over to his house and show him this webpage! thanks guys!
February 15, 2010 1:13 p.m.
KrazyCaley says... #7
See CR 701.6b (No toughness <= 0 there!) and of course, I would hope your opponent realizes that Festering March doesn't target anything.
February 15, 2010 2:14 p.m.
Magereaper says... #8
Again good job however your example with reverse polarity is not quite right. there is errata on reverse polarity that make it work like other preventative. which basicaly means you casat reverse polarity and it creates a shield that changes the first source of artifact damage in a turn to life gain instead of loss. so if you cast it in response to your opponent pinging you with rod of ruin you would gain the 1 life and not die.
February 15, 2010 3:08 p.m.
KrazyCaley says... #9
Ah. Fair enough. Should have read the errata. In that case, change the example so I have Reverse Polarity and r&d's-secret-lair out.
-C
February 15, 2010 4:27 p.m.
Question: I have an online Bloodchief Ascension , and my opponent has a 3/3 Beast Token. I Lightning Bolt that beastie; does my opponent lose 2 life and I gain 2 life when you token goes to Graveyard, even though the token ceases to exist when it gets there?
February 15, 2010 9 p.m.
mattlohkamp says... #11
So tokens still touch the graveyard, however briefly - they count as being sent to or put in the graveyard, but as far as I know, they can never count as actually being IN the graveyard, for effects like threshold. Right?
February 15, 2010 9:11 p.m.
mattlohkamp says... #12
Sorry, in other words, yes, Bloodchief Ascension still lets you Vampiric Touch /Vicious Hunger , even though the creature in question is a token.
February 15, 2010 9:14 p.m.
Darkness1835 says... #13
there is no exchange happening when their token goes to graveyard.
this is because of bloodcheif's text. it says "whenver a card is put into an opponents graveyard..." that 3/3 token isnt a card, so no damage would swap.
if ascension said creature instead of card, then the damage would swap, because even though the token ceases to exist, it still went to the graveyard for that short period of time, which is what is required to activate the ascension.
February 15, 2010 9:16 p.m.
mattlohkamp says... #14
oh crap, my mistake. I just glanced over the text, didn't see the 'card' part. No, Darkness1835 is right, tokens aren't cards.
February 15, 2010 9:40 p.m.
Darkness1835 says... #15
its ok. small technicality, but some because of the technicality, it makes Bloodchief Ascension a TON more powerful.
February 15, 2010 10:17 p.m.
KrazyCaley says... #16
Indeed. if it said whenever a "token" or "permanent" or "creature" or what have you went to the graveyard, then it would work, but alas, tokens are not "cards."
February 15, 2010 11:10 p.m.
Darkness1835 says... #17
Alas, it would seem once again that KC needs to check his/her own wall, instead of all these articles! :0
February 15, 2010 11:27 p.m.
Just want to make sure, but with Blade of the Bloodchief , when a token is destroyed it's effect is still triggered giving you counters correct?
February 16, 2010 1:35 a.m.
Darkness1835 says... #19
correct. the token is still hitting the graveyard before vanishing.
and i dont know if i have the authority to do this, but i am unofficially dubbing this article the "ask all your rule questions" article from now on.
February 16, 2010 1:36 a.m.
Oh okay thanks. That's what I thought, but the infamous Billy Fahey tried to pull some crap on me a few weeks ago.. he claimed that since tokens hit the graveyard and then vanished that Blade didn't get the counters.
February 16, 2010 1:55 a.m.
Darkness1835 says... #21
UGH! Billy disgusts me. Shame on him, he should know better.
February 16, 2010 9:36 a.m.
ChaosandKellee says... #22
did no one else notice his Sign in Blood scenario couldnt happen..... Its a sorcery ... lol
February 16, 2010 4:11 p.m.
KrazyCaley says... #23
I fail at Sign in Blood . Fair enough. That happens during his main phase. THEN we're good to go. Darkness, I'll check in just a sec.
-C
February 16, 2010 4:22 p.m.
Darkness1835 says... #24
I have an irrelevant rule question; if i've got a Garruk Wildspeaker out and my opponent attacks me, declaring damage goes to Garruk, Safe Passage doesnt protect me, right? or is a plainswalker considered "you"?
February 16, 2010 9:39 p.m.
KrazyCaley says... #25
A planeswalker is not "you." Safe Passage would not protect your planeswalker. However, if your opponent tried to Lightning Bolt you with redirect to Garruk, then you could use Safe Passage to save Garruk.
-C
February 16, 2010 11:08 p.m.
@KrazyCaley -incorrect noise- Garruk is, nor never will be, you. Safe Passage specifically states "YOU". That is you and only you. And a Planeswalker is not a creature either. It SP read "players" instead of "you", then it could save your buddy.
@Darkness1835 It's PLANESwalker. Garruk is not unblockable as long as the defending player controls a Plains. (:
February 17, 2010 3:51 a.m.
KrazyCaley says... #27
Not sure what you mean re: buzzer sound. Safe Passage prevents Lightning Bolt from damaging Garruk because Lightning Bolt has to hit the player first before it can hit the Planeswalker. If it fails to hit Garruk's controller ( because of Safe Passage ) , it can't hit Garruk. See CR 306.7
-C
February 17, 2010 4:04 a.m.
No, KC you are incorrect. If you aim the Lightning Bolt at Garruk, then it will still hit Garruk. He doesn't gain "protection" (not the keyword) from the damage, you do. After reading the rule, I still disagree with you. If I aimed the Bolt at you, then you played Safe Passage and I tried to direct it at Garruk, that would be incorrect. But because I aimed it at you, then redirected it to Garruk, it still works.
If you played a card that granted you shroud, or Protection (using the keyword) from Red then yes, I could not redirect the damage to Garruk because I cannot target you in the first place.
I'll give an example: I have an untapped Mother of Runes . My opponent casts Searing Blaze, targeting my Mother of Runes . I tap it, giving it Protection from Red. The Mother of Runes doesn't take the one (or three) damage, but I still do, because I do not have Protection from Red like she does.
February 17, 2010 4:51 a.m.
mistergreen527 says... #29
@l0ki:
I agree with KrazyCaley. Safe Passage has nothing to do with protection, it a preventative spell. If the player would take no damage, then no damage can be redirected to the planeswalker.
Let's say you have a Warrior en-Kor , a Master Healer , and a Glory Seeker on the board. Warrior en-Kor is like the player, Glory Seeker is like the planeswalker and Master Healer is like Safe Passage . If your opponent Lightning Bolt s the Warrior en-Kor you can redirect the damage to Glory Seeker , but if Master Healer prevents the damage to Warrior en-Kor , than no damage is being dealt at all, which means there is no damage to redirect to the Glory Seeker .
Weird example, sorry.
February 17, 2010 5:03 a.m.
KrazyCaley says... #30
All right, here's my reasoning. I don't really see what the protection rules have to do with it here; safe passage is damage prevention standing alone.
1- Lightning Bolt can only be aimed at players or creatures, not planeswalkers directly.
2- To hit Garruk, lightning bolt must target Garruk's controller, then when the 3 damage would be dealt to the player, bolt's controller can redirect to Garruk, per 306.7
3- Now, let's say that with bolt pending, Safe Passage is cast and resolves. Now bolt is still on the stack.
4- When Bolt resolves, two effects come up simultaneously. One is a redirection effect (noncombat damage to a player may be redirected to planeswalkers) and one is a prevention effect (from Safe Passage). If the redirection effect happens first, Garruk takes the damage. However, if the prevention effect happens first, then there is no damage to redirect and Garruk takes nothing. This is because damage that is prevented by a prevention effect "never happens." CR 615.6. Damage that never happens can't be redirected to Garruk, because the damage "would never hit" the player, the redirection effect can't be used.
5- So which happens first? It's up to the "affected player," in this case, the one who is the target of Lightning Bolt . See CR 616.1. So the player will choose to have the prevention effect resolve first, rendering the redirection effect useless.
February 17, 2010 5:04 a.m.
I'll ask a judge at my local store and get back to this thread.
February 17, 2010 5:07 a.m.
KrazyCaley says... #32
If I'm wrong, let me know what I screwed up. Trying to become a judge myself.
KrazyCaley says... #1
Actually now that I read Remand more closely, I see that it says to return the spell CARD, not the spell. But you get the idea.
February 15, 2010 12:42 a.m.