Card Economy
Features
Mpz5
28 August 2011
2789 views
28 August 2011
2789 views
When I say card economy, what are your first thoughts? Perhaps they are along the lines of card prices, turning over profits. Maybe they are along the lines of making a deck more budget friendly. While they are good guesses they all have one thing in common… they are not what we are about to talk about.
The term card economy refers to how much value you get out of a said card. By value I mean how many cards can that card either a. Turn into in terms of resources, or b. pull out of your opponents resources. Simply put how many net cards will that card grant you when you play it when compared to your opponent?
Let’s assign value to a few cards, shall we?
Goblin Piker is simply put a 2/1 vanilla creature. So you might ask what kind of value this card can have. The answer is simple. This card is a 0 value card. You might think to yourself… Why would I play a card that has 0 value? Well, the reason to play a card with 0 Value is because why it does have 0 value in terms of card economy, it helps you towards your goal of winning or helps your survivability by blocking an opposing creature. The reason we assign this card with 0 value is because generally speaking it will take one of your opponents resources to deal with it, be it trading with an attacker, trading with a blocker, or removal. The bottom line is it will likely take your opponent at least 1 played resource to deal with it which isn’t bad economically but neither is it good economically speaking.
Doom Blade is a solid removal spell utilized in many decks. Let’s look at its value. Let’s say that your opponent plays the previous card, Goblin Piker. You can then Doom Blade the goblin and kill it correct? Now your opponent is down 1 resource and so are you. That nets you a grand total of 0. So, when you look at the card value wise, Doom Blade, like Goblin Piker is a 0 value card.
Now that we basically understand how card advantage works on the battlefield, let’s look at some more complex scenarios.
Angel's Mercy is a card that net’s you life gain which is a resource, but not card economy. You play it once, it does its thing, and it goes to the graveyard giving you nothing on the field to show for it. A card like this is considered a -1 value because it has no board impact. A card with a similar utility is Archive Trap. The trap is a great card in a mill strategy but is a horrible play from a card economy perspective because again, it does its thing, goes to the grave, and you have nothing on the board to show for it. (Even if their deck feels the hit)
So basically, you are probably thinking at this point that instants and sorcery’s that don’t destroy something are pretty bad cards to play. At the same time you are probably wondering why so many good decks are full of cards like Preordain, Duress, Giant Growth, and Cancel. It’s a good thing to consider so let’s start.
Preordain, like Angel's Mercy, does its thing and goes to the grave giving you nothing on the field to show for it; however, unlike the life gain card, this card allows you to draw another which replaces itself. Because of the fact that you lose 1 resource and then immediately gain 1 resource back in the form of drawing a card, Preordain is now a 0 value card and thus not bad.
Duress on the other hand does not draw you a card to replace itself so why is it good? That’s probably a question you are asking about now if you are following my logic. Think back on Doom Blade. Why was it an ok card in terms of card economy? If you remember, it’s good because it trades 1 resource on the field for 1 in your hand making it a 0. Think of cards like Duress as a preemptive Doom Blade in that while the blade takes out a card already in play, Duress takes out a card in the hand before it can hit the field. In essence it’s still 1 or your cards for 1 of theirs which if you add it up will make it a 0 value card.
Well surely Giant Growth is a -1 because it draws you no cards and doesn’t destroy anything on the field or in the opponent’s hand. On the surface this is true but let’s dig a little deeper shall we? Giant Growth can indeed be a -1 if played in that way by pumping a creature for some extra damage. When used this way it becomes a -1 card but supplies a tempo advantage which means it makes you much closer to beating your opponent before they can stop you. There is a way in which Giant Growth could be a +1 or even better if you time it right and the stars align. Let’s look at this scenario. You have a Seagate Oracle on the field and are attacking the opponent. Let’s say that they try to block your attacking creature with 3 1/1’s which should trade your 1/3 for one of their 1/1’s. You activate Giant Growth and make your 1/3 a 4/6 which saves your creature (+1), and kills 2 more of theirs that they were not expecting to die, (+2). Let’s add this up. 1+2-1 = +2. You just turned your presumably -1 card into a +2 by seeing the signs and playing the card at the right time.
Cancel is a counterspell which can be considered a 0 because you are basically trading 1 card out of your hand for 1 card out of theirs when they try to play it. That’s all fine and dandy but counterspells can do more than that because they can also prevent card advantage from the opponent. Let’s say for instance that they try to play a Grave Titan which would grant them the titan as well as 2 2/2’s for a total of +2 just by playing it. It then can potentially attack and add another +2 to its value (no wonder Grave Titan is so often the go to for black). With such a card economy engine on the field you can quickly find yourself behind. Let’s say though that you play Cancel and counter their Grave Titan. You took 1 card out of their hand for 1 of yours with starts as a 0 value but you also prevent an immediate +2 from the opponent making the Cancel you just played a +2 and potentially better if they would have gotten off an attack or two with the titan.
Another source of good card advantage is a field wipe like Day of Judgment which can net you +1, +2, +3 cards depending on the board position when it’s played. Other cards that offer you advantages are things like Jace's Ingenuity which are an instant +2 when you play it, and Planeswalkers which give you constant advantage as long as they stay on the field.
Magic is a game about options. The more options you have, the better off you will be because you will have more answers to the things that the opponent throws at you than they have things to throw, and they will likely not have an answer to your slung stone. Just be sure to glance over any deck you make and be sure that your deck has a positive card economy unless you are going a completely tempo based strategy. You might be surprised to find how positive the good stable decks are in terms of card economy.
This is my first article so I hope that it was insightful. Please let me know hope you liked it and if you have any questions please do not hesitate to ask.
Epochalyptik says... #2
I like my 0-advantage cards... They let me kill things...
Reminds me of something I recently started saying in posts on decks. I think I used the term "card value" for creatures, which was basically the mana overhead compared to the P/T of the given creature and the relevance of any of itss abilities.
I like the article though. You could go much deeper if you wanted to talk about theoretical economics of cards, meaning the advantages they give that aren't necessarily tangible. Blue would probably annihilate the other colors in that category because of the dig spells like Ponder and Preordain , but I suppose that is also relevant to the strategy of the player using them.
August 28, 2011 10:57 a.m.
You don't consider life points valuable, which is a mistake, if they didn't have value how can a burn deck win? The first few lifepoints are worthless but once you get low their value exponentially increases, when you have 3 life that lightning bolt is worth INFINITE value because once you lose it is impossible for you to get closer to winning, so angel's mercy gains you the life of >2 lightning bolts, while usually just delaying the inevitable and that there are better options out there if you are at 1 life it becomes damn useful (not that i advocate such a shitty card). I am also unsure why you didn't cite this article as explaining the theory of card advantage.
August 28, 2011 11:35 a.m.
@Epochalyptik here is an article by aj sacher going into depth the theory you "discovered" http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/misc/18929_Reintroducing_Stock_Mana.html
August 28, 2011 11:38 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #5
I didn't claim to discover it. Better players than I were understanding these concepts when I was in diapers. I was merely finding a way to express easier.
August 28, 2011 11:43 a.m.
I wasn't saying you did, but i wasn't sure the proper word for thinking about something that already exist, sorry if it came off as accusatory
August 28, 2011 11:45 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #7
No worries. I don't know that there is ever a "proper" word for it because it can fall under so many categories (card economy, creature efficiency, etc.). But that's what's great about Magic: there's so many interconnected theories and concepts that to play technically correctly and to the best of you and your deck's ability, you need to understand them.
August 28, 2011 11:50 a.m.
Wouldn't Archive Trap be like 13 preemtive Doom Blade s, by your logic that Duress is 1?
August 28, 2011 12:06 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #9
Duress is far more likely to interfere with the opponent's strategy, since it removes a card from their hand that they were, until that point, likely planning around/with during the match. With Archive Trap , it's kind of an indiscriminate 13. It doesn't really matter because it just takes random cards off the library. There's no strategy or calculation - they could all be lands, they could all be combo pieces, but they don't affect the flow like Duress does because what they hit is randomly determined by library's order, which is randomly determined by shuffling, which is random.
August 28, 2011 12:14 p.m.
I wasn't saying that Archive Trap didn't have it's uses but unless it's effecting something that the opponent actually has (which they don't in it's case because they have yet to draw the cards) Then it's technically a -1 because you gain no actual card economy, or value (same idea, different wording) as omgyoav stated. The whole point is that yes, you could hit 2 Grave Titan s in the trap but you are just as likely to hit 8 lands, 3 filter cards and 2 counterspells as hit 1 grave and then what if their next card is the titan, and they were waiting for a finisher? You just helped them draw it. It generates no advantage, it is however an amazing tempo card if you are running mill.
I do consider Life Points valuable, very valuable, but mostly as a resource. That's actually what my next article was going to be about if this one goes over well enough. Life gain cards are tempo cards. You are slowing your clock down so that you can survive long enough to gain advantage but technically like the Archive Trap they are -1 cards in terms of card advantage, no matter how good they are for your tempo.
The point of the article was to give players some complex deck building skills and potentially some play skills as well. If you get in the mindset for card advantage while building a deck and why playing it, you become better, no matter what kind of deck you are playing. That's my goal here.
There is nothing wrong with playing 0 value cards, most cards will be 0 value. What I'm advising against is running a bunch of -1, -2 cards because if you fill your deck with cards that lose you advantage, over the course of the game, you will have an empty field, and an empty hand while the opponent will be pretty much set.
0 value cards keep you and your opponent even, thus, they are fine to play. If you are running 4 card:Angel's Mercy, chances are, unless your deck is very synergistic to lifegain, like say soul sisters, the only deck you will beat consistently is a deck like RDW and that's only because RDW is a tempo orientated deck and lifegain slows down RDW's tempo significantly.
I appreciate the comments so please keep the coming. I hope that I have helped someone with these concepts. Try them out for a while and see if your game does not improve.
Would anyone be interested in reading another article from me about resource control? Interested in hearing about something else other than that?
August 28, 2011 2:38 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #11
I'm primarily a control player these days, so cards like archive trap, doom blade and duress all have more value to me because I want to rid the board of threats and potential threats while leaving my board relatively empty and harmless until I am ready to strike.
I say this because for me every card either has a utility or it does not. In the same vein as you mentioned goblin piker being vanilla. Some players might find that 2/1 body a good utility for their deck because they want a cheap body or they know they have ways to make a seemingly innocuous target lethal suddenly. However, I find no utility in goblin piker or most creatures that have no "abilities".
This may come as no surprise to people who have seen my decks, or played against me, but a creature for me has to serve a greater purpose. It has to ETB into something that benefits my game scheme, or it has to have something it can be used for over and over again like a royal assassin.
I am also addicted to anything that wipes the board of creatures. I especially like All is dust because it forces sacrifices rather than destroys which is extra fun.
I surely buy in to your idea of card economy in the sense that each card carries with it some amount of gained advantage in cards. Although each card is only as strong as the situation it is played it. Grave Titan is great as you mentioned, but it requires the resources to play it and a strategy to get to the later game to be able to drop it and have it dominate the board.
Cards like duress, IoK, despise, distress, mind rot are all very powerful for trading card advantages, but they can all easily become dead draws in your hand as well.
So while giving a card a economical value rank is easy to do when imagining where that card shines it is equally important to remember that all cards in magic have potential under the right circumstances.
August 28, 2011 4:28 p.m.
"The term card economy refers to how much value you get out of a said card" the issue is you just seem to break that concept. You consider value either a. board presence or b. manipulating number of cards in hand through discard/draw. If they hit you with 2 lightning bolts and you cast an rest for the wear (less shitty card)you have negated 2 of their cards with one of yours, your view is too limited.
August 28, 2011 5:27 p.m.
Not limited, just emphasizing differing points. Remember, this is my first article in a series of them potentially. Also remember that I am a control player by and large so while I understand the concept of tempo, I also see the importance for card advantage.
In your example omgyoav, using the 2 lightning bolts in the way you described gave them an instant -2, so yes, your -1 in Rest for the Weary negated both of their -1's and netted you a total of +1 in comparison to them without giving them the tempo they desired. This only works if they are playing a tempo deck that does not care about card economy.
I'm not saying that life gain is bad in and of itself but lets say that they have a Sun Titan on the board and hit you, bringing back a tectonic edge. That 8 life will give you a -1 and maybe buy you a turn while next turn they swing again, pretty much negating your life gain, and bring back a Sea Gate Oracle for +2 without playing a card from their hand or using any mana. Suddenly you are top decking and hoping for an answer to their finisher while they probably have 2 counterspells in their hand, waiting to counterspell your answer when you finally draw it... at that point, the game is already over where as if you had drawn removal like Journey to Nowhere the threat would be gone, you would have net yourself 0 rather than -1, and you would be in a much better position.
A better card to run in the deck if you want the life gain would be Timely Reinforcements because it not only gives you the life you want to reset the tempo, it also gives you an automatic +2 which the Rest for the Weary does not.
I agree completely with you. Every card has it's place in the game. I wasn't trying to imply otherwise. I agree that vanilla creatures are about worthless now a days unless they are vastly under costed for their p/t or something But in draft they are great. I was trying to assign value to every card though and I think it was a good example to start off with. I also agree that in some situations, some cards are dead. In this article I'm not taking that into consideration, that's for a later article about resource control.
Basically, all that I'm saying is examine every card in your deck and decide if you can gain any advantage from it. If the answer is no, chances are, there is a better card for that slot which will do what you want.
Also, it's important to watch how you play a card. It might be tempting to Lightning Bolt their face for 3 (and in some situations it is the right move) but mightn't that card be better used by killing that Vampire Nighthawk that will just gain them their life back? Always look for the best way to use a card, preferably one that will net you some advantage or at least keep them from gaining any on you, tempo or card economy wise.
August 28, 2011 6:28 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #15
nobody lightning bolts my vampire nighthawk and expects me to take it lying down!!!
that's the kind of move that will make powerful enemies! haha
August 28, 2011 6:38 p.m.
Lol, I'll keep that in mind.
Vampire Nighthawk would be so good if bolt didn't exist in the format with it...
August 28, 2011 6:42 p.m.
...i mean no offense, but what random ass situation did you create, you took my specific example and used it in a completely different scenario, stop being an idiot. I am not sure you understand the definition of tempo the way you described it but now. All I am trying to say is that you not considering life a resource is bad. What is the point of a card being negative card economy if it is awesome (lightning bolt), attempting to state a theory about a game IGNORING the way the game is actually won or lost is ridiculous. You say net cards, without describing what a card is worth. There is a reason decks run preordain instead of divination even though one is 0 and the other is a +1
August 28, 2011 6:50 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #18
um. hhaha. a little crazy seeped in here.
i merely look at the CMC of a card to know if I would play it or not. that's all it boils down to sometimes. do i get value for what i need on that turn from that card? clearly divination and preordain are in different classes because one is on turn 1 one is not. case closed.
let's leave the crazy at the door. ;)
August 28, 2011 8:33 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #19
lifegain always feels a bit boring to me unless it is attached to a creature like wurmcoil engine, or vault skirge. then it feels fun.
i guess that's why white is ranked 3/5 on my color pecking order.
August 28, 2011 8:37 p.m.
@omgyoav: Actually, he took your example and described it in terms of what the article was ACTUALLY about. It seems that the economy of many cards is largely situational (take any Wrath effect for example, where you could end up +5 against your opponent's zombie saproling army, or -2 because you needed to take out a Baneslayer who was going right over the heads of your soldiers) and when you provided a situation where that card gave you advantage, he countered with a situation where it does not. Also, I would wait for Mpz5 to actually do an article or say anything about tempo before judging his comprehension or otherwise of the subject.
@Mpz5: Cool article =).
August 28, 2011 10:19 p.m.
He used tempo in context incorrectly multiple times, I realize what he did but it did not make sense with what he said in his article, giving a lifegain spell a -1, he did not call it varied, he mentioned other cards with variable advantages, this was not one of them
August 28, 2011 10:50 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #22
how about...who cares. it's his article, you have your opinion. you are a critic. let's move on now. nothing can be gained from this rhetoric.you have one opinion and the author has another. neither side can win.
or you can ignore me and argue the semantics of this until you are both blue in the face and hate each other with venomous, seething, corrupted passion.
August 28, 2011 11 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #23
wait wait. can you guys wait while I go chop some more wood? We are running out of kindling.
August 28, 2011 11:08 p.m.
Thanks Siegfried
Again, you misunderstand my point. I'm not saying that Lightning Bolt is a bad card by any means. Lightning Bolt is one of the best cards in the game in my opinion.
It's also not inherently a -1 like you stated. Most of the time, a good player will turn a lightning bolt into a 0 or a +1 (in the case of hitting and killing a creature when they target it with an enchantment to fizzle the enchantment and kill the creature with 1 bolt). It's only a -1 if you go for the dome and it's really only a good idea to do that if it's lethal or if you need to kill off a planeswalker IMO.
As far as the situation I gave you, you were the one throwing out situations first. I countered with what I felt was an extremely valid one (evidently you do not play against much control in your meta to think otherwise).
Yes, there are times when any card can be an all star. I do not deny that, nor do I expect anyone else to; however, what I'm getting at is that loading your deck with cards that typically go -X in terms of card economy will not get you very far unless the deck is entirely tempo based. Even such decks tend to not be consistent because they either quickly win or lose depending on their draw.
The Tempo I am referring to is the damage race on the board. Basically, if I am reaching the goal of dropping you to 0 life faster than you are, then I am ahead on tempo because if it goes that way long enough I'll win. Usually tempo decks have an all in strategy and a single incident like a board wipe or massive life gain will wreck them because the other player will have time to stabilize and control the tempo... If this is not what you refer to as tempo I don't know what to tell you but that's what I'm taking about. I hope my explanation clarifies my meanings for you.
Also, your life total is probably your most important resource. I know this and have pretty much stated this so I'm not sure why you think I'm ignoring the life total. As a control player I see every quantifiable thing as a resource, my life total included. Every time I allow an attacker through rather than utilize a counter on my Tumble Magnet , I am making a calculated evaluation of the resource of my life and how much of it is expendable.
About Preordain , Quiver hit the nail on the head. Why pay 3 for a +1 when you can play 1 for a 0 that allows you to set yourself up? The question then becomes: would you play it if it didn't draw a card?
I don't appreciate being called an idiot. I have not attacked you during this whole debate and i would appreciate it if you would give me the same respect. It's fine to disagree, to disagree is human. It's not cool to textually assault someone over a disagreement that really boils down to a misunderstanding. I see your points, they are valid and in line to what I believe. I just think that you misunderstand what I'm saying. That's all.
August 28, 2011 11:19 p.m.
Yup yup!
So, out of curiosity... What happens to people that Lightning Bolt your Vampire Nighthawk ?
August 28, 2011 11:42 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #28
I attack them relentlessly in games, even in free-for-all games, where I no business attacking them until they cry tears in each of the five mana color and refer to me as their planeswalker lord.
If they do not acquiesce, I will then start attack them with my magic card creatures even when we are not engaged in a battle telling them the status of their mortal health by indicating how close to zero they are on an over-sized D20.
If that doesn't work, I'll just crack open some beers until I forget about it, and wait to play the following week.
August 28, 2011 11:48 p.m.
Sounds fair to me... I have to admit that I was expecting something along the lines of "I'll imprint it on one of my 4 mimic vats on the field and beat your face with them anyway."
You know it screams of you...
August 28, 2011 11:51 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #30
YES. Well that is more likely what actually happensin in 70% of games with my creatures.
but I wanted to take it to the next level.
Your suspicions are correct. My group groans whenever I put Mimic vat on the stack these days.
In fact if someone duresses my hand and they have options to take some really good card like gideon jura, but i also have mimic vat in hand, they may make me lose that just to aggrevate me.
Some friends.
August 28, 2011 11:59 p.m.
theemptyquiver says... #31
The most mimic vats I've ever had out at once was three, and then board wipes really got fun.
Usually I have at least 1.
August 29, 2011 midnight
Epochalyptik says... #32
I remember when my friends started hating Vat out of my hand. Just because last game I topdecked all of my Doom Blade s and imprinted someone's Wurmcoil Engine with the first one...
August 29, 2011 12:01 a.m.
Vat get's nassssty with sundial. Check out my sundial deck in my profile. It tied for 1st last extended tourney.
August 29, 2011 12:03 a.m.
theemptyquiver says... #34
haha @ epoch. Don't you just love that? Nothing like taking someone's giant win-condition creature and slamming them up the arse with it.
Also nice about taking high spot in the tourney. (checking it out now.)
August 29, 2011 12:12 a.m.
The problem is that Magic is such a complex system that it's hard to theorize coherently without sounding like a pretentious ass or someone who is vastly oversimplifying. That's why these sort of articles are frustrating for me. A card that said 'target player discards his or her hand; then you lose 15 life' would be great by these standards, whereas a card that said 'target opponent mills 30 cards, then draws a card' would be terrible.
On a more specific note, I have to weigh in on this whole Archive Trap thing. Even though it's random, the fact that you are reducing the probability that an opponent will draw a copy of any of the milled cards has to be understood as a type of value. Assuming a rational opponent, who put each card in his / her deck for a reason, that's a very valuable tool.
There will never be a grand theory of Magic -- the key to getting better is to observe actual lines of play.
August 29, 2011 7:34 a.m.
Well, I would normally go on a rant here with such fuel to go on. But I won't.
All I'll say is that every card has it's use, every card can be stopped in it's tracks, every deck can be beaten, etc etc.
And regarding lifegain, I only like it with Sanguine Bond . I'd rather make a use of it than just save myself for a turn or 2.
August 29, 2011 8:47 a.m.
@weterr123 sounds like me RE: "every card has it's use"
August 29, 2011 11:13 a.m.
I must confess I did not read all the posts. Very tired today... -yawn- :)
August 29, 2011 11:22 a.m.
@KorSplicer, equipment are usually 0's but are pretty decent ones because it pumps any creature you happen to stick. At the same time, if you can't keep a creature on the field, it's useless. If the creature you can keep just happens to be Puresteel Paladin , then they all become +1's. It really depends on the deck in question and I would never run even half as much equipment as creatures to equip them to.
@weterr123 and squire1 , I agree that every card has a use. I also agree with the lifegain. Unless it does something else for you, it's usually better to play something that impacts the board or hand unless you are bringing it in from the side against a quick, tempo based deck. At that point, they have lost a ton of card advantage so you losing a little to disrupt their tempo will not hurt at all.
@landot, I agree with you. This is an oversimplification. There is value to any card (more to some than others though), but not always card economy. This article was mainly talking about card economy/card advantage.
As I said, I will touch on value in another article when I get the chance. I think that article, and this one combined will better explain my, and most players theorys about what cards are good, and what cards are bad to newer/less competitive players.
August 29, 2011 5:51 p.m.
buddha1533 says... #42
I very much see ur point and agree (yes even on the Lightning Bolt , Archive Trap and life gain. as far as this articles subject I think u were spot on. I am curious what value u might give Doubling Season (one of my all time favorite cards)
August 30, 2011 2:44 a.m.
Jarrod_0067 says... #43
Doubling Season has a domain = (-1, infinite), meaning it can be a dead draw and useless, or it can make lots of tokens. It depends on the situation.
The Rock is a deck based around card advantage. It uses cards like Acidic Slime (that essentially are +1, killing off 2 permanents).
Vengevine is great because it keeps coming back, usually trading for a 3/3 which can buy you a turn or two. Essentially an aggressive removal spell or 4 damage to the face.
Frost Titan is at worst a 0. His first ability makes him not only hard to remove, but usually makes him a delayed Silence because players often tap out to kill him the turn after he hits the table.
That's another thing. Mana. If you can Mana Drain an opponent, in any way, you are instantly better off. If a control player is tapped out you can drop a fatty without it being countered. Likewise, destroying lands or mana fixers can set players back 2 to 3 turns until they draw another, but by then it's usually gg.
Lets not forget the ol' faithful mechanic, Cascade. This is why Jund worked. Essentially, Bloodbraid Elf into Blightning is +1 card advantage initially, but that's 6 damage if they don't block the elf, or guaranteed 3 life lost and a removal spell if it is blocked, making the play essentially a +2 advantage whilst getting you 3 points closer to gg
August 30, 2011 10:08 a.m.
popeyroach says... #44
without meaning an disrespect, I think your way of valuing cards can be counter-productive, especially for a new player reading this. this way of thinking makes Mind Rot look better than most cards in standard, and wpuld make it an obvious pick over Doom Blade in a draft, when any experienced player would know to te the doom blade every time. likewise it makes cards that are terrivle most of the time, Mind Unbound for example, seem very valuable when they are not.I think if you're going to write an article analysing card value it would be very helpful to do so whilst taking mana cost into considerartion, as well as obvious aspects like level of control, (Despise is better than Mind Rot ) overall effectiveness (both despise and mind rot are better than Monomania ), and versatility (Doom Blade will be better in more situations than Incinerate ).
August 30, 2011 3:16 p.m.
@popeyroach: I do agree. Like I said, this is not intended as a stand alone article. Just 1 in a series.
For everyone wondering, I'm planning on writing about:
Resources, their uses and what exactly is a resource.
and
Value of cards and quantifiable things beyond card advantage like tempo and information.
as well as anything else people would like to read about.
I'm not saying that I'm the best player/deck builder there is, but I know that I'm good enough to help people out with some basic and advanced concepts of the game. This one was just to get people started into thinking in the right mindset when building a deck. If you don't analyze the cards that you are running, you can't expect the deck to be consistent. That's what I'm getting at. Card economy, in my opinion, is one of the most important things to consider when deck building.
August 30, 2011 5:22 p.m.
platinum_demon says... #46
What would the card economy of Arcanis the Omnipotent be?
August 30, 2011 7:05 p.m.
platinum_demon says... #47
What would the card economy of Arcanis the Omnipotent be?
August 30, 2011 7:05 p.m.
Arcanis the Omnipotent would be at least a 0 because a creature would require some way to remove it.
If you bounced it in response to a removal spell then he becomes a +1, if you are able to tap him he becomes an instant +3 every time he's tapped. Amazing card in terms of card economy.
August 30, 2011 9:18 p.m.
In your opinion, which has a higher value, Mind Rot or Divination ?
September 1, 2011 4:19 a.m.
It depends on the situation. If they are holding 2 cards in hand, and you have card advantage already, Mind Rot is brutal because chances are they have been playing around those 2 cards in their hands.
If you are down cards,Divination might help you dig yourself out of the hole you are in as well as give you more options.
If you get full effect out of both cards they are both +1's so neither are horrible to run. Value wise however, Duress or one if it's ilk are better than Mind Rot because it gives you options and information that the other doesn't, even if it is a 0 rather than a +1.
September 1, 2011 5:05 p.m.
buddha1533 says... #53
hmmmm me thinks I want this Arcanis the Omnipotent
September 2, 2011 1:22 a.m.
I think maybe the term "versatility" may be a more applicable term than "economy" for the purpose of this article.
Versatility refers to the ability of a card to be utilized in more than one way, factoring in the overall cost of using the alternate method. Casting cost, mana requirements, need to sac another permanent, or even pay life, should all be considered for this overall cost.
The number of tricks (combos or otherwise) that a card can be part of should also be considered.
Maybe someone could create a table with the factors that should be used to determine card economy? Any volunteers?
September 2, 2011 8:01 a.m.
Well no, "versatility" has nothing to do with what this article is about. "Advantage" might be a little clearer, but this article refers purely to the direct loss or gain of cards you can use, relative to cards your opponent can use.
As Mpz5 has to continually say, there will be other articles in the series explaining other aspects of card value, including how "versatile" a card can be.
September 2, 2011 8:46 a.m.
Toddington says... #57
What does Merfolk Looter sit in terms of economy? Repeated draw is godly right, but the discarding means you never actual get card advantage, just filtering and losing dead draws?
September 5, 2011 4:53 p.m.
It's a 0 but it has great value as a filter card.
It's not a -1 so feel free to load your deck up with them if you need the filter, it will not hurt your decks card economy at all.
September 5, 2011 5:22 p.m.
You say feel free to load up your deck on it, because it is not a -1, but card economy is so flawed it really shouldn't be an indicator of what goes in your deck. Brb im going to go load up on force of wills and -1 myself into legacy
September 6, 2011 12:51 a.m.
Idk if this was already covered, but what would you consider equipments, in particular to SoFaF?
September 6, 2011 1:30 p.m.
@omgyoav, Minus 1's are not always bad if they have enough tempo impact or are part of a combo. You'll are aware that most legacy decks are full of +1's and higher as well right? The ones that are not are tempo decks or lightning quick combo decks.
All I'm saying is that if the guy wants Merfolk Looter in his deck, and he was concerned about card economy, it's nothing to worry about.
@smiley, SoFaF is a 0 to start with, if you get a hit off, it's also a huge tempo swing as well as a +1. That's each hit you score... From a card economy, as well as a card value standpoint, it's amazing.
September 6, 2011 5:11 p.m.
What is the point of something having a negative rating if it doesn't not define it as bad, just based on principle if a -1 is better than a 0 your system is wrong.
September 6, 2011 11:03 p.m.
Not from a card economy perspective it's not.
Usually, meaningful -1's are huge tempo swings.
Basically, if you are going to run a -1 over a 0 or +1, make sure that it actually has a big enough impact on the game state to warrant it's use. That is something we will get into when we start talking about Card Value.
Again, this article is just about card economy.
September 7, 2011 5:06 p.m.
There is only one way to handle this debate:
DDR off!
Off to the arcade!
Seriously guys. It's silly to argue about this.
This was an interesting article for me because I never considered card economy before, I just saw a card for it's use and that was it. It helped me become a better magic player. So thank you, Mpz5, for writing the article.
September 7, 2011 10:32 p.m.
I agree with the silliness. Points were made, points were rebutted, enough is enough. I'll agree to disagree with you omgyoav because I don't think either one of us are going to give. We are both too muleish for our own good.
Well, I'm glad that you found it insightful Leafs_suck. Hopefully my future articles will be as illuminating to you as this one was.
As far as the tiebreaker goes... can we do something more relevant like play a game of magic... while playing Table Tennis?
I suck at DDR but I'm pretty sure that I could own at the other.
September 7, 2011 10:59 p.m.
Joshwarudd says... #69
Insightful article that I enjoyed. What I think people fail to realize is that an economically bad card does not translate into just a bad card. It appears that some people don't take time to think about what they read, where in many cases some higher level thinking and inference is necessary for complete understanding of what you are reading.
mozerdozer says... #1
Planeswalker all have a card economy of 2 - 4 depending on the amount of drawing they allow. Garruk, Primal Hunter has a card value of 6. He's a card himself, he makes a beast, he draws 3. That totals to 6. Consecrated Sphinx is also insanely good in card value. That's why those two cards are mythics and the most expensive control cards in standard.
As for over all article feel, I'd say this primarily lets one understand control and card advantage, whether it be MBC through devaluing opponent's cards, or WG, UB, or UW where maintaining a high hand size is key.
August 28, 2011 9:54 a.m.