optionsSimic Manipulator , or Simic Charm or Nimbus Swimmer.

I like the Nimbus Swimmer he has the potential to evolve every creature on our board, or to be a late game bomb. Manipulator is a hard to cast crappy creature with an ability that i think is hard to utilize. charm is solid but not sure it is better than swimmer.

There is a distinct lack of Boros here after going a fully around the table. There is also a plethora of really good simic here.

Simic Charm, Nimbus Swimmer, and Simic Manipulator are the contenders here.

I'm personally favoring the Nimbus Swimmer with Simic Charm a close second.

Nimbus Swimmer, although this was a tricky one for me.

Nimbus Swimmer is my vote. But I'd be OK with Simic Charm. Good lord that rare is terrible.

Voting for Nimbus Swimmer, though Simic Charm would also be fine.

Nimbus Swimmer I really don't like passing over the manipulator or the charm but Nimbus Swimmer is a great card especially if the games get stalled out we can pump all our mana into it to make it big and trigger the evolve of everything else.

A second Nimbus Swimmer is just going to be good for us early, mid, and late game. Let's take the flying swimmer!

Simic Manipulator. It can easily take over a game if our opponent doesn't deal with it immediately. On a side note, if there is another Simic Player here, I wonder what was so good they passed us those three cards . . .

Simic Manipulator might be good in a constructed deck using Scavenge and whatnot. He's terrible in limited.

I would love to pick up another Simic Charm. It's like Vines of Vastwood got tangled up with an Unsummon. It can save our creatures a number of ways and punish our opponents for letting them through. It's just.... REEEALLLY good.

But I'll take Nimbus Swimmer and hope for another charm in pack 3.

Dang, is this the 8th pick of the pack or the first? There's...a lot of Simic here!

I like Nimbus Swimmer, but I have found through playing with it that it can often end up being pretty disappointing, and far too slow. Four mana for a flying 2/2, that sort of thing. I like it enough to be happy that we already have one, but I think picking up a second is a mistake.

Simic Manipulator is one of my favorite cards in the set, and is actually insanely powerful in a solidly Simic deck. I think it's one of those cards that are easy to dismiss by thinking it's only narrowly useful, but I have seen it win games. That said, double blue might actually be hard for us, since we keep picking decent (but unallied) white cards that we want to play, so maybe he isn't the greatest pick here. I would pick him, but this being a community effort, I'll leave him for now.

Unlike with Nimbus Swimmer, I'd love to have a second Simic Charm. That is exactly the sort of card you would want multiples of. Pick this card please. It is awesome and cheap and versatile and doesn't require a Gyre Sage in play to be used to its full potential.

Pick: Simic Charm

Agh, I really like both the Simic Charm and Nimbus Swimmer here. I feel like we could use another Simic Charm even more than the Swimmer, though.

First: there's Hexproof at instant speed. We can protect our existing permanents from any kind of targeted removal that an opponent may be relying on.

Second: it's an Unsummon if we need to bounce something mean to waste those pesky auras or remove a potential blocker.

Third: It's a Giant Growth if we already have a flyer out and swinging, making them very deadly. Or just beefing up a blocker to kill off someone's prized creature.

Simic Charm has amazing versatility in my opinion.

Nimbus Swimmer. I will never be sad to see one of those in my hand. Early game it's efficient board presence and late game it will power through and straight up win the game.

Simic Charm is really good, but having creatures for combat is way more relevant than having combat tricks.

I feel like everyone is writing off the Simic Manipulator, but taking an opponents Syndic of Tithes or other extort creature, most of which are rather small in power, only helps us with another win con in limited. Then the ability to steal and then Rapid Hybridization a creature to evolve our creatures and remove one of their's can be devastating. Currently 11 of our drafted creatures evolve him with a big enough swimmer making 12, not to mention Ivy Lane Denizen could add some as well. Maybe I'm crazy cause I'm still a little new at this, but that's my thought.

• Simic Manipulator, gets the nod with Simic Charm a close second.

I made some good plays with Simic Manipulator, Agoraphobia and Bioshift in limited, but considering our cardpool i wouldn't pass up Nimbus Swimmer or Simic Charm for it. I vote for the charm. Damn, why couldn't one of these uncommons have been in the pack we got before this one?

umm stacked as hell. Nobody else is in simic unless there was like a foil something awesome. Take the charm It is best.

Having played around with the Simic release deck, I'd say take the Nimbus Swimmer. Do not ever underestimate lategame universal evolve. Especially with our pack of Shamblesharks coming along nicely and some fun battalion options, this guy could be a drop, attack, win.

Nimbus Swimmer, although the simic manipulator is tempting, but he just doesn't synergize as well as the swimmer does with what we have already. I love charms, but i think we're just going to have to give this one up. I wouldn't be opposed to grabbing any of those three cards.

Simic Charm. If you play combat tricks correctly in limited, they can be just as good as removal.

Simic Manipulator although fun and having potential, is not the best for us at 3 mana, it can be dominant with Burst of Strength or Forced Adaptation, but the fact that it is a three drop, has to remove counters to take control, takes control in terms of power which makes it take 3 turns to get the turn 2 skyjek, and we have neither Burst of Strength or Forced Adaptation. Simic Charm is probably what we want as it has the most utility, Nimbus Swimmer close second.

Simic Charm

with the way our decks going, I think we need as many high value creatures as we can get. Nimbus Swimmer is definitely a HIGH value creature. early game it can be good and late game it can be great, but its real value is being a controllable evolve enabler. the simic charm is nice, but it just doesn't have as much potential as the swimmer in my eyes. that being said i wouldnt be too upset if we did take the charm. the manipulator on the other hand, is downright awful.

my vote is for sure Nimbus Swimmer

Simic Charm. Nimbus Swimmer is too expensive, and the versatility is amazing.

I could see Simic Manipulator working nicely followed by a miracled Blessings of Nature or Increasing Savagery, of which I see neither available.

Nimbus Swimmer could be a nice draw in mid/late game situations, but for sheer utility value I'll have to go with Simic Charm.

I have to go with the Simic Charm. We need some spells as well as creatures, but I'd say that the Nimbus Swimmer loses out just a bit in terms of power. The charm can do so much for us, even evolve if we bounce one of our own creatures to save it. It's just so good... we need as many copies as possible.

Wow, if only one of these choices had been in the last pack.

I am very happy to see a Simic Manipulator this low. Let's grab that sucker!

Nimbus Swimmer is probably about the same as Charm in terms of usefulness, but also directly wins the game for us as well as tying down the skies, unlike Charm. Swimmer all the way.

I just read the other comments. Interesting debate. Here's a question I think we should all consider: How much does X have to be for Nimbus Swimmer to be a good casting value? I'm thinking minimum 5, for a total cc of 7. And we have one of these guys already. Thoughts on that...?

Nimbus Swimmer is good for anything more than X=2. The flexibility is worth something too. Obviously bigger is better, though. The Charm is tempting as well, since it's an extremely useful spell, but a flying creature that doubles as a lategame bomb takes precedent in my book.

I am voting Simic Manipulator... Consistency is nice but Simic Manipulator is a game changer...

I feel like we're doing okay on creatures so far, and we have a pack left to go. We need some support, and no better choice in this pack but the Simic Charm.

If we had a Agoraphobia or had a very good chance of getting one later I would say go for the Simic Manipulator. Since we don't have one and can't count on one I say we go for the Simic Charm. It just can do so much for us that it would take too long to list all the possibilities.

Nimbus Swimmer

Simic Charm choice 2

Simic Manipulator is not a guarantee to work well. Yeah, he needs some time. The charm would be the safe choice, in that we can be pretty sure we could use it for something. But it's not a game-changer.

However the upside potential of the Manipulator is BIG. He can flat out put us in board control. And we don't have anything like that going for us so far. I think it would be unwise to pass on the chance at getting this. We've been passed a good rare in our guild, late in the pack. We got lucky with that. We should take it.

Simic Charm because it can help in several ways and is also an answer to your opponent trying to save their creature with Martial Glory and Nimbus Swimmer close 2nd.

I'm really torn. If we come across an Agoraphobia, Simic Manipulator becomes amazing. Btw, told y'all so with Forced Adaptation... But the simic charm is like Giant Growth and Unsummon had a baby.

Vote: Simic Charm

i never even thought of agoraphobia + manipulator combo, that's gross. Requires all of zero +1/+1 counters to swipe an enemy unit ><

If it's worth anything to the vote, my roomate just saw the pick options and was like "holy crap grab the Nimbus Swimmer". Its ability to crush face mid to late game is unparalleled.

Imho: Simic Charm > Nimbus Swimmer > Simic Manipulator.

I'm torn, really.

We haven't been making the ideal simic draft deck to this point - 1 Cloudfin Raptor, no Experiment One, no Elusive Krasis, no Crocanura, no Slaughterhorn, no Scab-Clan Charger, no Leyline Phantom (though we're crossing our fingers that the one from P2p1 will wheel back next pick), and we have what isn't quite a white splash, but instead a bant deck. Were we straight Simic, I would have said Nimbus Swimmer, as we would be looking to push 20 creatures, and the swimmer is a good card for triggering evolve as well being flying beats in the late game.

But.

As it stands, we're looking at a draft deck that is mixing things up with some solid white in double Frontline Medic, and we need more tricks - 1x each of Rapid Hybridization, Simic Charm and Hydroform isn't going to cut it.

But.

That's the second time we've seen a Simic Charm come round late, and there's a fair chance of seeing one next pack.

My vote is for Simic Charm.

Manipulator is generally bad, sadly - whenever he pops up in drafts round here, he will almost always table, as everyone has tried him, and everyone has been disappointed.

Simic Charm will do more for our deck at this point than the swimmer. would be awesome to get a shot at both, but sadly this pack went the wrong way around the table. based off what cards we have been seeing boros and orzhov are getting drafted pretty hard. I would much rather have a two mana answer to the fast decks than a late game X threat. Simic Charm

I've already voted for Simic Charm, but since it is coming down very close I would like to point out that Nimbus Swimmer is really expensive early game. 3 mana for a 1/1 flyer. For that mana we have much better choices, like Drakewing Krasis.

I do like the swimmer for late game when we could perhaps afford to drop 5 mana on a 3/3 flyer... but I really feel a 2 mana versatile instant will be much more likely to keep us alive throughout the entire game, especially early game.

Not to mention, I often find decks with all their threats face-up on the table are easy to predict. Any decent opponent isn't going to blunder combat phase in a situation like that. Shambleshark is one nice trick, but Simic Charm will really milk mistakes out of an opponent.

if we get enough Shambleshark and Simic Charm we can terrorize people with two open mana. if we pass turn with one card in hand and two open mana the other player doesn't know if they will see a Giant Growth, an Unsummon, mass hexproof, or a 2/1 flash fish.

I think Simic Charm is great, don't get me wrong. But, I think we need to remember a couple things. First, BREAD and then second, look at our deck. Nimbus Swimmer isn't a card we want to be playing on turn three (even though we could!). With the Gyre Sage and a lot of 2 and 3 drop creatures, having 2x Nimbus Swimmers means they're our BOMB (which we currently have zero of!)

Think about our matchups. We're going to be trading a lot with boros, and it'll be a tough matchup. What is Simic Charm going to do in most of those cases? Save one of our creatures or maybe bounce a dude to turn off battalion. I'd rather trade until turn 7 or 8 until we're out of their comfort zone then drop our 5/5+ flyer to win the game. Versus Orzhov, we're going to try to overwhelm them and we want as many guys swinging every turn as possible.

Simic Charm is a lot of tricks rolled into one and versatile. But, Nimbus Swimmer is a versatile bomb. Always take a bomb over a trick.

Replugging my vote for Nimbus Swimmer

Used the right way, Simic Charm is very nearly removal, especially on something like a drakewing krasis. Honestly I feel like a second swimmer would fall under evasive instead of bomb.

@ exarkun809 WE ALREADY HAVE ONE Nimbus Swimmer

sorry caps

@TheBearShaker (just being silly) "flash fish flash fish flash fish" is as hard to say as it is to type.

I'm not completely sure. But our pilot may prefer more methods of trickery than a straight up flyer.

I'm changing my vote to Simic Charm

@TheBearShaker Ya, I knew we had picked one already. Sorry, I guess I should have said we have one 'bomb' so far. Going from 1 to 2 helps consistency without having to worry about having 'too many'.

@Sweet-Nightmare I agree that the charm can become removal. I just really think that we're going to be playing creatures most every turn from t2-t5 and I HOPE we won't have open mana. Then what would you rather have in hand after turn 6? I think the swimmer is evasion, but he can quickly become a bomb. And our lack of anything else resembling a bomb worries me. Again, I won't be too upset if we go with the charm (especially w/ 3 Shamblesharks. But, I just think we really need things higher in our curve right now. And a flying fatty sounds good.

I really think Nimbus Swimmer is the better pick here. Creature to trigger evolve, flier, and most of all, nasty big. You'd never question picking Fireball, would you? Mana sinks are really, really good in Limited. Having two makes it that much more likely that we topdeck this in the late game.

So by my count we are 16 in favor of Simic Charm 13 in favor of Nimbus Swimmer and 4 people who are stubbornly clinging to Simic Manipulator. I am going to suggest that if you want to change your votes you do so now (especially if you voted for manipulator), as the votes are very close and 4 votes could push this thing one way or the other. Also if any charm or swimmer people want to change their vote after seeing the numbers broken down now is the time.

I'm voting for Simic Charm. I would say "let it table" but we're too late in the back. Nimbus Swimmer might find himself splashed in someone else's deck, but I just don't feel like he's as useful as we want him to be. He could be really good if we get a few Bioshifts, but if we get lucky with those, I'd say even Simic Manipulator would be a better pick, and he's way too hard to build around in limited.

My vote is Simic Charm.

Yeah, what he said.

I don't think we can go wrong with either pick. The fish is sorta bombish and the charm is removalish. So, even BREAD doesn't shed much light.

Ooops. "He" being DeckBuilder345.

Maybe we should tie it up and let our pilot decide. I honestly feel like this is more of a playstyle choice than a which is strictly better choice.

I'm all for KrazyCaley having the final say between Simic Charm and Nimbus Swimmer

BREAD is meant to apply in that order, and Simic Charm is very unwieldy removal at best. I choose Nimbus Swimmer in a heartbeat, despite the presence of "heartbeat" on Simic Charm.

KrazyCaley only votes to break ties. If we keep as we are, I believe the Simic Charm will be "chosen" by the masses.

Anybody who isn't ok with the Charm being picked should probably change their vote (or vote if you haven't yet).

In an expert display of wishy-washy, I vote Nimbus Swimmer

OH MAN he voted! Shows how good I am at this. Lol.

@landgrafb I thought it was a tie because someone said it was? Let me actually count like I usually do. In any case, we need to move on. If the votes prior to my choice favor Simic Charm, that's the pick.

@apt142 Oh man, don't do that. That's why I don't vote.

Yep, Simic Charm is the narrow favorite. Moving on.