If you're going for combos, Enduring Scalelord is literally an infinite combo with itself. If you can get 2 out.

.....are you a furry?

Problem with Enduring Scalelord is 1) you need two of them out, 2) you need a way to start the combo, and 3) they need trample. Unfortunately, I am missing 2 of those 3 requirements seeing as I don't know when I'll get both scalelords, and I don't have something to give them trample (chump blockers suck man...). Otherwise, I would. I appreciate the suggestion though

Archetype of Aggression... but that is rather un-dragonish.

Haven of the Spirit Dragon feels like it's in most scenarios just strictly better than Crucible of the Spirit Dragon IMO.

@lanimilbuS I like Crucible of the Spirit Dragon because it allows me to store mana for when I need it to play my dargons, allowing for more plays in the same turn. I can see if I can fit the safe haven somewhere though

I like this +1... Can you check out and help my deck?

Dargons?

yes Myllyes314, dargons

you have a criminally under landed deck with only 9 sources of green, playing a courser will be difficult and establishing a mana creature early is hard too. I would suggest adding 4 frontier bivouac as a starting point to make the deck a little more consistent. I would suggest switching out the goblins for the lands as a starting point.

M_Foster Thank you for the suggestion!

I actually originally had 24 lands in the deck, but I found that I continually got swamped seeing as a have 35 sources of mana with 24 lands (39 with Courser of Kruphix), and I really didn't need that many sources of mana for what I was doing. Going down to 20 lands gave me 31 sources of mana (again, 34 with Courser of Kruphix) and that seemed to work a lot better because I could put in more stuff for utility or whatever

The current list feels like it's trying to be too cute with tricks and gimmicks, running things like the singleton Dragon Tempest and two copies of Mirror Mockery - what are you even using this for?

Rattleclaws and Coursers, while both fine cards on their own, do not belong together in the same deck - replace the Rattles with Caryatids, they'll do a little more towards getting you to that late game you seem to want with the pantheon of dragonlords (for that matter, where are Ojutai and Silumgar? If you're gonna go gimmicky, go all the way) plus 5-color fixing.

Dragonlord's Prerogative feels more like a sideboard card for the control deck, and I'm not really sure if you're going down that control route.

I think Tormenting Voice has a place somewhere in some deck that cares about being able to put specific cards from its hand into the graveyard, but that's not here. You should be spending the early turns casting dorks and accelerating out into the top-end. It's a horrible topdeck, since you usually want to empty your hand, and you can't cast this without something to discard, especially since you really can't afford to discard lands, you're not running nearly enough.

21 lands is fine for Atarka Burn and other decks that are very, very low to the ground with their curves...you are anything but. I would say at least 24-25, even considering the dorks you're running, because your top-end is so mana-hungry. And as far as lands to add...get a set of Frontier Bivouac if you're going to stay base-Temur, and a couple copies of Mana Confluence would hurt, but it does tap for any color and come in untapped.

Silumgar's Scorn should probably be Clash of Wills - double-blue is going to be very hard for your deck to cast on so few blue sources.

As far as Sideboard advice...what are your worst match-ups? What do you feel you have trouble with? Hornet Nest is a great answer to fast, aggressive decks, and Disdainful Stroke is a good answer-all for basically everyone else.

If you want to make this deck competitive, it's going to take some overhauling. Decide where you want it to go and what you want it to be - if you want control, midrange, or beatdown, and start looking at the tools you usually see show up in those kinds of decks, which ones you can include in your deck and which ones don't work. I know there's not a lot of Temur decks in the spotlight, so the answers aren't always on display, but the green/red decks are usually a good place to start. There have been a couple 5-color dragons decks, but those were based primarily in one color (blue, black, or green) and then used playsets of Havens and Crucibles to fix for them (and Caryatids for the green version).

Thank you Ryx, it's nice to have someone willing to help me out with this :)

First off, as I have been playing this deck, I think it has become a midrnge-control mix or something like that, I stall until I can play or until I get my big guys, or I beat them down with the dragons that I have at the moment.

As for mana, I actually have only had a drought with this deck once (and I'm not sure you can call it a drought, because the only problem I had was blue mana, when I had a total of 9 sources (12 if you include the courser)). I have been swamped more often than not. I will be adding one or two of the Frontier Bivouacs, but I will not add Mana Confluence because I had it in here before and it hurt me more than it helped.

Then for match-ups, I have had a hard time with aggro match-ups (might be because I haven't gotten the Circle of Flames yet...) but I had completely forgotten about Hornet Nest, so that will be something I will add. Artifacts are something I need to be prepared for and I think using Smash to Smithereens would be a good sideboard option for that. Disdainful Stroke will definitely be added in for Silumgar's Scorn though. Clash of Wills I am not so sure about atm, seeing as it can be very mana intensive, but I do see it as a maybe... actually, it might work well against aggro... hmmm...

With Mirror Mockery and Dragon Tempest, the mockery has literally saved my life before. I put it on the other player's Sunscorch Regent and then next turn I played Dragonlord Atarka and killed it. With the tempest (though I haven't been able to use yet), I can use the mockery on one of my dragons when I have that out and ping the person before my attackers even hit, and then attack with the creature I just made. Or just use it to give one of my dragonlords haste when I play them.

Lastly, with Tormenting Voice I see how taking out the voice would help this deck out a lot, I just don't know what kind of card-draw I would put in for it. It helps me cast my Treasure Cruise, and if I really need to I can discard a dragonlord and get it back later with Haven of the Spirit Dragon. I would love to switch it out if I found better card-draw for it.

Again, thank you Ryx for being willing to help me out a bit with this :)

Courser is not a mana dork, nor should it be seen as a source of mana. It helps to block early aggression, and straightens out your draws a bit, but it does not ramp you, it does not produce mana, it's not a dork. And for that matter, dorks are not substitutes for lands, especially when several opponents will make point to kill them knowing how much your deck relies on getting to the 5+ mana creatures.

As far as the interaction you mention with Dragon Tempest + Mirror Mockery I'm afraid you're incorrect on the order of operations there. Mockery is a triggered response to the creature it's attached to being declared an attacker. When the token is created, the decision of what attacks has already been made. You do get the ping effect, but without even running full packages of the workhorses Thunderbreak and Stormbreath, a lot of your targets for it are legendary that won't even be left on the field when that trigger goes off. It'll still trigger the ping, but when the legendary token enters the battlefield and sees the original, you must choose which one to sacrifice as a state-based action (does NOT use the stack), and you're never going to choose to sacrifice the original over the token.

Let's say you have Tempest out and Mockery on a Dragonlord Atarka. You declare Atarka as attacking, Mockery goes on the stack, creates the token Atarka. Token Atarka enters the battlefield, sees real Atarka, must be sacrificed due to the legend rule. However, Token Atarka DID ETB and will trigger Dragon Tempest and her own ETB damage effect. These effects will go on the stack, but token Atarka will already be gone when they resolve. The damage will still be dealt, but since Tempest looks for 'X = the number of dragons in play,' X will not include token Atarka, which was already gone when the ability resolves.

Overall, Mockery is a mad scientist card, that's basically only relevant on creatures with ETB effects. The dream here, of course, is to put it on an opposing Siege Rhino which can never attack into it - the token will block and butt heads with the original, netting you a 6 point life swing from ETB before disappearing. I just don't think it's competitive, it's too janky. I'd say replace it with hard removal, especially since there's always the chance (especially playing against G/W/x) that your opponent might have some enchantment-hate capable of getting rid of it.

As far as Smash to Smithereens goes...I wouldn't bother with it until rotation, if even then. Unless your meta has a serious artifacts presence (which isn't really supported in standard right now), I would go with the more versatile Destructive Revelry for sideboard, since you're in the colors anyway - Same CMC, instant speed, deals 1 less to their face but also hits enchantments, which are a bigger threat in Standard right now than Artifacts (not saying there's a lot, but more than Artifacts, at least).

Clash of Wills is about early game, it allows you to respond to a slower deck when you're on the draw. Say you're up against an Abzan deck, which can be very 3-drop heavy, and they tap out for it. You've only had two turns, so 2 mana, but that's all you need to make Clash work, X=1 when they can't pay is all you really need from it. Works later in the game too, any time they're tapping out, a Force Spike will get the job done.

You say you don't get shafted on your lands despite running only 21...that tells me you haven't been playing this deck long enough, and you have opponents who are farrr too nice to your dorks, especially since you're running Rattleclaws over Caryatids. Again, I would recommend changing this, because Caryatids are better in the midrange package. Is there ever a time to run Rattles over Caryatids? Yes, it's called the aggressive ramp beatdown deck, but you're too slow for that, go with the protected 5-color dork.

No matter what, if you're going to run taplands, run the full set of Bivouacs first and foremost. Scry is nice, but having access to all three of your colors is better. I really don't see why you're scared of Mana Confluence - it makes sketchy hands keepable, having access to all three of your colors untapped is NOT to be underrated, and you're running lifegain between Courser and Dromoka.

Just a couple cards to think about:

Savage Knuckleblade - You're in Temur and you're not running this? Really?

Sarkhan's Triumph - This is probably too cute, but it is a 3-mana, instant speed tutor for any dragon in your deck.

Ryx First off, I see how you would consider Courser of Kruphix not a source of mana, it gets you early lands off the top so I figured it helps a bunch with getting lands earlier. However, I have been playing the deck with 21 lands for 3 months, and it has only failed me against the artifact aggro match-up that I was against in my standard tourney I played in (mind you, I did not have the proper sideboard cards for the match-up, and I still have not played against control yet, so I'm still scared about that match-up) I also have actual judges (who play at my store) of whom are actually decent at magic, so I would think that I have decent opponents to play against, but everyone has their right to their own opinions I guess.

I do know about the legendary rule, but you obviously know more about the combat phase than I do, because I did not realize that declaring the creature attacking meant you were done declaring attackers. it's nice to have some clarification on that

Destructive Revelry is also another decent card that I think I should have been able to think about earlier, I will be using that instead of the smithereens once I get a couple of those.

Clash of Wills I see as a good game-one card, because they won't be expecting it at first, but I don't see it doing too well afterwards... I can test it out in a few matches to see how it goes, but I don't see it being a permanent addition.

The main reason why I run the Rattleclaw Mystics instead of the Sylvan Caryatids is because of the morph. I can get 4 mana off of the rattleclaw in one turn, allowing me to play things like Sarkhan Unbroken T3 and still have mana left over, or I can get a dragonlord out early on T4 (T5 for Atarka)

Now, problem I still have with running Mana Confluence (again, I had it in here before) is that I don't have enough lifegain to support it unless I have the courser (Which always get removed at least 2 turns after I play it) or unless I have Dragonlord Dromoka out (which at that point I've won, because nobody I've come up against has been able to deal with it)

Lastly, I don't know what to switch out for the knuckleblade. Even if I were to put it in, he's just not something I prefer to use. However, I can see Sarkhan's Triumph as a one or two-of in here.

fix: I can get Dragonlord Atarka out T4, though not very consistantly

I am perfectly aware of the explosive starts that can be had going Elvish Mystic into a morphed Rattleclaw Mystic and flipping it on turn 3 for a total of 5-6 mana available. I used to use this to cast Sagu Mauler face-up on turn 3, back pre-DTK when people weren't as used to having to contend with a large, hexproof beatstick (6/6 trample, hexproof, I'm amazed it hasn't seen more standard play, but 6 CMC is a little prohibitive, even if it can cheat in as a morph). That's just not the vibe I get from your deck, especially since you lack any one-mana spells to really take advantage of that extra mana, and you absolutely have to hit Haven of the Spirit Dragon as one of your lands in order to drop a turn 3 Dromoka or Kolaghan.

I still use the morphed Rattleclaws for some explosive starts, dropping Stormbreath or Sarkhan on Turn 3, and then leaving up Stubborn Denial. Without one-mana tricks, I think trying to get that 6th mana is showy, but not practical. If you say "T3 Sarkhan, plus him, then I have two mana available"...what are you casting for 2 mana that's better than simply having him make a 4/4 flying dragon token? I always -2 him on ETB, I don't care if he gets killed in response, he's eaten a removal spell and given me a 4/4 dragon, that's called value. There's a very small number of cards in standard that can one-for-one answer a resolved Sarkhan Unbroken that made a token.

Just goldfish this one out for a minute: T1 (Untapped Green source) Elf > T2 (untapped land) Morphed Rattleclaw > T3 (untapped land) you have 6 mana, but you require having a specific land you only run 2-of in order to cast your 6-drops, you probably cast a 4-5 drop and then what are you leaving up?

Now replace the Rattleclaw with Caryatid and go through the motions again: T1 (Untapped green source) Elf > T2 (land can ETB tapped) Caryatid > T3 (Untapped land) into 5-drop.

Of course now that I've typed this out, I realized the flaw in my own scenarios: They both had you hitting 3 land drops in a row. When you miss the third land drop, the morphed Rattleclaw still allows you to play a 5-drop where-as the Caryatid would limit you to a 4-drop.

I would be worried about the control match-ups, you're only running 20 creatures, of which 8 are dorks and 3 coursers, bringing you down to only 9 plus your walkers. In that light, I would be very concerned about how you handle removal-heavy opponents, what do you do against the guy who can kill your big stuff? I realize that's probably why you have the card draw in Treasure Cruise and Tormenting Voice but instead of running draw spells to find you threats...just play more threats instead.

I'm working with a completely different beast, but it might help you understand where I'm coming from if you take a look at my deck, Intet Beatdown - Keep in mind, I'm not midrange, I'm beatdown with a touch of disruption. I want you dead or defensive by turn 5, and I'll leave up hard counters for your sweepers.

Yeah, yesterday before I went to bed I realized that I could be running more dragons if I were to take out a couple things, that would make Sarkhan's ult even more deadly, and as you said, it also gives me more threats.

The card draw is in there because it 1) gets me more lands which is great 2) draws me dorks and dragons which is great and 3) gives me more things to play late game. I had a few games when I was making this deck where I had empty hands with a plethora of mana to use.

With Sarkhan Unbroken though, I try to get cards off of him in this deck because I need the card draw and being able to use the extra mana he makes is awesome. It doesn't surprise me that you get a dragons off him every time, seeing as you are using a beat down deck, but I am not as aggressive as that deck as you can see. If I can also stress out my opponent with how close Sarkhan is to his ult, then that helps me because it becomes more of a psychological battle on their side

Sure, there are still situations where I would use the -2, but I like trying to get the extra card if at all possible

Did a little bit of goldfishing with this, and as I expected, mulliganed a LOT because there wasn't enough lands or there wasn't the right color. A ramp deck absolutely must have some way to produce green mana in the opening hand, but I only count 12 sources in your lands, three of which are Wooded Foothills (get a 4th), which my deck usually wants to save for getting mountains.

I still recommend Mana Confluence but at least fill out the Bivouacs, and look into some Yavimaya Coast and Shivan Reef, they only hurt you if you need the colored mana. If you've somehow flooded out on land, you can tap it for colorless and take no damage.

Also, Crucible of the Spirit Dragon feels too slow to me, I understand it's dragon-fixing, but I'd probably recommend filling out the playset of Havens first, which I'm not going to suggest either. Both of them are only colored as far as dragons are concerned, they produce any color (with some investment on Crucible's part), but only for dragons, which are only so much of your deck. If you weren't 3-colors, you could get away with more colorless lands, but as it is, there's a reason you see me only run one Haven in mine.

I would probably take out Kiora and Sarkhan Dragonspeaker, replace them with more dragons - you have room for more Stormbreath Dragon and another Thunderbreak Regent in the main. Or just replace them with lands, because you need lands. Since you're running three of them, I take that Sarkhan Unbroken is something you want out on a regular basis, and Dragonspeaker gets clunky with that - Planeswalker Uniqueness rule and what not.

And probably reduce Cruise to a one-of, it might be nice in circumstances where it comes up, but you're not dumping into your bin, so don't expect to chain them together turn after turn at low, low cost while still having the mana to do other stuff in your turn.

First, Whenever I play this deck, I keep hands that have 2-3 lands and a dork, then stuff I can play or draw spells. If I keep a hand that has 4+ lands in it, I get swamped. and at the moment, I don't have the ability to get a 4th Wooded Foothills, would probably be nice if I could though (not sure what I would take out for it...)

Shivan Reef and Yavimaya Coast I might add in here as a one-of of each, but I don't want to go a full playset of the Frontier Bivouacs. I like having the untapped mana and the only reason I have the temples in here is because of the scry. The Bivouacs have a choice of three mana, but that is why they are in here as a two-of, If I go down on untapped lands, I will start having land problems (not droughts, but not having the mana the turn I need it)

Crucible of the Spirit Dragon is great early game, because if I don't have stuff to play or I don't tap out every turn, it allows me to save tons of mana, and the more mana I save, the easier it is to cast my dragonlords along with more stuff in a single turn (because you can remove any number of counters off the Crucible), however, I will go down one when I can so I can have an extra Haven of the Spirit Dragon because it has more utility and having multiple Crucibles (yes, it does happen, that is why I have card draw, to get through my deck) doesn't work out too well.

I agree with you on Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker, Stormbreath is a good replacement for him and having dragonspeaker and unbroken in the same hand is not useful for me. I am going to switch him out with the Stormbreath Dragon on sideboard, but he has been usefull in some matches so I will continue to use him. Kiora, the Crashing Wave though is not really something I can take out, being able to lock one of their biggest threats down or getting an extra land drop, plus the card draw has been invaluable when I've played her.

Lastly, I cannot go down on card draw. Whenever I have used Treasure Cruise, it has always been for at least , if not closer to . If I go down on card draw though, I will not be able to keep the deck going, I will lose steam too often and not be able to answer my opponent when they kill my dragons/planeswalkers (Like, playing more of them, or countering the spell since I have more playable counters now)

I have gone and added a land for one Atarka's Command, I am going to try that out and see if that works, but I think I will end up putting the command back in for the land drop if necessary, right now the list is getting to be pretty tight

again, I don't know what you mean when you say you needed to mulligan multiple times for a good hand.

first playtest on the website and I got a beautiful hand:

1Rattleclaw Mystic 2Elvish Mystic 3Treasure Cruise 4Haven of the Spirit Dragon 5Courser of Kruphix 6Wooded Foothills 7Mountain

second was sketchy and would have swamped me (scry lands almost made it keepable):

1Wooded Foothills 2Mountain 3Temple of Abandon 4Island 5Rattleclaw Mystic 6Temple of Mystery 7Draconic Roar

Third one I had to mulligan once and got a workable hand (the 7 hand hand all my High CMC cost stuff, nothing I could do):

1Forest 2Frontier Bivouac 3Rattleclaw Mystic 4Treasure Cruise 5Draconic Roar 6Dragonlord Dromoka

I am probably going to Take out the majority of the blue in this deck (namely the counterspells) seeing as this can be a very fast deck. I can (instead of counterspells) go for things like more dragons or Sarkhan's Triumph. instead of having counterspells, I could use things like Obelisk of Urd against things like Languish.

This is theoretical however, so I will be testing this, but I think this deck will be more effective with a more aggro sort of format.

things I would still keep in:

Sarkhan Unbroken

Kiora, the Crashing Wave (at least on sideboard, because she is really good with this deck)

Treasure Cruise (I don't think I have ever not been able to cast it, unless I was dead though of course. I also need card draw desperately or else I lose b/c I run out of gas real quick)

I went 3-1 in My standard tourney with the deck, I went and made a couple of changes:

Tormenting Voice is out, it is useful sometimes... But I need it to be useful period. Not only that, but I kept siding it out, so it's gone.

Shaman of Forgotten Ways is in MB, it is just such a ridiculous mana dork, i figure it is good for this deck

Kiora, the Crashing Wave is good against pretty much everything except goblins. I was able to actually get her ult against a control deck and he just conceded when I countered his Dig Through Time he played when I was ending my turn.

Stubborn Denial is in side against control, I need more counter spells against control ( I was lucky that I drew my counters when I needed them in the match.

Matches:

Homebrew: 2-0 win, this was basically just a deck that he put together that had some decently powered cards, but they just had no synergies with each other.

Mill: 2-0 win, a close game both times, the second game I started with a hand that had 2 Sarkhan Unbrokens and the last swing I hit with 2 5/5 dragons and an Atarka's Command for exactly 13

(Esper) Control: 2-0 win, I think I was just doing really well and he just wasn't getting his land drops, I was able to ramp into my dragons really fast with Atarka's Command and my dorks so later when he had answers, I had counters.

Devotion: 1-2 loss, I won the second game, but he was just too fast and I didn't have enough answers for what he was putting down. It was close though, second game I had him down to 3 so if I had lasted one more turn I would've killed him.

Sorry, 3rd game I had him to 3