HairyManBack says... #3
Glad you read my comment. Think I was too abrasive?
I do wish I had your mana luck! ;) The suggestion with Wilds was to primarily fetch for the 3 colors. With the addition of thinning lands out the deck.
April 19, 2016 10:34 p.m.
alachronism says... #4
Nah, man. Just some tough love. ;)
You might find it amusing that last night I was playing this deck. I mentioned, "yeah, someone on tapped out said my mana base sucks, but I really haven't had any problems."
Proceeds to mulligan down to 5 due to no land, finishes the game with a forest and a plains on turn 9.
So, while I still won the 2/3, perhaps I'll stick with a bumped up land count of 23. Haha.
April 20, 2016 2:14 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #5
I've been running 24 at a 12/12 split of semi-slow and basic, and it works great.
You never did come back to comment... ;)
April 20, 2016 5:09 p.m.
With weenies, i have found that a fun option is Cryptolith Rite. It allows you to use those creatures that don't do too much after they first enter (im looking at you Thraben Inspector). First turn plop down an inspector, second turn cryptolith rite, then another inspector. Thats a third turn sigarda or any 5 drop if you dont miss a land drop. Just a suggestion. Always nifty to get more mana. It also works with Shaman of Forgotten Ways if you decide to use that as well.
April 20, 2016 9:01 p.m.
I would be tempted to drop 2 Thraben Inspector for Always Watching (boosting all creatures) and Den Protector for Cryptolith Rite (for a big mana boost). You are not generating clues to up Tireless Tracker so maybe Hanweir Militia Captain Flip would be a good option.
April 21, 2016 4:27 p.m.
Forget that last comment, I forgot Tireless Trackers landfall effect.
April 21, 2016 4:33 p.m.
HairyManBack says... #9
For the best odds long run I find CoCo works up to par with >8 non legal targets. I would think Dromoka's Command, the Angel, and Mirror Mocker would suffice. However, Always Watching is a beast. The problem is that
April 21, 2016 8:29 p.m.
HairyManBack says... #10
Arashin Foremost back? Hell yeah! Love to hear how that plays. Although it looks out of place in CoCo. As he operates on your turn.
And I'm lovin the additional land. ;)
April 24, 2016 7:01 p.m.
alachronism says... #11
HairyManBack, you'd be surprised how often I CoCo on my own turn, either to pump Thalia's Lieutenant to swing for more damage or in hopes of removing one of their blockers with Reflector Mage or Bounding Krasis. However, I also play it a lot on my opponent's turn when they declare an attacker, in hopes of coming in with a surprise or pumped blocker. Arashin Foremost is super useful in both aspects as she's a fantastic blocker with double strike, or can make one of my other seemingly harmless warriors suddenly an unexpected trade. The fact that her ability repeats when she attacks means that even if I have to CoCo on their end step, she's not wasted. Plus a 2/2 double strike for 3 really just isn't bad at all. It's the most power I can get out of a 3-drop, actually. And +1/+1 counters from Thalia's Lieutenant and Dromoka's Command feel so damned good on her.
And yes, 23 lands seems to be the sweet spot at the moment. Something funny I've found is that I much prefer going second instead of first in this deck. The extra draw ensures that my starting hand has what I need, it allows Reflector Mage or Bounding Krasis almost a guaranteed target on turn 3, and Knight of the White Orchid has proven to almost always even out my mana base with theirs on turn 3 or 4. The ability to play knight on turn 3, put down two lands, and then put down another 2-drop, almost feels like a mini CoCo for tempo.
As always, thanks for the comment :D
April 24, 2016 7:14 p.m.
alachronism says... #12
Alrighty gents. After a handful of games tonight, I'm seriously re-evaluating my strategy against white weenies.
Now, granted, I had pretty regularly bad draws. But overall my strategy of being slightly slower but more long lasting than white weenies didn't work. I'm gonna split the problems into a couple areas.
First, life was a huge factor. Every game I was making a comeback when I just barely lost due to low life. In three games I pulled one Hidden Dragonslayer, who's my main life advantage guy. Any other options out there for sideboarding to ensure I gain life and survive early game?
On that note, this is the match up where Dromoka's Command seemed weakest. I could make them sac Gryff's Boon, but they can just bring it back. There's no burn to worry about. And I can almost never use the fight option for removal, as they tend to have similar 2/1 creatures with counters, meaning removal becomes a trade (something I want to avoid). Generally their strategy of going wide makes dromoka's less effective. The only replacement options I can think of for sideboarding are Ojutai's Command and Declaration in Stone.
Ojutai's is almost always beneficial against weenies where Dromoka's was weak. I can make a fair trade with a blocking creature, and then bring it back on their end step for unexpected tempo. I can gain life (surprisingly useful). I can also use it to counter their big Thalia's Lieutenant or whatever is gonna mess me up. And I can always draw a card if no other option is needed. The only thing I don't like is the 4CMC. Especially against an aggro shell... it just seems expensive. Declaration in Stone seems a strong early game removal option, especially since weenies runs a lot of 4x creatures. But the midgame clue draws could be problematic.
Ultimately their go-wide strategy is hard to deal with. Reflector Mage and Bounding Krasis are made less useful without singular threats. Even by shutting down one of their Thalia's Lieutenant with a Mirror Mockery, they still had three other big attackers to swing with. What I really want is a board wipe or field-wide tempo, but it's hard in Bant colors. Send to Sleep? Descend upon the Sinful? Neither really work with a CoCo deck.
Anyways, I'd love to hear your guys' thoughts as always!
alachronism says... #1
As always, really appreciate the constructive criticism, HairyManBack. I've been playing lots of games with this deck lately and have had really minimal problems with mana. It's the reason I keep dropping land, because I've found that with 24 I'm regularly flooded with the stuff. Maybe I'm just lucky and the land count is actually off... but really, I've had almost no problems. I may cut a card to go back to 23 total.
I'm not sure how Evolving Wilds is better here than peek lands, since it's guaranteed slow land. So far I've found them really valuable, especially if I have quite of a few of them but one plains in hand. Again, just my experience though!
April 19, 2016 8:25 p.m.