Let's get BUGgy

Modern wnorris17

SCORE: 21 | 33 COMMENTS | 2257 VIEWS | IN 4 FOLDERS


JexInfinite says... #1

In a control deck, you usually play 25-26 land. In this particular one, 25 lands seems about right. Add more land.

April 26, 2015 2:30 a.m.

wnorris17 says... #2

With delve and a general low curve, I really have been plagued with flooding at 25. I often need to topdeck gas, not a land later in the game. If you run the deck a few times, you'll see how few lands are needed. I'll test it again with 25 though, thanks for the suggestion!

April 26, 2015 12:51 p.m.

Upward-SaGa says... #3

Honestly, i love that you're trying to bring BUG back, but i think you're doing it wrong. I have a BUG build myself, and it doesn't have a lot of problems. Doesn't that just BUG you? Your cancel base seems very weak, and you can honestly drop to 22 land if you play the deck right with the Serum Visions scrys. I would also MB a second Damnation as you will need to wipe a lot. I would also switch Tectonic Edge out with Ghost Quarter You mainly use them late game for man lands anyway, and by then they're out of fetch targets anyway. So, they won't have a land to search for and you don't have to tap another mana for it. It's also better against Tron matchups. The SB could also use a lot of work. It looks like its based for only 2 matchups which is a big problem as you have some of the best SB options in modern. You have 0 answers for Affinity, no golgari charms for Twin, since you don't run tokens you should also have Night of Souls' Betrayal over the curse. Abrupt decay and thoughtseize shouldn't be in SB imo either. They're good cards, but you can actually find better SB cards. Through some testing of my own, Voidslime is a beast in this deck. Add a Flooded Grove to the lands and its perfect to help it. Remand has also made the deck run much smoother with the extra cycle. probably only a 2 of.

April 28, 2015 2:17 p.m.

And now for me to completely contradict several points made by Upward-SaGa.

  1. Firstly, Upward-SaGa what is a cancel base? Do you mean counter spells? Because the counter spells for this list are completely fine.

  2. Cutting land down to 22 would make the deck far too inconsistent with the number of 4 drops within the deck. The land base is fine.

  3. Ghost Quarter and Tec Edge are purely meta calls.

  4. The sideboard is remarkably flexible and hits well against all of the top tier decks. I personally believe that Curse is better than Night's Betrayal even if it does cost one more. Mostly because you can maintain your own board state better.

  5. I agree that Damnation needs to be a 2 of in the deck. Possibly cut a Thragtusk.

  6. Creeping Corrosion should be considered for Affinity unless it isn't seen much in your meta game.

  7. You get an up vote.

April 28, 2015 3:31 p.m.

Upward-SaGa says... #5

@CanadianShinobiThe counter spells just seem situational to me. In control matchups Mana Leak lets a lot across. It's a great counterspell midrange, but i think Voidslime would be better in it's place. Even if it's a top deck it can stop fetches like Shadow of Doubt, PW abilities, and it's a hard counter. If he's running Cryptic Command then he already has the land base to run it fairly well. Spell Snare as a 3 of just really seems situational. I would run 1-2 max if none at all. Remand just seems like it will help the deck more. Players often won't play the remanded card in fear of it being canceled or removed the majority of the time, or it will at least give you a turn AND a card for something they tapped out in playing.

You're probably right about the land, but Fabiano's primer says he said he often sided out lands in his matchups as Serum Visions overperformed in finding what he needed.

Curse is good, but the one turn difference can mean the entire game against Twin. Yes, it has no drawbacks, but the drawbacks won't affect him much anyway.

@TheAlexGnan Creeping is mainly a slow hoser for Etched Champion.

April 28, 2015 4:03 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #6

There's a lot for me to respond to, I'm between classes so whatever I don't respond to here I will tonight! Thanks for the +1's and suggestions guys!

  1. Upward-SaGa, I do not like 3 mana counters in modern very much unless I have a reliable way to cast them on turn two. Too much happens before Voidslime comes online, Mana Leak and Spell Snare grab pretty much all the scary stuff until cryptic comes online. I don't think 3 mana counters are fast enough. Spell Snare hits an astounding amount of the meta right now, it is probably the best counter in the deck. I play a lot of bigger events and my lgs is very competitive so the potential to find a 2 drop to counter is high.

  2. I agree that there are times to play Ghost Quarter over tech, but in this list I want to use tech since I don't want to bank on them fetching all of their basics (this is a blood moon meta).

  3. Creeping Corrosion is a good call. I need something to get me out of an Etched Champion. Also, I have land removal to help with affinity.

  4. This deck has a strong twin matchup to begin with. I am considering switching curse. BUT, i really like it for letting my Tarmogoyf fight other Tarmogoyf. And it doesn't kill my Snapcaster Mage's.

  5. Remand was in my first iteration, but it is more suited for a tempo deck than a control deck. I think it is a waste of slots just to get the cycle over mana leak, especially since leak is pretty good right now and acts as an early hard counter.

  6. I am going to test Voidslime, Remand, and Ghost Quarter.

  7. I think the 2nd Damnation is indeed needed. I just need to trade for it. The deck you see is the deck I have built, so I have been trying get another haha.

April 28, 2015 5:04 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #7

TheAlexGnan: The budget is awful! haha. And I agree that there are a ton of good card options in BUG! If you do make a list, please do link it!

April 28, 2015 5:06 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #8

To clarify the reason I am running the lands I am.

I was originally running 23 with no tech edge. With the Serum Visions pulling lands out of my deck so consistently it worked quite well (Same thing that Fabiano said). With the 2 colorless lands added I decided to bump the count to 24 since this deck is fairly color intensive and life is a concern.

April 28, 2015 5:30 p.m.

Upward-SaGa says... #9

If you look at our profile, you'll notice that this user account is a joint one between nick200266 and skitch4200. The previous comments have been by the former, and this one, the latter.

I like the deck, and see where it goes. While the description on our version of BUG says it plays like a Rock deck would, its closer to just hard control, since we are lacking cards like Dark Confidant and Tarmogoyf.

Here, though, is the closest answer to Rock that BUG can probably get. The counterspells in Doesn't that just BUG you? are used to slow down the opponent and keep them away from advancing a board state. Here, I think that it is safe to say that the counterspells are used more to protect the pilot's own state, rather than disrupt the opponent's. In that aspect, the spells you've chosen should be just fine, but I will try to further justify Voidslime in that it can stop a number of abilities, like a sweep from Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, or stopping Tasigur, the Golden Fang from recurring a threatening card. Like it's been said, these counterspells are more of a preference and meta decision, but that's just some more food for thought. We play in a splinter twin meta, so that's where most of our Sideboard input comes from, but against blood moon, Nature's Claim is a great thing to consider.

One more thing I will point out is Liliana of the Veil. She is a great card, and definitely buffs Tarmogoyf, but since you run counterspells, making yourself discard cards can hurt. I use Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver in her place, but i'm sure a better card could be found, one more suited to your meta.

April 28, 2015 5:38 p.m.

Upward-SaGa says... #10

Also, don't listen to JexInfinite about the lands. He has tried to suggest Shadow of Doubt over Voidslime in my deck, and believes 22 lands cut the bare minimum for UR Delver.

Not being a hater, jex, but I'll be honest and just say that your advice can suck sometimes.

April 28, 2015 5:41 p.m.

mkennedymma says... #11

I like the list i have a few suggestions, possibly slip in one of the many 1B removal spells ie: Go for the Throat, or Slaughter Pact to sure up any holes in the Abrupt Decays and so you can save you Maelstrom Pulse for other problem permanents. Also im pretty certain Thrun, the Last Troll, and or Troll Ascetic are a mandotry wether main board or sidboard.

April 28, 2015 10:05 p.m.

mkennedymma says... #12

sorry just saw the Murderous Cut thats solid

April 28, 2015 10:09 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #13

I like Thrun in a meta with lots of control and burn, but lately I haven't felt the need to have him. If Jeskai control becomes a thing again in larger numbers I will add him.

And yeah I just changed Slaughter Pact to Murderous Cut. It has a lot of potential to be cheaper. Although i'm a huge pact fan

April 28, 2015 10:22 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #14

Upward-SaGa, I am on the fence about Lili. I really want to play her, and she has performed decently well in testing. I think Ashiok is too meta dependent for me right now, so I'm not sure about those spots. Jace is an all star

April 28, 2015 10:39 p.m.

mkennedymma says... #15

if your going to replace lili your going to need another value engine, there isnt really any good options right now, lili is harder to kill than bob for most decks, and tasigur wont provide you an advantage early enough, sure he will hit the board but your not going to be able to stabalize and use his ability untill much later.

April 28, 2015 10:47 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #16

I agree. And she is completely playable with counterspells, maybe not optimal. But she works in the build pretty well. There are very few instances where she destroys my hand, especially with only 2 copies.

April 28, 2015 11:04 p.m.

JexInfinite says... #17

I'd look at taking out a Spell Snare or two and adding Remand. Abrupt Decay already hits everything that Snare targets, and the only things you REALLY want to counter are Voice of Resurgence and counterspells.

This build looks solid, though. Cards to consider: Shadow of Doubt, the best land destruction which also beats Scapeshift if it ever shows up, Chalice of the Void which wrecks burn, affinity, and random combo decks, but due to your low land count, might be somewhat unrealistic to cast for x=2.

April 29, 2015 4:15 a.m.

wnorris17 says... #18

JexInfinite, thanks for the suggestions. Based off of yours and Upward-SaGa's input I am trying out Remand and I also added an Anticipate that may become a Compulsive Research.

I think that shadow is a good card, but I dont feel the need for it right now

April 30, 2015 8:48 p.m.

Servo_Token says... #19

I personally wouldn't include Compulsive Research unless you are running a dedicated GY strategy. Anticipate is a good one in that slot because it gives you great filtering at instant speed. Though I would say that having more draw power in addition to anticipate is ideal.

Also, I would cut Tasigur if you're on the Snapcaster plan because of the non-bo that having these two in hand brings about. It's just more things to think about, and doesn't seem particularly worth it.

Maybe consider a one of Eternal Witness somewhere? It draws a bunch more value out of all of your cards. It's a pet card of mine, which is in part why I suggest it, but it's also like, the best feeling grabbing up a snapcaster or liliana to use again.

May 1, 2015 1:51 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #20

I have been debating Eternal Witness as well actually. It is super valuable. If I cut Tasigur, I think I would replace it with Batterskull, another good threat and lifegain. But I am a huge Tasigur fan, even with snappy. His ability is very useful too.

May 1, 2015 2:11 p.m.

Saljen says... #21

Don't cut Tasigur, he's a powerhouse in here. Much better than Batterskull would be. Jace AoT is an odd choice. Good against Lingering Souls, but that's about it. Snapcaster Mage is about as good as Eternal Witness in here or better, so i'd stick with Snappy. Maybe 1 Witness for some utility, but don't overdo it. Oh and don't cut Liliana of the Veil. She wins games all by herself. She is infinitely more powerful than Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver.

May 1, 2015 7:42 p.m.

wnorris17 says... #22

Saljen, Jace is for card draw on a body and the Lingering Souls shut down. his +1 is just good with Tarmogoyf as a wincon. I'm glad someone else is a fan of Lili. I really think she has a place in this build.

May 1, 2015 11:21 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #23

I would swap Thragtusk for Kitchen Finks.

May 2, 2015 12:36 a.m.

wnorris17 says... #24

APPLE01DOJ: I am a huge finks fan, but this deck would prefer to drop Thragtusk in the late game than finks. Thragtusk is a wincon.

May 2, 2015 12:42 a.m.

ShermanTank87 says... #25

I have a deck similar to this I keep tweaking from time to time. Modern BUG I go for a full set of Remand because it serves as a target for Snapcaster Mage and also as a draw engine as well as a speed bump.

I have more discard in my deck I think I go 3 Inquisition of Kozilek and 3 Thoughtseize.

I prefer to keep my CC low though and avoid having to many spells that cost 4 in my decks. I'd say cut the Damnation down to 1 and replace it with another Liliana of the Veil. Strategically Liliana of the Veil must be answered so you know you will either get to discard 1 of their cards or make them sacrifice a creature and force them to deal with her on their turn. If they can't it will be more damaging than a Damnation. I personally have not run into many creature heavy decks that makes Damnation a clutch card to have MB.

I'm flash happy so I have Vendilion Clique in my deck as well. I also have Hero's Downfall in my deck because its instant and provides another useful target for Snapcaster Mage. Cryptic Command is fun but its also slow at times I'd also recommend cutting down to 1 to open up for something else.

It all comes down to what you see more often at your meta though. Liliana of the Veil though is clutch for this deck, which is what I'd recommend to add and possibly play around with the idea of a full play set of Remand.

May 2, 2015 7:32 p.m.

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