HolyFalcon says... #3
Doesn't get five mana turn two. Dark Ritual + Island + Vivid Marsh only makes 4 mana.
August 22, 2015 8:22 p.m.
Demonic Tutor and Vampiric Tutor are both illegal in legacy. Diabolic Tutor is nice, but it's just to expensive for a tutor. But if I was to add any of the tutors to this deck- it'd be Enlightened Tutor. However, I have very little money and it's 40-60$ for a playset of those. But thanks for the Suggestions! it might be worth throwing in a Diabolic Tutor or two as a cheap option for now.
August 22, 2015 8:27 p.m.
I seem to have gotten the Sac Land series confused with vivid land series.
August 22, 2015 8:42 p.m.
In legacy, it's going to be entirely too difficult to play one of your four Enduring Ideals. While I love that card, and I have used it extensively in EDH, I can say absolutely and wholeheartedly that it isn't a legacy card. I would highly recommend completely removing it from this deck.
I notice you're trying to stall, but probably in the wrong way. One way that might be interesting is Isochron Scepter imprinting Fog or a card similar to Fog, but even that is probably not efficient enough. Legacy is a format where card advantage and quality is important (much more so than other formats). Also, a lot of the fighting in Legacy, at least in the early game certainly, is fought in the hand and on the stack. A large part of legacy is cards like Thoughtseize, Hymn to Tourach, Ponder, Brainstorm, Preordain, and various counterspells. It's all about the hand, until a threat on the board requires attention. A large part of the legacy format doesn't even attack you, or at least, to an extent, doesn't care at all what kind of defensive creatures you have because it just doesn't matter. For example, ANT will defeat you with Tendrils of Agony, which your defending creatures won't help you defend against. Other decks will steamroll you with Emrakul, the Aeons Torn as early as turn 1, but usually by turn 3 or 4. Other decks have a gameplan that is literally: Attempt to counter every single spell you play, then win with Jace, the Mind Sculptor.
In the description of your deck, you mention that on turn 2, you use Vivid Marsh to tap for "two swamps." I think you may have misinterpreted the card. It has two charge counters when it enters the battlefield. It may tap for one black mana, or you can tap it while removing a single charge counter to add one mana of any color to your mana pool. When you tap a vivid land for mana while removing a charge counter, you are not allowed to remove several counters for several mana. You are only allowed to remove one at a time each time you tap it in that way.
The thing this deck is missing the most is counterspells. Removing Enduring Ideal, Paradox Haze, Statecraft, and all of your creatures lets you take on a different strategy where you can use Rest in Peace to keep the graveyards exiled, and Energy Field alongside Rest in Peace to prevent all damage dealt to you until one of those permanents are answered. This would allow you to switch out Bojuka Bog (or some copies of it, because you have expedition map to get a singleton copy anyway) for more consistent lands. I can see that you're trying to make this a budget deck, and so Enlightened Tutor might be out of your budget, but oh boy is it a good card. It can literally get anything you need, including both Rest in Peace and Energy Field, but of course also Forbidden Crypt.
You can try to protect yourself from losing to your own Forbidden Crypt while Rest in Peace is in play by committing to Puca's Mischief entirely instead of Donate. That way, before you even draw that card, your upkeep will give it to your opponent. One land that you can add to the deck is Forbidden Orchard. It can tap for any color of mana, and allows Puca's Mischief to always have a target for you to gain control of, no matter what you're exchanging. You can also take the 1/1 creatures that Forbidden Orchard makes by giving your opponent your Rest in Peace.
Better creatures for your deck, should you choose to run any, are Academy Rector and Peacekeeper. Some removal, should you choose to run any, should just be Swords to Plowshares for creatures, and maybe Disenchant or Vindicate in the sideboard for other things.
I hope this helps. Good luck.
August 22, 2015 8:56 p.m.
tacoluver123456789 says... #8
I don't get it. How do you make them gain control of Forbidden Crypt?
August 23, 2015 3:18 p.m.
Puca's Mischief allows you to switch permanents with an opponent. I originally had Donate instead, because Donate doesn't require your opponent to have a permanent-- but stuck with Puca's Mischief because it can be tutored and will work faster. Forbidden Orchard has been added to make sure the opponent has a permanent I can switch with.
August 23, 2015 3:40 p.m.
August 25, 2015 4:04 p.m.
Immortal Coil- I'm not sure of the card.
pros:
- it's got a cheaper mana cost. (really the number one factor for me)
- prevents damage.
cons:
- it leaves me very defenseless. (my biggest issue with the card)
- the draw ability will never be used
- unlike Forbidden Crypt, it doesn't allow me to reuse incredibly valuable cards like Dark Ritual or Enlightened Tutor.
In reality, the preventing damage part of Immortal Coil isn't as valuable as I already have lines of defense set up- including counterspells and combos like Energy Field+Rest in Peace. But the real issue is that I can't decide about is whether or not the Mana cost is really worth it- because I'm not sure if it will actually speed up the play- and if it does, is it actually worth the risk?
August 25, 2015 4:58 p.m.
My issue with both the cards is that they can be countered- where as Bojuka Bog cannot.
Relic of Progenitus might be a good side board for decks that I might need specific graveyard hate (Laboratory Maniac) etc., but don't want to play Bojuka Bog out until I've given them Forbidden Crypt.
Since I took out Expedition Map, I don't have anyway to tutor Bojuka Bog, but that hasn't been an issue since I've added Rest in Peace. However, if I have everything set up and only have one plains left, having one copy of Tormod's Crypt to be tutored out with Enlightened Tutor could absolutely win the game. Great suggestion.
Thanks for the help man! I really appreciate it. I really liked all your suggestions, especially Immortal Coil. I think I'll buy a few copies and see how it runs in the deck compared to Forbidden Crypt.
August 25, 2015 9:44 p.m.
See_what_you_do_blue says... #15
As an asshole and a blue player, I can say it needs more blue. Dissolve is crusty crap cakes. Here, try Force of Will. If that's too pricey for you, Disrupting Shoal. If you're even too cheap for that, Daze. cut Swan Song and Lim-Dul's Vault for Brainstorm and Counterspells. Cabal Ritual could have a home here. Donate seems faster then Puca's Mischief. I'd say Forbidden Orchard is a great way to bleed out. Gemstone Mine might be great. City of Brass ain't half bad. Hope I didn't come off like a prick, tried to keep it brief.
August 27, 2015 4:20 p.m.
Thanks See_what_you_do_blue! I've made some adjustments due to your comments.
August 27, 2015 9:51 p.m.
Interesting idea for a deck. My concern is that if you opponent counters something you might lose very quickly. Your main combo is pretty mana-intensive, so you likely won't have any mana left to defend your combo. I'd consider Pact of Negation as a counter when you know you can lock the game up and maybe some Gitaxian Probes to help draw to your combo and see if your opponent has any disruption in their hand.
Also, your Enlightened Tutor + Forbidden Crypt combo doesn't work. The Tutor puts the card on top of the library. Then, next turn, instead of drawing the card you Tutored for, you instead get a card from your graveyard, which probably won't have the Tutor in it (not that you'd want it anyway), since it may have been exiled by of Forbidden Crypt (depeding on the order the spells were cast).
August 28, 2015 11:24 a.m.
I have the same concern. I'm already going a little over my budget for the tutors, (but It's time I got them anyway), so my budget solution was Grand Abolisher. He can be taken care of pretty easily, but it might be worth adding more of him, or adding 2 Pact of Negations if I can find the budget.
Also, I fixed the crypt tutor combo. Thanks! It's great to hear comments. I don't think I have the balance quite right yet, so it is really helpful to hear what other people see as problems.
August 28, 2015 11:45 a.m.
Quick note regarding that combo... I don't think Forbidden Crypt works quite like you think. You never get to draw your top card when Forbidden Crypt is in play, so using Brainstorm or Ponder (or any draw spell) is useless as well. Even your second combo of a reusable Dark Ritual doesn't work because The Dark Ritual is exiled the first time it is used with Forbidden Crypt in play.
August 28, 2015 12:15 p.m.
This is exactly the kind of deck I'd have a blast playing. +1
September 8, 2015 7:18 p.m.
Thanks! There are more budget ways to build it if you want to buy it but not pay 200$. Specifically, finding replacements for Enlightened Tutor and Pact of Negation will lower the price considerably.
September 18, 2015 3:07 p.m.
Leyline of the Void? It can get you some ridiculous starts,
September 24, 2015 8:50 a.m.
ent3r_us3r says... #23
Sounds like lots of fun to play. Magic is the only game where you can have outrageous decks, and still be competitive, and win. Love it, +1 for the title alone.
December 6, 2015 8:14 p.m.
dude, you do realize that people can counter Bojuka Bog's ability with Stifle, Trickbind or Voidslime right? and they're all rather common cards on the format...
you could also try Demonic Pact which is kinda slower to finish the game and might be dangerous because it will speed up the opponents game for some turns, but it still works ok with donate
i also think you'd benefit from Standstill and Leyline of the Void as it was already suggested
Sgreenden says... #1
Why no playset of Demonic Tutor, Vampiric Tutor and maybe Diabolic Tutor?
August 22, 2015 8:18 p.m.