NotSquishedYet says... #2
Why the huge number of lands? Also, say someone's playing 4x Devour in Flames and 4x Dispel. You no longer have win conditions.
February 13, 2016 7:32 p.m.
Ok, I put in Crush of Tentacles to give me another wincon.
February 13, 2016 8:21 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #4
Crush of Tentacles helps, but more creatures is the big thing. My point is that any deck I know can totally overpower you, and many decks run 4x Crackling Doom plus Wild Slash. This means that in 399 games out of 400, they 1) deal 70 damage to you before you stabilize, 2) have zero board pressure against them and overwhelm your control aspects, and 3) Cast two cheap spells while you're tapped out, and you no longer have any means in your deck to block or deal damage.
February 13, 2016 9:10 p.m.
What creatures would you recommend and what should I take out?
February 13, 2016 10:06 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #6
I'd say take out anything with minimum utility, such as Anticipate. A big key here is making every play count for as much as is humanly possible. Probably Reflector Mage as a 4-of, to start with. My advice: if you have a control aspect that can be found on a creature for a small extra price or a small limitation, you want the body to go with the effect.
I know it feels wrong to take out reactive cards, but having combat pressure can act as creature removal, a clock, and other utilities as well. Harbinger of the Tides would probably be another 4-of. Say they swing with 3 1/1s and a 5/5. Instead of taking 8 or having to use mana-intensive control spells, you pay 4 mid combat, bouncing the 5/5 and blocking a 1/1. You just removed two creatures and 6 damage, giving yourself a nice aggro body.
You might want to drop Languish, as it can kill two of your wincons. You might drop some lands for, say, Pilgrim's Eye. That's probably not the best one to suggest, but it's a general idea: deck thinning, ramp, and a decent attacker/blocker.
I don't really get the huge landbase of control decks, as my own standard land destruction deck almost draws too few utility cards with 22, usually requiring between 7 and 16 mana per turn before turn 6. I think Bane of Bala Ged would actually do you a lot of good here. If you can stall till turn 7, it puts a HUGE amount of pressure on your opponent with good control aspects built in.
As my last thought for the moment, I think Orbs of Warding would be an extremely effective 2-4 of in here, more often than not doubling your lifespan and giving you an amazing matchup against non-aggro decks.
February 13, 2016 10:35 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #8
Unrelated to the deck, I feel it is appropriate to mention I hold a very high respect for you. It may just be that I've had a trying day, but I appreciate that you take suggestions fully into consideration and are willing to test new ideas. ~Thanks!
February 13, 2016 11:15 p.m.
Hey, it's no problem, I'm always willing to listen to good advice :)
February 14, 2016 12:07 a.m.
If you want to keep crush of tentacles in, I'd suggest replacing pilgrim's eye and bane of bala ged with Wall of Resurgence, which synergizes very well and is great at blocking. I'd consider putting harbinger in the sideboard. I would replace some amount of counterspells (probably clash) with more removal and/or lands, and replace at least one orbs of warding with Planar Outburst or Crux of Fate. You could also cut Crush for boardwipes. Ojutai is a great card, if you could run 4 you could try Silumgar's Scorn and Foul-Tongue Invocation somewhere in the 75.
The only issue that I see is that you have too many narrow cards (clash, orbs, harbinger) in the mainboard. You want to keep your maindeck as generic as possible so that you can answer almost everything you face, and then sideboard into more specific answers depending on the matchup. Control decks usually want quite a few lands also because they want to be able to play out their answers and live until you can play your wincon. You don't have midrange creatures to hold the fort, you have kill spells, which means you need to be reactive, not proactive. Can't be reactive by tapping out to play a 1/1 flier or having 6 or 7-drops stuck in hand.
Good deck though
February 14, 2016 11:36 a.m. Edited.
4 Reflector Mages or 2 Horribly Awry or 1 and 1 Disdainful Stroke?
February 14, 2016 6:51 p.m.
You don't need those narrow counterspells in the maindeck IMO, most decks are playing some creatures so 4x reflector mage seems fine
February 14, 2016 6:59 p.m.
2x Valorous Stance or 1 Quarantine Field and 1 Immolating Glare? I have Valorous Stance in there, because it is really annoying to have my Ojutai killed.
February 14, 2016 7:58 p.m.
quarantine field is not amazing, stasis snare is probably better in most cases - you could do quarantine field in the sideboard, maybe. Stance is versatile but you may want more against aggressive creatures, so immolating glare is good.
February 14, 2016 9:40 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #15
Quarantine Field is definitely worth having. It's got the versatility to knock out a mid game combo piece, and the late game ability to knock out a board state. I, personally, have seen control decks overwhelmed by sheer number of plays and their individual capabilities - because of that, while 2 6-7 drops are dead in your hand, I feel like 27 lands would consistently leave 5 dead plays and consistently bad topdecking without a dedicated Tempo deck's ability to draw up past seven every turn while still playing a hefty number of threats.
The best way to go about it might be to test a low-creature average control deck version, and one where many of the control plays are utilities tacked onto creatures, seeing which does better overall. I'm not sure of the value of Pilgrim's Eye, but against non-trample it really shines. Particularly, it's a mana-fix playable in any color in a mana intensive deck, with an additional block that could gain a turn or two on its own.
I suggested Harbinger of the Tides as well as Reflector Mage because of its instant speed reactiveness, and the ability to play it during an opponent's combat phase negating two creatures, letting you tap less for Reflector Mage to hit another big threat and still have mana to counter the creature you bounced with Harbinger, then you have an open turn for a decent play and the mana to counter the creature Reflector Mage bounced. They fit together to create a perfect lockdown that reactively hits anything you need it to, permanently.
Eldrazi Displacer could even improve it, bouncing both for extra bouncing, using ingesters and cards like Void Shatter to activate Ulamog's Nullifier for unlimited, unconditional multipurpose counterspells with 4 creatures. It has its own utility for stopping any attacker but Siege Rhino which can be dealt with by other means.
If you really wanted to play a creature heavy control deck, Bant would probably be the best way to go with flash, remote tapping, remote hexproof, and abusive ETB creature based control. It also has some effective, fast wincons.
February 14, 2016 9:47 p.m.
Quarantine needs 4 mana to hit a permanent, 6 to hit two. I'd board it in against decks that like to go long, but utter end is almost strictly better if you're only going to be casting it to get rid of one key permanent, like a planeswalker or an enchantment. If you're going to be targeting creatures, Stasis Snare is pretty powerful due to its relatively efficient cost.
February 14, 2016 10:53 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #17
True, true. Maybe 1 Quarantine Field maindeck to compliment the others, not being too bad on its own and still having hope for a tempo topdeck when you really need it to hit a lot?
February 14, 2016 11:35 p.m.
Do you think I should -1 a Crush of Tentacles and +1 a Languish?
February 15, 2016 8:17 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #19
Probably not... For me, Crush is a bomb. It works great with your ETB creatures that bounce things. Languish... It's more permanent, but that applies to yours too. Crush helps with your counterspells too, giving them more late game targets.
February 15, 2016 8:33 p.m.
AngelOfDivinity says... #20
I am not a fan of Anticipate, but do you think it might fit to help you pull up dragons for Invocation & Scorn? Beyond that this looks good, Personally I might suggest you side a full set of Thing in the Ice Flip since that card beats aggro.
April 4, 2016 5:45 p.m.
NotSquishedYet says... #24
Why Painful Truths over Read the Bones? It looks to me like win-more card advantage vs. refined card advantage and/or popping out of a bad spot, especially if you only have two colors.
April 10, 2016 12:40 p.m.
I picked Painful Truths due to the fact that almost all pro esper decks pick it over Read the Bones. Personally, I think they are very close, almost interchangeable, but I tend to side with the pro's since they seem to know what they are doing. Thanks for the question!
polydamas says... #1
Hallowed Moonlight or Rising Miasma?
January 28, 2016 2:37 a.m.