I was mulling some ideas over in my head and I wanted to ask if you think Abrade is worth a possible slot in Animar's 99, or perhaps even just in the sideboard?
My initial answer would be NO, because a 2 mana reactionary spot-removal spell in the splash color isn't typically the sort of thing that Animar wants to be spending cards slots on. But I began to think about all the potential targets it hits and started to think that it might be worth a second look. The most useful thing about the spell for Animar is that it takes care of both Torpor Orb and Hushwing Gryff. Considering that Animar likes to have Stax decks in the pod but hates seeing those two cards would make Abrade a possible sideboard option for when a BloodPod deck shows up. On top of that, it also hits a few other cards that Animar would like to get rid of if possible; like Hermit Druid and Laboratory Maniac in FlashHulk, Isochron Scepter in control decks, and Aetherflux Reservoir in Storm builds.
There have been times where I have considered running Chain of Vapor in Animar but in the end I always decided that it was never worth using as removal because it gave opponents the option to turn it around and use on Animar. Abrade doesn't have that risk, and provides an answer for a wide enough range of threats for only one card slot that I thought it might be worth bringing up as a consideration.
It's hard to decide what would be worth taking out for Abrade though. In all the testing you have done, do you think you've ever been in match-ups where you would think that it would be worth boarding in (and if so, what would you takeout)?
March 7, 2018 7:16 a.m.
Abrade is interesting in that you get a lot of versatility but the cost is really undesirable. HOlding up 2 mana just plain isnt what we want to do; holding up 1 mana is already annoying even if its for an on-theme card like Glen or Stormtamer.
In particular, I've found Caustic Caterpillar does more than half of what you say about abrade, but share the downside of requiring you to hold up 2 mana. the upside, and the reason i play it over any non-creature options like Naturalize, is that at worst, its just a 1CMC guy you can run out for a cheap Animar counter.
One cool card i've been considering in a similar capacity is Grim Lavamancer. He kills pretty much any problematic dork/hatebear/labman for only 1 CMC, and has the added upside of being a nice 1CMC creature himself. I'm storngly considering swapping him in for Rishkar in my build to fight an increasingly fast, combo-centric meta.
Basically, i'd say abrade is a bit pricey considering the cost and availability of on-theme options. I use ree counters, Glen, Stormtamer, Caterpillar, Ainok, Skite, Revoker and Drake for interaction (sometimes Brutalizer and Ulamog) and haven't needed more. Lavaman would def be my next choice though.
March 7, 2018 12:11 p.m.
I agree about Abrade's cost but I'm finding that Animar's current list of interaction isn't always enough, particularly when creatures are concerned. And it's not as though you need to leave mana up (like you would for a counterspell) to deal with cards like the Gryff, although you would if you wanted to use Abrade to potentially stop a combo. Still, if it looks like an opponent is about to combo and you aren't going to beat them to the punch then you may as well leave the mana up so that you don't just lose.
I've been testing against a FlashHulk build, and it's really annoying when they drop a turn 1 or 2 Hermit Druid and I just can't answer it before FlashHulk's next turn. I have the Phyrexian Revoker, Scavenging Ooze, Gilded Drake, Walking Ballista package that could all potentially stop an early Hermit Druid but I'm just not drawing them as often as the FlashHulk Deck can consistently get its combo pieces.
I suppose you can just consider this to be me venting. I'd really like to hear if you find that Grim Lavamancer works for you, although I'm guessing that you would mostly have to fuel it with Fetchlands in the early game? Animar doesn't really dump a lot of cards into its graveyard by choice.
Here's hoping that Dominaria will bring Animar some new goodies when the set comes out.
March 8, 2018 2:28 a.m.
Well to be honest, Hulk is just plan better at fast combo. having a 2 and a 3 CMC "i win" card neither of which need anything else on board to win is just nuts. Animar will alaows have the limitation of needing to cast the commander early, which is why I'd never rank it better than tier 2, personally.
All that considered, I'm currently trying some very spicy stuff. after some soul searching, I've decided to try cutting Earthcraft. I ended up comboing out with it maybe half a dozen times ever, and the value it can generate is both outweighed by needing to fetch basics AND not super relevant in a deck with no trouble making mana like Animar. Feels bad to remove a combo line, but statue is just that good.
Another potential cut would be Rishkar. He's very good at cooking up mana for us, but being a post-animar ramp spell is never that great. i've been looking for ways to shave some of my mana generators in place of draw/interaction, and he's the weakest link.
Finally, I'm considering cutting Kozi. He does a lot for the deck, but we don't really need a top-end creature in a format like cEDH. Free draw and board contro are both fantastic, but i'm not sure i wouldn't prefer a cheaper option.
So that's three possible cuts to test. None that I'm super happy about, but I'm always looking for places to add more meta-interaction.
Grim is at the top of the list for possible adds, but the requirement of exiling two is def intimidating. Honestly I'd only really need to fire him off once or twice and not necessarily on turn 2-3, so i think he may be a good addition, but we'll see.
Sylvan Safekeeper seems really spicy to me, even without considering the synergy with Grim. Sure you can't protect Statue with his bounce trigger on the stack, but you can def keep animar or another crucial piece safe.
The third potential add is GSZ, which i keep adding and cutting from month to month whenever i find a cool new green tech creature. Arbor at 0, Sylvan at 1 CMC, ScOoze and Fauana Shaman at 2... sounds dece. I've always hated paying CMC+1 for a limited selection of non-game winning cards, but we may be approaching critical mass of really strong hate cards.
Finally, with earthcraft gone, i'd be interested in revising the lands a bit. One basic island can take a cut, and the pains are prob worht shaving while were at it. potential replacements include:
Arbor for island. comes with GSZ. sometimes enables turn 2 animar.
Tainted citadel, which is basically just another gold land since we never use out life outside Library.
Grove of the burnwillows, since my meta isn't all Naus all the time anymore (thnaks to bloodpod and Hulk for that)
Gemstone Caverns: always seemed sketchy since a land that makes colorless feels real bad, but could theoretically enable turn 1-2 animars, or at least help cast early 2-3 CMC stuff before Animar gets powered up. Decent Sylvan Safekeeper food too. Worth a test.
if gemstone sucks, I'm curious to try Exotic Orchard. Forbidden is great but i hate giving away blockers, so it's out, but it's brother is kinda promising, especially since everyone loves 4-color and Green now. Blue is basically guaranteed, and G should be easy to get at a table. Worth a test at least.
So what do you think? have you also been feeling a little unimpressed with Earthcraft and Kozi? Is it finally time to kill a few darlings as the meta speeds up? Curious to hear the experiences of ogher Animar guys.
March 8, 2018 11:28 a.m.
When Ancestral Statue first came out I took out Earthcraft, because the Statue did in one card what I needed three cards to do (bounce creature + earthcraft + basic land). I didn't miss it that much and only put Earthcraft back in as I started trimming other fat from the deck. The non-creature combo cards don't actually show up that much for me because they are outside the usual tutor chains that Animar uses. There has been the odd time that Earthcraft has given me the mana to play solitaire for a turn and combo out, but the times I naturally draw into it are few and far between. I rarely see Cloudstone Curio too, although I don't think that I would ever take that out. In fact, if you are trimming cards, perhaps it's worth looking at Trophy Mage to help make the Curio more accessible?
Rishkar didn't impress me when I gave it a test run. Whenever I cast it, I usually wished it was something else. The ramp it offers is nice but I found Animar didn't really need that mana. I suppose it helped when Animar died and I needed to rebuild him quick, but he always felt lackluster if Animar already had at least two counters. With two counters Animar is usually set to threaten a win the following turn, and at that point I was usually looking to cast a creature that let me draw more cards or tutor for something.
I also don't run Hardened Scales for the same reason. Unless you are trying to rebuild Animar after it died, I found that the extra counters didn't help speed up Animar's clock that much. Since Animar doesn't need that many counters to combo off I found that the counters from Hardened Scales quickly became redundant. Most of the time, just having a 1-drop creature to play instead of Hardened Scales got me to where I needed to be. In terms of ramp options, if I had to choose between the Scales or Bond Beetle I would probably take the Beetle 4 times out of 5.
Kozi is a little harder for me to cut because I've found being able to get cards off him to be really helpful on a number of occasions. I can understand the argument for cutting him, but I've always liked having him as a possible target for Fierce Empath during those times where I'm trying to basically storm off and I want the cards more than I want Ulamog. In theory, a creature like Soul of the Harvest could fill that role, but I've been in situations where not having to pay the double green let me leave up a Tropical Island to cast a card like Peregrine Drake if I drew into it.
The deck doesn't lose anything vital if Kozi is taken out but I think it would lose a useful option, so I would base the decision on your own situational experiences. It's one of those cards where its value is at least moderately affected by play-style.
Why can't you use Sylvan Safekeeper to protect Ancestral Statue with the bounce trigger on the stack? The bounce trigger doesn't target, so it should be fine to give the statue Shroud then let the trigger resolve. The only bounce creature that doesn't work for is Man-O'-War.
GSZ is meh because your search options probably mean you are using it as a reactionary card instead of a progressive one, but I would give it higher points if Sylvan Safekeeper and Dryad Arbor are also in the deck. Without the Safekeeper I think that something like Brainstorm would be better for digging for combo pieces.
March 8, 2018 5:59 p.m.
Def some good input here. I think Earthcraft is prob a safe cut, since it feels pretty win-more without needing the extra win. its just to tough to set up.
Cloutstone is also def staying in; its worth having a solid backup midrange plan, and durdling around with value guys can keep you in a grindy game surprisingly well.
Rish is def strong ramp and can do cool stuff like tap animar and glen for mana, but the deck doesnt really need it.
Scales is actually one i really like. There are def games where making a big beater will be more than enough to KO an ad naus player or just kill a guy with commander damage. ugly, but it works. more crucially, it is a great way to rebuilt when Animar gets killed, as you say. it'd def be better in a midrangey build, but it can dig you out of a bad spot, and the ceiling is sky-high for 1 CMC.
Kozi is an interesting case. Its not easy to make a logical case for him, but he does a lot of little things well. Feels wrong to cut him, despite people always telling me to do so. I'll prob keep the guy around.
Statue doesnt target? holy shit youre right. i had just assumed. thats so sweet. definitely gonna enjoy that interaction.
GSZ is another one i'll prob end up cutting like i always do, but the thought of adding safekeeper made me want to try it again.
Since it seems like we're on the same page here, I went and looked at your list again and have a few ideas i wanted to run by you:
How's kiki going? I've always found it a little clunky and unnecessary given how easy it is to set up Statue. but i'd be super curious to her how its going for you. is there a play pattern im missing, or do you just do the old Modern play of flashing in the untapper then mainphasing kiki? Your package seems to be the two untappers, zealous and kiki. are any of those cards dead outside the combo? do you get utility out of the untappers?
alright, last thing: Scryb Ranger is something i've always found neat. is it good utility or just a pet pick? is there a sweet combo line im missing?
March 8, 2018 7:33 p.m.
In regards to my inclusion of the Kiki package, you'll have to keep in mind that I don't get the chance to play in a lot of really competitive pods. That's why I like picking your brain in regards to your game experiences.
That being said, I'm the type of person who likes having multiple backup plans. In the groups I play with I'm used to being focused down and the easiest way to do that to Animar is to pick on the commander. I needed an efficient combo package that could win the game without Animar, and Kiki gave me a lot of side interactions that I could benefit from.
Pestermite and the Exarch double as more "free" creatures for Cloudstone Curio and they often get to double as rituals when used to untap Bloom Tender or Gaea's Cradle. Cast at the end of the opponent's turn, I use them to tap down counterspell mana, creatures that may be able to block an attack from Animar, cards like Mana Vault or Grim Monolith that opponents have been saving, or sometimes I just purposefully act like playing them is a "Gotcha!" play to freak out my opponents and bait counterspells or sometimes even the odd concession.
The Conscripts would be the first I would cut from the package, but they do enable some interesting plays that can catch my opponents out of nowhere. One of the plays I like to use is:
Birthing Pod -> Sac 2CMC creature to get Pestermite/Exarch -> Untap Pod -> Sac Pestermite to get Glen Elendra Archmage.
Now I can sit on the archmage and if my opponents don't do anything that forces me to sac it at least once, then on my next turn I can sac the archmage to get the Conscripts, which untaps pod, then sac the archmage again for Kiki.
I've also used the conscripts to steal my opponent's blockers, take cards like Aven Mindcensor that are preventing me from tutoring, or to give Kozi haste the turn I cast it so that I can swing for the annihilator trigger right away.
In my mind, Eldritch Evolution is the card that made Kiki a lot more viable in Animar. There are a number of easily accessible 3CMC creatures that can suddenly become a Kiki, including Animar itself if necessary (not my first choice, but if Animar has died a couple times already and I have a mostly empty hand then I consider it an option).
People often talk about how the mana requirement of Kiki makes him too slow, but I've rarely had that problem. There have been a lot of times where I've only had two red sources, but I would just cast a Pestermite to untap one of them for the third red mana I needed. With Eldrich Evolution and Birthing Pod, as well as the Magus of the Moon that I keep in the sideboard for against mana greedy decks (like 4-color FlashHulk), I don't have that many issues. On his own Kiki isn't overly impressive, but there are enough ETB creatures to net value off him if the game starts to go to the mid-game.
One of the plays I like to do if I have both Kiki and Pestermite in hand is cast Kiki first and use it to target Imperial Recruiter to copy (assuming it isn't countered). That gives opponents a choice; kill the recruiter before I can tutor up the other piece of the combo they think I need, or try to kill Kiki and risk whatever else I end up tutoring for off the resolved trigger. In the end the point is to bait the removal and cast the Pestermite in response to untap the Kiki and combo off. If the combo is stopped, I'm usually either left with Kiki still on board or a resolved trigger that lets me tutor up an Eternal Witness to give me a second shot.
As for the Scryb Ranger, I have it for its utility but some of that utility comes from the fact that I run Kiki. If I try to combo off with Kiki and an opponent uses some instant speed removal, then I can flash in the Ranger in response to untap Kiki and finish comboing off before the removal spell resolves. Aside from that, The ranger can basically act as a mana dork on any turn you don't have a land to play by bouncing a forest you tapped for mana so you can replay it, which can also help with mana fixing if you bounce a Tropical Island or Taiga. This is awesome when having to fight through Stax effects like Winter Orb or Stasis, helping Animar get that little bit ahead of everyone else. Being able to untap Bloom Tender, or any other mana dork, is also a large bonus. Having Protection from Blue has proven oddly relevant in a number of 1v1 games that I've played.
March 8, 2018 10:16 p.m.
Hmm, so the way i see it, kiki is still mainly a backup plan, and while the untappers can be useful, they prob wouldn't be played in the deck without kiki himself. I've always maintained that the main issue with including kiki was that it added 3-4 dead cards to the deck. the conclusion i came to was that keeping those slots open for meta tech or just plain speed served me better and led to fewer dead draws, which have always been a problem for a deck with little native draw power. the thing about it costing RRR is definitely a RED herring, since we have access to tons of great gold lands, which i find essential to landing an early animar. Evo is a fantastic one I hadn't considered in that capacity though.
If your pod packs excessive wraths or non-WB removal i could see needing kiki, but i play against Kess Storm, Thras/Tymna Hulk, Blood Pod, Gitrog and a few diff Zur decks, none of which can afford to kill Animar very often, so he dies maybe 2-3 times in a bad game. It doesn't hurt that I have glen, skite, stormtamer and counterspells also preventing that. It's prob a meta/play-style thing, but i'm still not sold.
I did finally order a set of Kiki cards, so I'll be trying it out in my meta soon. will report back!
March 8, 2018 10:35 p.m.
oh also: Pod. I've always found it clunky, prob bc i dont have a kiki line to pod through. with all the good green tutors, it always just seemed pricey, and came down at an awkward point in the curve. def worth considering to test alongside kiki tho.
March 8, 2018 10:37 p.m.
I don't see the untappers as dead cards on their own, I like the options and responses they offer, but if you are running them without Kiki then you are choosing them over having more redundancy, which is probably not the right call for the sake of optimization. I have no intention of arguing that mine is the most optimized build, because it isn't. My list is a worksheet of what I have in paper, so there are a number of cards that I would like in there that I don't have (like Sylvan Tutor). I just like the versatility and some of the surprise factor that my list offers because I tend to get bored of decks that are too linear in their game plan. My list still goldfishes consistent turn 4-5 wins, and the Kiki combo sometimes offers me my fastest wins. For example:
Turn 1) Land + mana elf. Turn 2) Cast Lotus Cobra, then drop and crack a fetchland to net 2 mana off the Cobra + 1 off the land to cast Pestermite. Turn 3) Drop and crack another fetchland for 3 red mana and cast Kiki to combo.
It's a pretty specific selection of cards, but I've pulled it off a couple of times. There was at least one other turn 3 combination that I pulled off, but I think Lotus Cobra was crucial to that one as well.
As for the Pod, I often find myself using it in the process of storming off (I usually have a ton of mana and just need a way to get a key creature out of my deck) or as an enabler if Animar is out of commission (damn you Gilded Drake). I don't think "clunky" is the word I would use to describe it, because it has generally worked itself smoothly into the lines of plays I've made, but if you were to say "potentially slow to get it into play" I'd agree. Once it's in play though, I generally have few complaints. I've had less issues with it that I have with Chord of Calling at any rate. I really want to replace that one with Sylvan Tutor.
Hoverguard Sweepers is another card I'm having issues with, and I can see why you eventually took it out. It offers a strong line of play, but it can take an amount of setup that I often find to be awkward to manage. The only reason it is still in my list is because without it I feel that Fierce Empath loses a good portion of its payoff. If I take out the Hoverguard, I want it to be replaced by a 6-7CMC creature that offers strong utility towards ending the game (I wish Animar had an effective way of utilizing Protean Hulk). I've considered the Brutalizer Exarch that you run, but I'm not convinced that it is the card that I am looking for. Bane of Progress is a possible meta-dependent option for the slot, but I don't think that's what I want for a generalized list.
There's a lot that I want the new Dominaria set to give us for Animar, so I sure hope that Wizards is listening! Cheap utility creatures and one or two on-color 6-7 mana competitive bombs please!
March 9, 2018 1:26 a.m.
I'll def try the kiki package out and see if it's a good fit. its definitely a strong way to win.
Regarding Hoverguard: yeah, def worth cutting. the wincon is plausible but way to hard to set up. it ended up winning me maybe one in every maybe 20+ games. pass.
Empath, however, doesn't need the help. You've got Kozi and Ulamog for different purposes, both the Enchantresses (i run both, still works fine with one), and of course, Brutalizer. I was definitely skeptical as well, but he ended up being is a very useful part of the deck. removal or tutoring that works well with our top-deck manipulation/draw and can fit neatly into a lot of storm lines. try it and i think youll see what i mean!
Dominaria could be great. we've seen 2/3 of the set by now, and without spoiling it, i'll say we're def getting one very strong ramp option!
March 9, 2018 12:34 p.m.
Frank_Glascock says... #13
JMCraig, one advantage of having your own thread is you are THE MAN. I wouldn't mind if you spoiled the creature.
March 9, 2018 8:12 p.m.
Oh, man, it's better than i could've imagined:
Spicy spoiler!! Show
I'll be pre-ordering my foils basically ASAP!
March 9, 2018 8:26 p.m.
Fuck. I thought I was being super pro with my syntax. Anyway its a mox that adds one of any color among the legendary creatures+PWs you have in play. So Animar comes down turn 2, mox, play another guy that turn. Great for stuff like Bond Beetle into Skite, Safekeeper, or just a dork. Should be a very solid addition.
March 10, 2018 12:02 a.m.
I was pretty sure that was what you were referring to. It's too bad that the mox doesn't help get Animar out, but I like that it doesn't take a second card from your hand like the other moxes do. It should hopefully be able to speed up Animar's clock by 1 turn on average in the games where it comes down early, and I love that it gives perfect mana with Animar out. It's going to be an EDH card that makes lower CMC commanders that much more dangerous. It's up there with Bloom Tender for giving commanders like Animar, Marath, and Derevi some potent early-game ramp power and mana fixing.
There are a handful of cards in this set that I think will make their presence felt in EDH, although not all of them are likely to show up in a cEDH pod.
March 10, 2018 12:23 a.m.
Oh no doubt. Im hoping the "legendary matters" theme results in a few decent cards for decks that want their commander out. A Mox was honestly more than i would've expected! Hopefully we'll get a couple otuer neat hyper-efficient effects.
March 12, 2018 2:32 p.m.
ToffMcSoft says... #19
JMCraig - Enjoying your list, I had a very similar build and then tweaked it in a different direction.
The Meta I'm in is a huge COMBOWOMBO and I've been running into issues not being able to go off by Turn 4 or 5.
Any suggestions you'd make to Animar, Soul of Combos - Fun Police ?
March 12, 2018 6:10 p.m.
I'd remove the extraneous combos and high CMC creatres:
- Deadeye/Palinchron
- Kiki Combo
- Vig
- Consecrated Sphinx
- Void winnower
- Wanderer
Then shave the bad creatures:
- stunt double
- strat dancer
- sabetooth
- trophy mage
- rattleclaw
- joiner
- caryatid
- somberwald
Then the bad noncreatures:
- arcane denail
- counterflux
- cyclonic
- drain
- fluster
- pod
- greaves
- thran dynamo (?????)
- aluren
- growing rites
With those spots freed up, you can add a lot better interaction and speed. Have a look at my list, and those of a couple of the regular commenters on here.
March 13, 2018 12:39 p.m.
ToffMcSoft says... #21
Thanks for the response, out of curiosity - what generals are you mostly facing in your meta?
March 13, 2018 4:06 p.m.
Kess storm, Thrasios/Tymna Breakfast Hulk, Zur DDay, Gitrog combo, Blood Pod. Sometimes we get a Kiki Jiki deck, but its mostly those guys. All maxed out builds, pretty much no budget concessions (proxies are allowed).
March 13, 2018 5:25 p.m.
ToffMcSoft says... #23
Cool, pretty much the same as the meta I'm in, the only difference is instead of Gitgo & Blood Pod, we've got Narset & Teferi.
I've dropped a few of your suggestions to make the deck play faster. With the changes, more draw & lower cmc. From 3.47 to 3.13. I'd like to get under 2 CMC - most likely Consecrated Sphinx & Wandere are getting dropped.
I'm having trouble parting ways with any of the counter magic, most likely adding in Pact of Negation & Siren Stormtamer.
I'm having a real hard time with the decision of dropping:
Deadeye/Palinchron - Palinchron has saved me way too many times and tutors nicely off Fierce Empath
Kiki Combo - The easy win and very easy to tutor for.
Trophy Mage - Grabs Cloudstone
Void winnower - This card has won games, stalls them big time and really has helped.
March 13, 2018 5:52 p.m.
Countermagic: Animar doeesn't ever want to hold up mana, so I stick to the three free options (force pact and misstep) plus the two good on-board guys (glen and tamer). That, plus the amount of proactive stuff you can do (skite, negator, ScOoze, caterpillar etc) have been more than enough to hold a table in check for a little while. You cant play full control or anything, but if a certain deck needs to be stopped, you can usually tutpr up glen and keep that under control. I often find myself using an early Glen to keep something like Hulk on the back foot long enough for my combo to come together. Playing 2 CMC counters in particular really hurts your momentum, and your proactive stuff can usualyl just do a better job.
Deadeye/Palinchron: it's slow and janky. No idea how this is saving you when you can Empath into something like Ulamog2 or Brutalizer Exarch. Both parts don't do anything on their own, and together they make infinite mana which you dont need to spend. These slots should probably be more ways to get your statue online or techy meta answers.
Kiki: you know whats easier than tutoring for Kiki+Untapper? tutpring for statue and then making a giant animar. that alone is an easy enough way to kill at least one guy, and you can spend the other tutor on ballista if you need it. This way also you don't need 3-4 dead slots in the deck, since all the parts of the kiki combo are pretty dead outside the combo.
Trophy: I know it gets cloudstone. But then you need 2 other pieces and need animar on board. cloudstone is only good when the game gets grindy and you need a solid value plan, but this isnt a scenario you should be tutoring into in most games. again, commit to the Statue win, it's way faster and easier than anything else you can do.
Void Winnower: i get the appeal, but animar isnt a deck that wants to stall the game. other decks are better at breaking parity in stalled games and better at establishing control. If animar is on 4+ counters, why nbot use this slot for a tutor and just win the game?
The big takeaway here is something that took me a long time to figure out: The deck wins by getting statue out. once animar is on 3-4 counters, getting and protecting statue is your only goal. Thats why the big creatures are unnescessary, bc nothing you can do is as powerful as just winning. You can try to establish board control or make infinite mana, but you have to remember, that deck slot could be used for more ways to get statue out. Figuring that out and tweaking my build accordingly as VASTLY improved the deck's speed and consistency. When i say animar isnt a "big mana" or a "big creature" deck, this is exactly what i mean; its an Ancestral Statue deck, and that's why its in the name!
March 13, 2018 8:42 p.m.
@ToffMcSoft So just to summarize some of the key points that JMCraig covers above and has discussed with me in the past regarding playing Animar:
1) You want to maximize your chances of being able to cast Animar on turn 2.
2) Ancestral Statue is such a ridiculous card in Animar that your #1 game plan should always be to focus on getting it.
3) Animar isn't a ramp deck, it's more of a storm style combo deck. Animar functions better with a lot of small creatures than with larger ones.
4) Cheap creatures that net you mana in a way that either makes them free when you cast them or can possibly net you an increase in mana (like Cloud of Faeries and Tinder Wall) are premium cards in Animar, with some being better than others.
5) Animar is an aggressive deck that tries to hit its combos as quickly as possible. Holding up mana to respond to opponents is wasting mana that should be put into progressing your board. That's why the only counterspells worth playing are the once that let you cast them for free, and why Animar tries to run cheap creatures that double as pieces of interaction.
6) The big creatures in the deck should all be a part of a combo or get you to a combo. Big utility creatures that stall out the game aren't as efficient options as cards that make getting your combo pieces easier.
7) As you tinker with your deck to improve consistency and speed up the average turn that you are able to combo off, you'll find that the colored mana requirements for combos like Deadeye Navigator + Palinchron starts to feel restrictive and awkward. (It's the same with the Hoverguard Sweepers combo line too. JMCraig and I discuss it a little further up in the comments.) If your Animar deck is comboing off on turn 6 on average you won't notice it as much, but when you get the deck down to averaging a turn 4-5 win you will definitely start to feel how the heavy dependence on having a bunch of blue mana will start to hold you back.
There are other points too, but those ones are a good framework to start with.
As a side note; I don't necessarily follow this advice as strictly as JMCraig does, and my deck is certainly the less efficient version due to that (I still run Kiki combo). I have some slightly different expectations of how I want my deck to play so I build my deck in a bit of a different direction. But if you are looking for better tournament results, JMCraig's advice is what you want to follow. Every time I decide that I don't like something in my deck, the most efficient replacements always end up making my deck look a little more like the one listed above. I'd love for future cards to open things up for Animar and offer a couple of different viable builds, but for the time being it's best to just focus on the Ancestral Statue line of play in cEDH metas.
JMCraig says... #1
Depends on the pod obviously.
With a good stax or control deck, i win 1/N games or more, where N is the number of ppl playing. The opposing stax hit most other combo decks harder than Animar, so I can outrace them. I always grab animar when our Blood Pod guy shows up, for example.
With a pod of high-tune combo decks, my ratio is a bit lower. Animar isn't the fastest deck among stuff like Grixis Storm, Gitrog and Flash Hulk, so i have to let those decks fight each other and sneak wins when I get an opening. These are the hardest matchups.
In a pod featuring mostly untuned decks or midrange/combat decks, I can pull easy wins. Animar is obviously the fastest and our redundancy and consistency makes it trivial to push Statue through.
Another factor is obviously opponents' skill/experience with the deck. we're off-axis enough that some people won't know what interaction to use or when to use it. For example, what would you use against Animar: Ethersworn Canonist or Rule of Law? Hint - one kills us, and one gives us a free win!
All this averages out to a competitive but not top-tier deck. We win a little less than most optimal combo decks, but in the right situations the deck is fantastic. IF i'd have to bin it, prob tier two: strong but not top tier.
February 22, 2018 11:32 a.m.