Sisay has the answers | * Hibernation * | Primer

Commander / EDH PartyJ

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enpc says... #1

I would look into Reap and Sow over exploration. It gets you lands like Gaea's Cradle, can destroy opponenet's lands and with only 34 lands in the deck, feels more relevant. Either that or put Azusa, Lost but Seeking (back) in as you can tutor her.

December 14, 2015 7:13 p.m.

Marenkai says... #2

@enpc: Exploration is a better ramp card in every aspect.

It's a 1-drop that can ramp you to your 4th mana by turn 2, and a turn 2 Sisay is much harder to deal with than a Turn 3-4 Gaea's Cradle. Sisay can then tutor for cradle, but I think that there are better things to tutor for like Yisan. Cradle is just the icing on the cake, no need for it in every game, so adding a card that costs 4 mana JUST to tutor for a land is pretty much a downgrade.

Also, I'd rather play Expedition Map or Sylvan Scrying every day over Reap and Sow which is just bad as a ramp spell, bad as a land bust, bad as a Tutor and a bad Magic Card in constructed overall.

December 15, 2015 12:07 a.m. Edited.

enpc says... #3

Marenkai: No it's not. Exploration works well when you have a high land count and/or constant card advantage. If you don't have at least one (or realistically both), Exploration's power is reduced. And in a vacuum, it doesn't actually ramp.

As for the use of Gaea's Cradle, this card is a staple in just about every game. Yisan, on the other hand is actually quite a slow card in Sisay. And while Sisay can tutor up Cradle, not having to waste a Sisay tutor while still getting it and into play is incredibly powerful.

As someone who has played against a Sisay deck much faster than this one I can tell you your assumptions on Yisan, Cradle and Reap and Sow are incorrect once you get to a more competitive level of play.

December 15, 2015 1:46 a.m.

PartyJ says... #4

Thank you both Marenkai and enpc for your valuable thoughts. Whatever the outcome will be, a good discussion can only add value to any deck.

Let me first be clear about why I added Exploration; after many games I felt that I was never lacking mana, but I was lacking speed. I want to make this deck faster, so that Captain Sisay gets out sooner on a more constant pace. The bigger ramp, thus more danger, will give me a huge advantage in our meta. Since control and counter decks are a huge threat to me here.

Having Exploration could mean in the ideal situation that Captain Sisay could enter the battlefield by turn 2. I know that will not happen all the time, but adding this card brings me a step closer to this purpose. My feeling is that Azusa, Lost but Seeking comes too late for this purpose.

If there are other cards in this deck, like Yisan, the Wanderer Bard which you feel too slow, then please advise me. Since the key element I wish to address is more ramp and carddraw to generate a huge advantage over my opponents who keep pounding my side of the battlefield, since I attract a natural hate playing this build. I also experienced that Captain Sisay is usually targetted into oblivion. This is why I added extra carddraw engines to deal with her absence....

December 15, 2015 3:40 a.m.

Marenkai says... #5

Competitive level ? In multiplayer ?! xDD

Joke aside, I really think reap and sow is lacking compared to more mana efficient spells like Sylvan Scrying.

If you want cradle to be of any use when you fetch it on R&S, you need at least 5 creatures on board, which isn't the easiest thing to do in multiplayer.

You won't be able to gain advantage if you can't pay back the cost of your spell with cradle. If your opponents let you gain enough board presence to actually make it viable, you should play with other people or teach them how to play efficiently, because that's a beginner's mistake... :/

December 15, 2015 4:59 a.m.

enpc says... #6

The thing about Reap and Sow though is that early game it's ramp but late game gives you options. I would much rather draw a mid to late game Reap and Sow over a mid to late game Sylvan Scrying.


As for the discussion around making the deck faster, well that one is a lot more involved. But let's see what I can get through in this post at least.

The issue with the deck is (and I think that I may have mentioned this before) that you have cards which while are nice, don't actually help with the overall speed and power of the deck.

For example, Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger. While you might say "but hey, he's a super powerful legendary creature that locks down my opponent's mana and ramps me" and while all of this is true, at the end of the day, he's not worth running. Because realistically he's going to slow the board down for 1-2 turns (if he even sticks) and he's only a 7 power creature.

Same with Hokori, Dust Drinker. Chances are, you'll cast it and some player will wait until just before their turn, kill it and gain some kind of advantage. And you don't have enough land untappers/land in general to abuse the stax effect provided.

I don't know your meta but off the top of my head, you have too much artifact/enchantment hate in your deck. Or at least the wrong ones. Realistically, Aura Shards is not good in your build. I run a Saffi Eriksdotter deck specifically designed to abuse ETBs and it's still not good enough for my deck which should excel in making it work. Most of the time you only really care about one permanent which you need to kill and Nature's Claim is one of the best choices.

Again, I don't like Seedborn Muse or Elvish Piper. Yes, I get the combo with them and Sisay but if you're having enough trouble keeping Sisay on the battlefield, what chance do you have of assembling all three? and if you do, at that point it's just win more. You're better of just running more ramp. This way you can outpace your opponents. Because a couple of 5/5s on turn 6 is nothing compared to a Kozilek, Butcher of Truth on turn 6. More ramp lets you do that.

You have more than enough recursion that you don't need Yomiji, Who Bars the Way. You're not running Mindslaver, he's a waste of a card. And remember, you're a toolbox deck. Don't go to heavy on the same effect unless it directly relates to you winning the game. And if all else fails, just pitch Kozilek, Butcher of Truth to Fauna Shaman (who should be Survival of the Fittest) for the reshuffle of your graveyard.

Alpha Authority and Aspect of Mongoose seem bad. While I get what you're trying to do, You run into the issue where you have to play Sisay, THEN enchant her without her dying. And to your opponents, a well timed removal spell is effectively two-for-oneing you. You'd be better off running more global protection or things like Sylvan Safekeeper.

Do you generally have a problem with flying? If not, Arashi, the Sky Asunder should just be more ramp. Then you can just get an Avacyn, Angel of Hope and hey presto, instant air superiority.

Voice of Resurgence is out of place here. Unless your meta is full of mono-blue decks, it isn't relevant at all unless you can abuse the death trigger (which you can't) so it's just a generic creature. And why would your opponents care about it when they can just ignore it and win. Much easier. Considering I've had games where I've done more than 15 damage to myself in the name of card advantage/ramp, a 4/4-5/5 or however big it gets is irrelevant.

I don't like Heroes' Podium, especially since you're neglecting better card advantage in place of it. At the point where you're going to actually be sinking mana into it (i.e. the 4-5 mana range), Ring of Three Wishes just seems better. And while the buff is nice, unless you have a bunch of legendary creatures on the battlefield, the buff is only going to be comparable to one extra big beater worth of power, say Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre. And I know I would rather have an Ulamog and a slightly small creature swing compared to two slightly larger creatures.

Ajani, Mentor of Heroes is ok, but I honestly think you can do better. I know I keep saying this but I'm going to say it again (and then further down again) - just replace him with more ramp.

Here's the thing about ramp, you can never have enough. If you keep on saying that you want your deck to be faster, then make it faster. There are always things you can do - Farseek will get you shocks/ABURs/buddy lands, Sakura-Tribe Elder is a permanent that can be brought back by Sun Titan and can add to Gaea's Cradle count, Dryad Arbor adds to cradle, is a spare creature you can pitch to Survival of the Fittest (seriously, it's that much better than Fauna Shaman) and can be gotten turn one with Green Sun's Zenith (also you should run this). Mind Stone is another turn 2 play that can be card advantage and can be brought back with Sun Titan for extra value. Avacyn's Pilgrim is not only a creature but gives you white since you need green to play him. Turn one ramp is great.

As for Sisay protection, you either want equipment which doesn't die when sisay does or protection that's there before she comes down. Sylvan Safekeeper is a great card for this and synergises with Titania, Protector of Argoth (which you should run the crap out of) for an instant army. On top of that, put Wooded Foothills and Flooded Strand into your deck to get you Temple Garden / Canopy Vista and to help fuel Titania. Long term they work well with Crucible of Worlds too. You should also run a Knight of the Reliquary as she "ramps" but can land fix and again with Titania is a very quick army.

The other thing is you need to up your land count. 37 is the right amount. Remember, you already have Untaidake, the Cloud Keeper (which I am not a fan of) and Gaea's Cradle which are conditional tappers leaving you with only 32 guaranteed lands. That's too low. Even with the partial paris mulligan, you don't have a sustainable amount. And the other thing is, if you have to mulligan every opening hand just so that it's playable, then your deck is lacking. Its bad deck building and more than that, not everywhere plays with the partial paris ruling (I know my play group doesn't).

Honestly, I think that if you cut away the more niche legendaries which are cool and all but you don't actually use and replace them with more ramp then you can just get to the big stuff faster. And you can use cards like Kozilek, Butcher of Truth to refill your hand and beat with all at the same time.

December 15, 2015 8:28 a.m.

PartyJ says... #7

Based upon the previous discussion about having more ramp I made some drastic deck changes.

Thanks to Marenkai and enpc for all suggestions. Going for more ramp I agree with most of the suggestions and changed several positions.

Can't wait for some playtests this weekend xD

December 15, 2015 6:02 p.m.

enpc says... #8

It's looking much better. There are still a few changes I would make personally but those will come out in the wash with play testing.

Two cards I would highly recommend making a home for though - Horizon Canopy and Azusa, Lost but Seeking. Azusa is solid ramp and with Titania and crucible can be devastating. I have seen plays like Sylvan Safekeeper saccing Gaea's Cradle 3 times a turn and replaying it with Azusa an Crucible for insane amounts of mana. I know yo uused to run her and took her out but I think she warrants a spot again. I would cut Myojin of Life's Web personally.

As for Horizon Canopy, this card speaks for itself I think. Mana fixing, card advantage and combined with Titania the party just keeps going.

December 15, 2015 6:14 p.m. Edited.

PartyJ says... #9

enpc : You are right about Azusa, Lost but Seeking, reviewing her in this particular new build!

Pure madness is hitting my battlefield. I can't wait to see their faces xD Getting this amount of mana available justifies the swap with Myojin of Life's Web, as I expect to empty my hand sooner than before. Making this cards utility pretty much obsolete.

As for Horizon Canopy I agree as well, but this card will land on my wishlist as I do not have it yet.

Scouts en-route to find a proper candidate..

December 15, 2015 6:29 p.m.

K34 says... #10

Why aren't you running Iona? Does she cause you to get hated out of multi-player games?

December 19, 2015 11:12 a.m.

PartyJ says... #11

Hi K34 , you are right about that.

It just attracts too much hate in our group. I don't want to be that guy who is locking out players during a game. I want to win, but not that way... Same counts for infinite combo's. I avoid them.

What do you think about the possibilities I have on my 'Maybeboard'?

December 19, 2015 2:04 p.m.

K34 says... #12

I think Solemn Simulacrum and Command Beacon deserve play testing.

December 19, 2015 5:40 p.m.

Renoferoce says... #13

I like your deck. +1

Have you considered mirari's wake? Also in edh format one of my favorite ball buster is song of the dryads (great for removing oponent commanders out of the equation). Last addition I could see would be rune-tail, kitsune ascendant... I admit it is kinda cheap in commander since you start the game with 30 lives but it does give you a good advantage...

December 23, 2015 9:02 a.m.

PartyJ says... #14

K34 : Command Beacon can be implemented prety easily, but I'm having a hrd time with Solemn Simulacrum, since it ramps somewhat late in my opinion. I focus on getting my commander out earlier, something that Solemn Simulacrum won't help me with. Although I still see its potential. What would you swap it for?

Renoferoce : Thanks for the suggestions! Mirari's Wake I felt wasn't powerfull enough. Having 15+ ramp cards in the deck does the trick I feel. Song of the Dryads I have never even looked at! Seems like a interesting choice. To give you credits, please suggest it using the suggestions feature (link the card in a comment and tap the box) and I will add it to my maybeboard :-) I felt that Rune-Tail was not that good in EDH. I won't even have a clue what to swap it for....

December 23, 2015 7:04 p.m.

enpc says... #15

I think you've gotten to the point where you can comfortably cut Masako the Humorless. While the combat trick is nice, just play a vigilance effect instead. Heliod, God of the Sun is a nice mana sink. Or just play Avacyn :P she blocks good.

Also, is there a particular reason for Dromoka's Command? You've had it in your build for a while but it feels a bit sub par compared with other removal.

Also , with your categories I would recommend combining card draw and tutor into one and Garruk Wildspeaker should be under the ramp category as that's what you'll be using him for 99% of the time. I mean he only has a plus ability after all :P

December 23, 2015 8:44 p.m.

K34 says... #16

Yeah, Masako the Humorless seems to be the creature that does the least for you, I'd cut her.

December 23, 2015 10:14 p.m.

PartyJ says... #17

I had a good thought about the suggestions you mentioned enpc and K34. I believe that the suggestions you made could be a next step in perfecting this build. This is what I decided to do:

I had Vedalken Orrery in my mind for a while and I think this is the moment to give him some playtesting time. Any threat you are faced with could be dealed with accordingly; tap Captain Sisay to find something suited and play the card since you are allowed to with Vedalken Orrery. I find it amusing to even think about it.

Thanks guys.... another step on its way to perfection :-)

December 24, 2015 5:17 p.m.

wargodmogis says... #18

Have you thought of switching Voice of Resurgence for Kytheon, Hero of Akros  Flip? It fills the same roll as Dragonlord Dromoka, except it's only useful the first few turns until you can just drag Dromoka out of your deck with your commander.

December 26, 2015 12:17 a.m.

Daedalus19876 says... #19

Thoughts?

some_text

It's no exploration, but it might be worth tutoring for. We'll see another one for Gideon...

January 1, 2016 3:46 p.m.

Casey4321 says... #20

I think from your naybeboard. The only card I would desperately try to cram in somewhere is definitely Tooth and Nail because entwining it will blow the game wide open for you. Also if I may be so bold...I think Triumph of the Hordes is better than Overwhelming Stampede.

January 3, 2016 7:01 p.m.

ENZU says... #21

For the life of me I can't remember what I did to earn a special mention in your deck description section haha

January 6, 2016 12:23 p.m.

PartyJ says... #22

wargodmogis I agree that Voice of Resurgence is somwwhat lacking. Especially since it's only viable early in the game. But after some thoughts and some playtests I felt Kytheon, Hero of Akros  Flip is lacking as well. Too slow and inconsistent in this build. I have to think of something else :-)

January 11, 2016 5:49 p.m.

PartyJ says... #23

Daedalus19876 : Interesting tutorable enchantment :-) But I dont think it's very powerful in this toolbox deck. With only the top 3 to look at and few planeswalkers in the deck seems it would be lacking here. Since budget isn't a real issue I should be looking at more powerful options.

January 11, 2016 5:52 p.m.

PartyJ says... #24

A pretty bold move Casey4321 suggesting Triumph of the Hordes. I gave it some good thoughts and it seems im stuck in between ... Both cards have potential and I think both cards and be finishers in the right circumstances. They both are ideal in different situations. Perhaps they both deserve a spot in the deck?

Tooth and Nail could be the third kinda finisher for this style. Choices!!

January 11, 2016 5:57 p.m. Edited.

PartyJ says... #25

NewHorizons : You must have done something right xD

Thanks for your support and comments :-)

I'm still struggling with my current Maybeboard options ;-)

January 11, 2016 6 p.m. Edited.

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