you bring up a lot of good points.i may reconsider adding 1-2 Mind Rot as making sure your opponent has no hand is so important. If your meta is 50-50 currently, then try to have 1 answer to everything you may face game 1 in a given night. I ran 1x Anger of the Gods mainboard last minute over a 4th Hero's Downfall and it worked out right away killing lots of weenies. so maybe run 1x of that with 1x Mizzium Mortars to at least have an answer for everything mainboard game 1.

Mizzium Mortars currently is your only answer to the Baron. Consider (heavily) Devour Flesh main or side boarded.

That little card has saved me so many times, and it deals REALLY well with retarded Hexproof creatures. It helps a lot vs Naya, that is trying to ramp off their dudes with Sylvan Caryatid .

I miss Mind Rot so much, but I am having issues on what to drop. RDW seems to be my worst match up. How do you fare against it? How do you side board it? I usually drop all the Hero's Downfall and side in Pharika's Cure because fck you Ash Zealot .

Mind Rot seems to slow my game a bit, as I run more instant speed removal on Seize ALL the thoughts undefeated at FNM!! 4-0. But damn I miss it lol. Hymn to Tourach on born of the gods maybe? :D

I hear sharkudi on the Affliction's timing, but I found vs devotion decks that they need to think a bit more before dropping out their devotion on the board.

What also worries me about Mind Rot is the Loxodon Smiter . That card makes me rage usually lol.

Since my meta runs 2-3 Azorius, 4 Mono blacks, 2 RDW and several devotion decks, our kind of control is amazing lol

I hate missing land drops, and am kinda paranoid about it, which is why I am struggling with dropping from 23 lands to 22.

With last week's testing I find that an ideal hand is

1 Pack Rat 3 lands (one swamp at least!)2 removal spells1 Thoughtseize

What is your idea of a great hand?

Thanks sharkudi and Fizzz, it's good to have this discussion with you about how to set up and play the decks.

I'd love to run one of each of Mizzium Mortars and Anger of the Gods but if my UC is sitting in the sideboard I feel more comfortable having 2 of's thus increasing the chances of seeing it at about the right time, rather than it forever being buried at the bottom of my deck. I usually only run one of's when it's finisher's with a higher CMC and I want to see them late. In this deck's case that's Master of Cruelties and Sire Of Insanity .

I guess it something I need to play around with 2x Mizzium Mortars I think is a good idea- but I'll have to watch my local meta closely. I've seen more devotion rather than weenies, so possibly building up to an overload on Mizzium Mortars is the smartest play for me.

Hymn to Tourach would be fantastic for us wouldn't it?

You guys have really got me toying with trying to squeeze more removal in the deck, but what should I take out - Drainpipe Vermin .?? I'm split now 12 removal 12 discard.

The discard I think is the key component - even more so than the removal. I played 3 different RDW, and it is possibly our toughest matchup, but controlling the hand is the key - I won all of those matches. Mind Rot was brilliant, after Duress and Thoughtseize ; they can't refill their hand, time and time again they were frustrated at drawing lands. Slowly but surely I drew into my removal and my rats, picking off their stuff and then making bigger vermin taking them out of burn range, or being able to be killed via pumped up damage.

For me in opening hands - I want to see 2-3 lands but both colors there; and if I've got a bunch of discard I'm happy, I know that I'll get the removal to start picking them off, and if I don't I'll get my Mutavault in combo with my rats to deal with them that way. sharkudi said about making 2 Pack Rat in a turn is the way to play it and I couldn't agree more.

I think getting the deck balance right is the important thing; if you do then it's like my friend constantly tells me "trust your deck"; so that's what I do; make opponents feel the pinch from discard, then trust that you have enough of what you need that you will turn things over as you need them.

I've lost when I haven't been able to attack the hand; or I've let opponents recover their hand size. I agree removal around 14 wrecks the meta.... but for me giving them their options is worse. If I win close run games and I'm 3-6 life - who cares I still won.

I think Fizzz given you run 3 Masters, a slightly higher land count suits you well.

And Loxodon Smiter would have me spitting feathers if I saw it.... thankfully so far I haven't.

How do you guys feel about the slots taken by Drainpipe Vermin ?? I'm kind of on the fence about it at the moment.

sharkudi and Fizz what do you think of this option given to me by Boomwizard

Blood Scrivener - for me personally I've had decent success with Mind Rot to replace it with that, but how about a swap with Drainpipe Vermin ???

Pack Rat would lose a little from the instant buff the vermin provides, but he makes a good point about the synergy with Pack Rat and Sire Of Insanity - and could fix our top-decking and card draw situation.

The mini rat is just a spell that is there to make them discard one, at least I see it that way. Which is why I started to stray away from it.

The thing about having that much discard main boarded, if I am in a tough spot, and need to draw a removal spell, but I draw a discard spell... which is why I upped the amount of removal mainboard, and moved the discard to the sideboard (to be updated shortly) vs the control match ups that do not run that many critters.

Late game Mind Rot is awful late game (found that the hard way)... but it works wonders during the first 3-4 turns. Thoughtseize , Duress and then a Mind Rot is usually game over in our favor!

Master of Cruelties works as a removal spell too, if they have a gigantic beater, they will be forced not to attack because our dude has FIRST STRIKE madafaca.

I just pray that your meta keeps away from that damned elephant!!! Happy holidays :D

I'd've +1ed just from the name, but it looks like a pretty good build, too. Maybe a few little adjustments?

Shrieking Affliction is great, but even with so much discard, it's so easy to get rid of enchantments in standard. Definitely keep, but have a sideboard option.

Rakdos's Return and Master of Cruelties are amazing, and I'd play another Master, just in case some removal can get through the discard wall.

I'd make the sideboard put in more spot removal for early-game aggression, which seems popular. As for what you've got, however: Pithing Needle and Slaughter Games are must-haves for the sideboard, so those should stay. Definitely put in another Needle, though, for pesky planeswalkers. Burning Earth is good sometimes, but surely you could find a more versatile card that's cheaper? Erebos - yes yes yes a thousand times yes! Anything that will make Orzhov suffer is a good sideboard option, because it is fairly popular in standard, and should always be dealt with. Anger of the Gods is good, but you do run the risk of killing all your rats. I wouldn't say to take it out, though. And, the only thing I can say about Underworld Connections : Why is this not mainboarded?

Hope my advice is useful! +1 from me!

Yes, I too am starting to take away Drainpipe Vermin in favor of other cards mainboard. Love him, but he is the weakest link. And couldn't agree more; top decking a Mind Rot makes me want to cry.

Seconding the Pithing Needle suggestion. Too versatile and amazing not to run 2-3 SB. As for Burning Earth , most matchups where you'd bring them in, you'd rather have those needles or more removal. Also, please find a way to get Lifebane Zombie in the sideboard, he's just way too good against many tough matchups.

Burning Earth would kill us too right? Even against the control matchup, we have no real way of gaining back life, and we have 8-12 non basic lands :C

thuzra I do get that the card draw is something we need to mainboard, but the tough decision is what to ditch over it. Those 3 mana that we use is a removal spell, and late game we are trying to kill the board. I have been debating with my pillow over this for weeks.

I never burn the board with Anger of the Gods when I have rats in play, I discard it :). Anger of the gods helps me get through the aggro matches as it deals with:

-Voice of Resurgence and its token

-Fleecemane Lion

-all the creatures in RDW decks! :D <3

-all the dudes that help Gruul ramp up! Sylvan Caryatid , Elvish Mystic , Burning-Tree Emissary , Rubblebelt Raiders , Voyaging Satyr .

I would sideboard it for Underworld Connections in the control matchup now that I think of it :D

You have too much removal in my opinion. This deck gets destroyed by AEtherling and Pack Rat when you empty your hand of removal spells and their still on the board.

AJohnson9x and what would you suggestion be? Aetherling is something that a control deck would use, a deck that has little to no creatures other than the it.

So we would chain removals until he runs our of islands to exile it, or discard it earlier in the game.

Pack Rat has never been an issue for me, for the same reasons above. Probably after game one, Pack Rat would get to this deck, but after sideboarding, Anger of the Gods and Slaughter Games come in, completely negating the rat. Even a Pithing Needle for the mirror match up screws up the card.

Thanks Fizzz I was looking at Burning Earth last night and thinking the same thing. It's got to come out and be replaced with something more useful, less damaging to us. If those slots are for control I can up Pithing Needle and Slaughter Games , or as sharkudi says Lifebane Zombie .

thuzra I take your point on Underworld Connections I've gone from not having it at all, to putting it MB, to putting it SB....at this stage just trying out the options and seeing where it's best placed.

AJohnson9x thanks for the opinion for but the deck works pretty well with the removal quantity it has - low creature decks, need to be strong in other aspects, this works at board control from removal and hand control from discard. It's good as it is.

I take your point on Pack Rat that's why I run it - :) and AEtherling , but personally a comment that says this deck gets destroyed by either of those 2 cards ain't very helpful. EVERY DECK gets destroyed by those 2 cards (IF THEY"RE NOT DEALT WITH) and as Fizzz says this deck has plenty of answers for those 2.

Playtest it without the Mind Rot , switching it for Underworld Connections man, let me know if that works! (it did for me) :D

Fizzz / sharkudi- have updated mainboard and sideboard.

Dropping Drainpipe Vermin and 1x Dreadbore

+2 Devour Flesh +2 Underworld Connections

Sorry guys - for now am sticking with Mind Rot ; but now MB has a little more additional removal and important card draw.

Sideboard Burning Earth was a dumb move on my part so that's gone and with additional slots for the MB changes; have upped the number of removal - if heavy creature matchup Doom Blade and Ratchet Bomb - and upped Pithing Needle for the control matchups.

Would love you guys take on the changes. If you got the time. Thanks

Wainwright I use Operation Blitzkrieg!! and Barely Boros Aggro to test vs aggro... mainly because... these decks are stupidly fast O.o

I noticed that you dropped your Anger of the Gods from the main, aren't you worried about this match up?

Paranoid aside, I don't feel safe when I see a turn one Boros Elite if I am on the draw.

Thanks Fizzz i'll try those 2 decks out.

Anger of the Gods has always been in the sideboard never mainboard. Reason being that my meta isn't crammed full of absurd aggro. So i thought that Mizzium Mortars may be the better play in initially setting up the mainboard. Agree??

I could be wrong so maybe Anger is better MB than Mortars. If I happen to face off against aggro weenies or tokens then it would come in straight away along with Ratchet Bomb . Still just trying to find the best balance for the deck Game 1

That is precisely my issue, balancing for game 1. This deck sideboards like a boss, but game 1 is kinda iffy

Why not:

-1 Duress

+1 Thoughtseize

?

Being able to discard anything is pivotal to this deck!

I'll try Read the Bones over the connections for this week's FNM. Let's see how it goes :D

yes, excited to hear some results and how those bones vs UC performs for both of you. I added 2x Blood Scrivener to my build to help with draws. good luck.

Nicely done. I've seen a few discard decks on here, and even designed one myself, but this is by far the best I've seen.

I really like how you are using Liliana of the Dark Realms with Rakdos's Return and Pack Rat . Very creative but also potent.

I'm also a fan of your use of Anger of the Gods . I can see how it would be tremendously effective in this deck.

Without overdoing the praise, your sideboard is very nicely designed. The only change I would make would be Lifebane Zombie , although that would be a meta call for sure.

I'm curious to see how your deck matches up against mono-blue devotion. I think the mono-black matchup is very favorable, as well as the control matchup, as shown with your FNM results.

Perhaps switch Lifebane Zombie out for more anti-Gruul sideboard cards? Looking like the toughest matchup by far.

I'm not a huge fan of the Rogue's Passage from a competitive standpoint, but it does seem fun.

How did running two Underworld Connections work out for you? Did it seem like enough card draw, or would you consider upping it to three?

I'm a big fan of this deck, well done. Hopefully BNG will include some nice additions for it, and if it does I may design one of my own based of this. Good luck in the future!

thanks a lot tawclaw

Lifebane Zombie has been brilliant for me, it's perfect in the SB, surprisingly it can come in against a variety of decks, not simply Green or White, you mentioned mono blue for example and this is a case in point, it can't block him due to the intimidate, it stops AEtherling blocks.

Mono-blue has been tougher than mono-black - but it's still the same play, discard the threats and kill the board - it's pretty difficult to get on top of this deck via devotion strategies, because it can keep the devotion levels to a minimum.

I have a really nice G/B Rock deck, which also did well at FNM but struggled like hell against mono blue - whilst I didn't face Mono blue this time around I've playtested against the mono-blue guy at my LGS and he hated it - hahahaa

Underworld Connections has been great - I'm thinking about upping it to 3, but unsure what to remove - the quantity of discard and removal I kind of feel is fixed right now. My other consideration is swapping it for Read the Bones . Just need to play it a bit more competitively before I make the swap.

I like the thought of Read the Bones really digging through the deck - but Underworld Connections plays nicely if I bring in Erebos, God of the Dead from the SB.

I can't take all the credit for this deck - have had a lot of help from sharkudi - (the original creator) and Fizzz you should check their decks out too.

sharkudi / Fizzz still many thoughts on slow game one's - the deck speeds up games 2 and 3 (if needed) with the Sideboard.

What's you guys opinion's on this idea - I may drop Master of Cruelties and try to find space for 2 or 3 Liliana's Reaver try to keep the board clear, drop him - useful 4 damage, on field removal with deathtouch (useful blocker for Lili) and if hit's increases our board state and decreases opponents hand further.

Wainwright I have been testing that online and... unfortunately that would seem the way to go. I love the master, but he does not win the game on it's own as sharkudi said.

As painful as it is, he seems like the weakest link :c

Yeah - Fizzz I think that's going in, just as a 2 of for now - ideally to make a difference I think it needs to be 3 though I can't think for now what needs to come out.

It's so tight on the mainboard right now - not feeling like I can realistically drop anything.

How'd your playing time go, running the board with no card draw what so ever??

I feel like the deck needs the draw - maybe I'm wrong though.

Woohoo #2nd place! Congratulations! i'm one proud papa; thanks for the nod. Glad to see Sire Of Insanity taking out Esper as planned. Also good to see Underworld Connections working for you as well. Totally support removing Master of Cruelties as he was nothing but a let down for me the past 2 FNM's.

So glad to have you on board with the brainstorming and testing of ideas. Wish i could give you and Fizzz another +1 for all your help and enthusiasm. Going to keep play testing to find the right balance of card draw and perhaps creatures to support Pack Rat (looking at adding Liliana's Reaver again myself, as it did wonders in the mono-black version of this deck and makes Erebos, God of the Dead more playable mainboard). Did you ever find yourself top decking @ FNM?