You must feel like a proud dad seeing this deck, and versions of it stomping the current meta!

:D

@Fizzz sure am! I might add in a Master of Cruelties and mainboard 1x Anger of the Gods going forward.

also any help and suggestions with my EDH/Commander deck is much appreciated by anyone willing to help. deck-large:nautical-goddess-of-the-merfolk-wizards-1

sharkudi - thought it only fair to actually repost the comment from my deck to yours also; - I remember seeing your deck a while back - really great stuff, I'd been wanting to try and put together a modern discard deck, but just not enough of the great cards, which swung me back to standard. Dick Dastardly's Discard Deck!!

So far it's going well from a lot of matches (casually at my LGS) - it's a little slow in terms of how long it takes to win the game I've found, but it is effective and it does win, I'm hoping to make some changes then go to FNM over holidays with it.

Any recommendations man??? - you're deck is great.

Would you be able to maybe give me a few answers to some questions I'm thinking about.

Is 22 in the mana base right?? On tapped out people have said the get problems? But playing for real I've been mostly ok. (Also do I need to go more mountains?)

I cut some kill spells for added card draw - do you end up top-decking with your deck a lot?? Or should I just go with Discard and Removal??

Looking at your deck again, hopefully your experience of playing your deck longer - could help me when I go to FNM.

Hey, biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig upvote for your deck - was sick and tired of current meta in standard, and after seeing this one I couldn't wait to assemble similar deck, but B/U ! Maybe you could give it a quick look for ome advice on land count? Ransom for Your hand

Cool looking deck just wondering what is fueling your Pack Rat I see you have Underworld Connections in the maybe slot and I am sure you are aware of Read the Bones so was just wondering how the good ole Pack Rat runs in the brew, let me know thanks bud

Liliana of the Dark Realms is the fuel for pack rat!

heavily considering playing the mono-black version of the deck tonight at FNM. As much as i like this splash red version, the blacked out version seems to perform more consistently. Please, please check it out and let me know your thoughts!

I agree that with the card draw sort of thing. Your deck is ultimately a control deck, and it revolves around the concept of card advantage. Also, since you said you get manna screwed sometimes, card draw helps you hit land drops. Read the Bones is better for the sheer land-insurance that it gives you, and Underworld Connections is better for the long run. Check out the deck that Lukas Chaklovsky top 8'ed at Pro Tour Theros with.

I don't mean to sound patronizing or anything, but you always have to be aware against Esper/UW control of Detention Sphere killing everything named Pack Rat , so you never just jam one out, you have to have perfect information of their hand before you play it.

As far as Sire Of Insanity goes, it would be a fantastic sideboard card, but probably not mainboard. That's because of the 6 cmc, and you only get a 6/4 body out of it. And that ability can be irrelevant against certain matchups. Against any sort of creature deck matchup after the first game they'll know to play their threats as quickly as possible so they don't have to drop them. Against decks like U/W control, such as the deck Huey Jensen came in second with at Grand Prix Dallas, where they run Elixir of Immortality , Sphinx's Revelation , Divination , Jace, Architect of Thought and Quicken all mainboard it will only be a matter of time before they hit something that allows them to draw, so you're fighting an uphill battle, which is where Sire Of Insanity comes in handy. Also, they can't Sphinx's Revelation on your turn, or for full value because they have to leave 4 manna open to either Hero's Downfall (if it's Esper), Detention Sphere or Supreme Verdict Mr. Insanity to get him off the board and resume their gameplan. Honestly, one of the best things you can name with Slaughter Games is Sphinx's Revelation in a traditional control matchup.

Just some thoughts of mine =) feel free to seize them. Get it..?

Why not a scrylands instead of the guildgates. The scry lands are strictly better.

sorry. Forgot about the colors of the scry lands. Disregard the upper comment.

Have you thought about trying Chandra, Pyromaster would be nice for that extra card draw and that one more damage from her 1+ to finish them off after Master of Cruelty

Deathrite Shaman ?

Why do you still have Drainpipe Vermin as the featured card when you are no longer running it in the deck?

And what about card drawing? Don't you need some card drawing so you always have cards to discard to Pack Rat and always have removal ready? Read the Bones or Underworld Connections ?

That is what Lilianas +1 is used for, to feed the pack rats

Aaah, smart. But there is only two Liliana and she costs 4 mana...

In addition to what Jantz said, it may be better to just replace her with something that lets you draw off the top of your deck, as sometimes you'll get a spell you actually need, rather than another packrat. Erebos, God of the Dead and Underworld Connections are probably your best bet. I don't really like Chandra, Pyromaster in the deck, as you should be more reactive than proactive, and the 0 ability can't feed a pack rat.

I run my own version adaptation of sharkudi's deck; Liliana really can't be replaced in this build.

She provides important land drops if you run tight on the mana base, her+1 provides fuel for Pack Rat both in discard and allowing you to make more rats per turn.

Her -3 is handy for indestructible pests like the god cards.

And her ultimate plays perfectly with Rakdos's Return as a finisher. Ok so an opponent may top deck a removal; there's a lot in standard right now, but with the discard and removal - you'd be surprised how many times you can Ult her.

That being said - I do take your point on the card draw; I've found myself top-decking, so in my own build I have found space for 2 Lili's and 2 Underworld Connections .

Why the 3rd mountain? :)

THEM SEXY UNHINGED LANDS :O

I like that scrivener, testing it seems to work well :D

@Jantz the often overlooked Drainpipe Vermin will always have a special place in my heart. I saw him and then Shrieking Affliction close to each other while browsing my black cards, which inspired this deck idea. Also, i won a game against U/W control with him and Liliana's -3. Had an Orzhov control deck waste a Last Breath on him just to not have to discard another card. Though i've run out of slots for him in here, he's easily the best mascot for the deck... rats + discard ; )

Liliana of the Dark Realms stays. as Wainwright says, she's irreplaceable. Every 1 one her 3 abilities fits perfectly with the deck.

@Fizzz if only i actually had those uber-sexy Unhinged lands, or even Zendikar lands. perhaps one day... 3rd mountain replaces the 4th Rakdos Guildgate (for which i'm growing a strong dislike -- come on Temple of Malice!) and helps when side boarding the extra 2 Anger of the Gods to slightly help the chances of playing it early against creature-heavy aggro decks (still the hardest matchup so far).

Thanks all for the views comments and +1's !!! They are all very much appreciated. Keep them coming!

Saw the latest update sharkudi - so why do you think Game 1 is weak??

I've yet to play competitively at a tournament or FNM with my deck. Just looking for some insight?

Is it simply because you need to see the opponents deck first then the SB comes into play?

Can I ask a question? Is there anything you're constantly sideboarding in to the deck on a regular basis - or what are you SB'ing in regularly??

Would mainboarding those cards directly make for stronger game 1 play?

@Jantz the often overlooked Drainpipe Vermin will always have a special place in my heart. I saw it and Shrieking Affliction close to each other while browsing my black cards, which inspired this deck idea. Also, i won a game against U/W control with it and Liliana's -3. Had an Orzhov control deck waste a Last Breath on it just to not have to discard another card. Though i've run out of slots for him in here, it's easily the best mascot for the deck... Rats + Discard ; )

Liliana of the Dark Realms stays. as @Wainwright says, she's irreplaceable. Every 1 one her 3 abilities fits perfectly with the deck.

@Fizzz if only i actually had those uber-sexy Unhinged lands, or even Zendikar lands. perhaps one day... 3rd Mountain replaces the 4th Rakdos Guildgate (for which i'm growing a strong dislike -- come on Temple of Malice!) and helps when side boarding the extra 2 Anger of the Gods to slightly help the chances of playing it early against creature-heavy aggro decks (still the hardest matchup so far).

Thanks all for the views comments and +1's !!! They are all very much appreciated. Keep them coming!

Side-boarding is different for each match up,. So no, I can't say there is Wainwright. Each card in the sideboard sees play during a given night, and you need to have an answer for everything you may see.

Against control i bring in the Pithing Needle and Slaughter Games
Against aggro it's Anger of the Gods and Lifebane Zombie

Midrange opponents see all of the removal spells. Those extra 2 Devour Flesh are almost exclusively for Mr Blood Baron.

It has just been rather hard to find the right balance to get consistent wins Game 1. However, Games 2 & 3 have all been wins, save for 3 out of 30 or so rounds of competitive play with this deck.

Cool thanks for that info sharkudi

My SB is a little different I'd like your opinions though:

I thought Erebos, God of the Dead , would be pretty useful shutting down Whip and Gary decks. It's also a possibility against control - shutting down a top-decked Sphinx's Revelation .

I put a one of Sire Of Insanity for control decks too.

Why the Lifebane Zombie against aggro decks in particular? I've been playing it when against non-black decks. Are you hoping to race them - or just keep pace with them, by dealing damage, rather than leaving it too late?

When I've been playing my deck - knowing what comes in from SB is easy - what to take out has been more problematic, so against aggro or control - what are the cards that are coming out??

Cheer's mate - I'm really hoping this week - to do your deck justice, so the insight is so valuable to me - based on you getting more competitive play from your deck.

Lastly - love the new name - only wish I could give you another +1.

I used a version of this deck I guess but i ran dega colors , it runs 3 angers main 1 side, 3 mizzium side, and 3 chain to the rocks side with 3 duress side 3 slaughter games side and 2 sin collector side main board has 2 ozadat, 2 erbos, 4 Gary , 2 whips , 3 blind obedience, 3 anger, 4 thoughtseize, 4 Rakdos return, 3 mind rot, 3 underworld , 3 read the bones so its more of a draw discard tempo so once I get hand dominance I win, I'm still switching things up and tuning it tho, I'm glad to see your doing great with yours