Whats is your stance on Seedtime?

Pernicious Deed was in an early (read: not optimized) version of this deck, and it's serviceable, but it's not the best. Your mileage may vary if you're playing noncompetitively.

@knight611: Seedtime is certainly good, but I don't like that it has to basically be snuck into your game as a response (and hopefully not countered). I'd almost prefer Temporal Mastery.

I've used Pernicious Deed in fully optimized Karador, Mimeoplasm, Prossh, and Meren decks, and it was well worth the slot in each. Admittedly, all of those commanders can afford to be much more self-destructive. Still, I would expect the power to carry over to at least a playable extent. I could see it being run in place of a piece of targeted removal for the reasoning that, in multiplayer EDH, you want more AoE spells over one-for-one trades, especially at a competitive level where you often have to keep two or more fast combo decks in check long enough to resolve your own combo.

So no Prophet because of the mana, but still a Teferi, with triple ? Also, no Chrome Mox or Mox Opal? Lastly, I've found Rhystic Study to be a strong draw engine, especially early game, and doesn't require the upkeep of Remora.

Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir is strongly tied to the deck's combo. It's played as a way to prevent people from interfering with the actual combo; it's not cast as a utility creature and then left on the board.

Chrome Mox would be in the deck if it could tap for any color; the fact that it can only tap for the imprinted card's colors makes it far less useful. It's still playable in some sense, but I don't consider it necessary.

Mox Opal is unreliable. I only run 7 artifacts in the deck right now, and Mox Opal requires at least two of them to be on the field before it becomes useful at all. The high potential for it to be a dead card doesn't make up for the low potential for it to be a relevant ramp/fixing card.

Rhystic Study is fine if you're playing in casual or semicompetitive metas, but I find it too slow in competitive games. The high mana cost and the fact that it's comparatively easy to play around make it subpar in this particular build. By comparison, Mystic Remora is very cheap to cast and can also be sustained for 1-2 turn cycles if need be. It's much harder to play around as well.

I know this might be a stretch but do you remeber what you swaped Cryptic Command for or what you would choose now and why?

See the March 9, 2013 update.

Cryptic Command and some other slow cards were dropped in favor of a much more aggressive ramp package.

Do you get to draw 2 additional cards with Sylvan Library if Damia, Sage of Stone is in play?

The rulings allow you to discard any two cards drawn this turn, however the 2 extra draws only apply during your draw step; which is skipped.

If you cannot draw additional cards with the Library, would it be better to use Mirri's Guile instead?

Sylvan Library doesn't work when Damia is out because your draw step is skipped. The ability can't trigger.However, the early game advantage created by Sylvan Library is very strong, and it makes Sylvan Library worth running even though Damia can make it obsolete temporarily.

Mirri's Guile, on the other hand, doesn't actually produce any advantage. It's just a free Sensei's Divining Top; there's no draw component to it. And it's relatively useless when Damia is out because I'll usually be drawing all of those cards anyway.

How has Mystical Teachings been treating you? I've played a variant of this deck on and off every once in a while and I've never really been all that happy to see it in my hand. It does its job but it feels so lackluster compared to every other tutor in the deck.

God dammit, now I have to find a soundtrack for my deck

Did you ever run Mindbreak Trap in a version of the build? What're your thoughts on it as a counter? I've been really impressed with it personally as it can cut through storm decks and gets around uncounterable effects like boseiju or caverns. And the fact that it can cost zero is really nice in counterspell fights.

@TheDevicer: It's a situational card, but it comes through when it needs to. It's a possible candidate for replacement with another tutor, though.

@enpc: I used to run Mindbreak Trap some time ago, but I never found it particularly useful. The problem is that it's obscenely expensive to hard cast, and its alternate cost is not as easily enabled as I would like.

How about Personal Tutor? It's a relevant early spell since it fetches you Skyshroud Claim for ramp, can get you Toxic Deluge in a pinch, and can finds you Tooth and Nail for the win. At worst, it tutors for Demonic Tutor. You get a more mana efficient tutor but lose out on instant speed and putting a card in hand.

Why not Grim Tutor in place of Mystical Teachings? It's 1 mana cheaper and much less situational. The life loss is fairly irrelevant, as is the price tag, given the deck's lack of budget.

What's your opinion on Fathom Feeder for a competitive EDH?

Absolutely unplayable. Baleful Strix is much better and it still sees no play.

Hey, I don't mean to spam your comments section but I forgot to suggest Mana Breach and Phyrexian Arena. Considering how you're playing ramp anyways, wouldn't Mana Breach hurt your opponents more than it would hurt yourself? If so, it might be worthwhile...the downside is you have probably only one shot to execute the infinite mana combo.

Phyrexian Arena seems a lot less painful than Sylvan Library although it is one mana more expensive and you're forced to perpetually use it each turn. Even thought I believe the Library is ultimately better with this commander, I thought it would be worth mentioning.

Mana Breach does not fit the overall gameplan of this deck. This is especially true given the huge focus on ramp the deck has. Imagine top-decking into Mox Diamond with that thing out. matrixnotlikethis.gif

Sylvan Library is accessible draw for an incredibly small amount of mana. It allows you to exchange your least valuable resource (life) for the most valuable one (cards). You're not even forced draw. It can act as free top-deck manipulation. Taking a look at three cards, choosing the best one, chucking the rest on top, and then cracking a fetch or playing a tutor. If this deck isn't running Rhystic Study, it sure as hell won't use Phyrexian Arena. I mean, don't get me wrong, that card is amazing in its own right, but it isn't efficient enough for this deck. It competes heavily with Necropotence.

Cruel Tutor is interesting because it hits any card. I considered suggesting it, but I didn't think it had enough versatility. You can't really use it early to accelerate, so that's a bummer. Later on, it becomes much better than Personal Tutor, but it's not like cycling peronal takes a great deal of mana. You essentially end up fetching demonic tutor, so now you're down a card and a turn but end up paying the same amount of mana for whatever card you needed. That's not good, but it isn't awful either. Does the added early playability of personal merrit running it over cruel? Are either of those better than Mystical Teachings? Those are some pretty tough questions.

The reason I raised the question in the first place was because I often felt happy with drawing Mystical Teachings in the early game or being forced to mulligan into it.

For the thought scenario:

Play the laboratory and tap it to get the mana vault out, then use boseiju to get out ur tooth and nail with entwine and get deadeye and palinchron, leaving up . Infinite mana, then Demonic Tutor yo get zenith, then draw ur deck and eternal witness ur zenith and kill everyone. You have flusterstorm to counter any counters on the tutor or the zenith if need be.

Might be missing something but that's the base version I can see.

Have you considered Gemstone Caverns before? At worst it's just a colorless land with no downside. At best it's another Mox Diamond that doesn't take up a non-land slot. I feel like a good cut for it would be Forbidden Orchard.

It is true that this deck is heavily color reliant due to the low CMC's, but with all the fetches and nature's lore effects the fixing should be taken care of. Plus, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth will often make this into a swamp anyway.

Mentioning that you exile the card instead of discard it is also relevant since you run Crucible of Worlds, but it doesn't have to be a land which is a plus, and other than Crucible there aren't any other scenarios in which it matters.

Hm, I missed Deathrite Shaman which makes Mox Diamond's land discard better than I thought. My points above still stand though. I wish Tappedout let you edit your comments for a bit longer, apologies.

Thoughts on Golgari Charm for the utility of saving Damia, weenie control, or enchant removal? Or even Treasured Find to recycle those counterspells?

@TheDevicer: Personal Tutor is certainly an option, but I don't really have the opportunity to test it. It seems like a worthy replacement, though.

@NarejED: Grim Tutor is good, but the sorcery speed combined with the high cost (not that Mystical Teachings isn't expensive, but at least it's an instant) makes it somewhat less appealing. I'd need to test it to be sure one way or the other, but I don't have many opportunities to test anymore.

@NinjaBunny01: I have to agree with TheDevicer. There's no reason to run it when you consider that it's basically paying for one card and the scaling after that is pretty terrible as well.

@Dankey: Again, I have to agree with TheDevicer. Mana Breach doesn't really do anything I want. It's terrible if I have to use my Phantasmal Image combo, and it's not great considering I generally want to use as much of my mana as possible every turn cycle. At that point, all of the Exploration effects in the deck would have to be used just so I can maintain a stable board position.

Life is a resource. Drawing extra cards with Sylvan Library may hurt, but it's certainly worthwhile when you consider that this deck's goal is to end games within 4-6 turns whenever possible. Phyrexian Arena, on the other hand, is more expensive, comes down later, and generates less advantage.

@Perseus: Gemstone Caverns is an option, and I'd have to playtest it to be sure. However, I don't really know what I'd drop for it. Maybe Cephalid Coliseum. I also don't like that I start a card down and have no access to that resource. In some cases, it'll be worth it. But when you start dropping cards from your starting hand, it becomes very painful. I generally like to keep many options open in my starting hand in case I don't get off to a great start.

@thewyzman: It could be viable in some situations, but there are many cases in which the removal being played is -/- (such as Toxic Deluge, exile (such as Swords to Plowshares), regen-proof (such as Damnation). Golgari Charm would only be effective against a smaller range of removal spells, and that range is generally of the kinds less favored in competitive metas.

Regrowth is strictly better than Treasured Find. I generally don't find those effects worthwhile on their own, though. I run Snapcaster Mage and Eternal Witness, which are sufficient and work better with the combos.

This deck makes me drool I love it so much.