Can Nature's Lore fetch you a Plains or Swamp (there ARE other land types in this deck you know...)? No. I guarantee you that Farseek STILL would have seen play. And your example would be moot anyways because if they BOTH existed in the same standard, then people would have run both at the time (ramping into a turn 3 Thragtusk was super important).

The fact that Farseek brings it in untapped is almost a pointless argument since you're spending mana to fetch it anyways. I admit it's a nice thing that it can come in untapped, but in EDH, it isn't THAT big of a deal.

What's really nice is using Cultivate/Kodama's Reach to drop 2 lands in a turn :)

Oh and a suggestion for the deck - Tower Defense is just strictly better than Solidarity. I don't know why people ever run that card for a Doran deck.

legobumb Yes, in fact it CAN fetch swamps and plains. Just not basics. Look, I get that you think that Farseek is awesome. It is, never said otherwise, however you are SORELY wrong if you think that Nature's Lore isn't strictly better.

Untapped is definitely important and you are crazy if you think otherwise. What if you had a treefolk in hand with a 2x swamp, 2x forest, and 1x B/G dual? This happens all the time in 3 color decks. You can pay your 2, fetch something, have it come in untapped, and then cast Doran, the Siege Tower , Farseek doesn't allow that kind of flexibility.

It's not as important here because you aren't looking to get UU open for Counterspell but I see it matter so much.

This will be the last thing I say on the matter in an effort to not clutter this thread further. If you want to continue arguing feel free to hit my wall.

@AllenM8. Have you ever considered Necropotence to stay in? Also, Rhox Faithmender and Trostani, Selesnya's Voice seem like they could be nasty.

Thank you for all the suggestions!!! Now just what to take out! Necropotence definitely needs to go in here because I always feel like I am running short on card draw but then would indeed need life gain elements such as Rhox. Any ideas on what to take out?

Cards I'm thinking right now are Pariah and Harmonize I put Pariah in just to have a sweet effect with Vigor but honestly it has never happened yet. Harmonize is an expensive cost for a one time draw.

I do want to keep this still on the Treefolk tribal theme, just a few additions to that as well :)

Golgari Charm to "counter" any wrath effect? Also it's really versatile.Should have other uses.Nice deck +1.

I like it!! I'll look for one to put in here!

Yoked Ox perhaps? a 1 drop that swings for four?

@Onyx_Mage: Well, it's debatably better than Ornithopter.

You still need more lands. 34 is just too little. Even 36 is cutting it close. I can see you hitting a few games in a row where you get mana screwed.

Also, the lack of a Silverblade Paladin is killing me. Slagwurm Armor on Doran and Silverblade paired to him and you can 1-shot people.

Having Swiftfoot Boots is pretty key as well. Hexproof in EDH can hose a lot of decks until they draw a board-wipe or a way to kill the boots. Even through all of the hexproofing cards you have.

Although I can see you pulling off a nifty Patriarch's Bidding with Aura Shards on the field after a boardwipe, I just don't think Shards is worth it in this deck simply because you only have 21 creatures and no real way to blink or flicker or reanimate them constantly. I can see you getting 2-3 Shards triggers before it gets removed somehow.

And lastly for now, Rhox Faithmender becomes HUGE with Doran on the field. Beefy 5 toughness with lifelink and his lovely "double your life gain" effect. You're netting 5 damage and 10 life with him and Doran out.

Ok, so did some additions and cuts:

Cut: Vigor Aura Shards Congregation at Dawn Ghoultree Seal of Primordium Deadly Recluse

Adds: Volrath's Stronghold Shizo, Death's Storehouse Phyrexian Arena Rogue's Passage Necropotence Rhox Faithmender

Please let me know if you have any other suggestions!!!

My rule of thumb for land bases is this: 40 lands but you can remove a land for every 2 mana rocks/dorks. So that means with a Sol Ring and a Darksteel Ingot I can go to 39 lands, add Gilded Lotus and Golgari Signet for 38 lands, and so on.

This works out well mainly because, barring tuck removal, you can always cast your commander. Floods aren't NEARLY as bad in EDH as they are in other format.

So I tried cutting some, but what do you suggest I remove. I would like another plains and swamp in there for sure to get it to 39. I have a lot of sorcery's to collect mana's as well.

Cuts: Mortify

Add: Plains

I know you are trying to cut stuff but since you already have Shield of the Oversoul in here, have you considered Gift of the Deity for creatures like the Sapling of Colfeinor or even Doran himself? Hell even putting it on an indestructible Unstoppable Ash makes for pretty great creature removal of their entire board!

I like that idea! I'll see what I can cut to make room for it. It's unfortunate though that Gift of the Deity is such a greater mana cost than Shield of the Oversoul etc. Still think it should be 2 colorless then a green or black.

IMO Lightning Greaves > Swiftfoot Boots but thats just personal preference.

I do understand liking lightning greaves on the ability to equip doran on turn 3 and get him swinging. My only problem is I would have to unattach it to equip doran with anything else such as behemoth sleddge or slagwurm armor. Might be worth consideration though!

If you have issues with reanimating your creatures, I could suggest using Karmic Guide+Reveillark. I've been contemplating them in my own Doran deck simply becsuse 2 or less power on most of my creatures. Also, Lightning Greaves is not better than Swiftfoot simply because Shroud stops you from targeting the creature with anything as well as your opponents. That's nice if you have no other equipment or auras, but in this deck he does have others. Vigor probably should not be taken out either. Vigor makes you no longer a viable target to attack without evasion of some sort. Vigor makes it so you can attack freely without being blocked unless they want your creatures getting bigger.

I will add vigor back in then. Karmic guide and reveillark might be good adds as well. Just what to take out for that.

As long as you have another creature in play, Greaves are free to move back and forth when you need to target your own stuff. This deck runs enough creatures that you can almost always move the boots around. That 0 equip cost is why I stand by my opinion on Lightning Greaves . Agree to disagree?

I will still disagree. Moving the greaves means your creature is now vulnerable to instant speed removal (which of course there are plenty of in EDH). I'd still prefer to use the boots over greaves in a deck with auras or combat tricks in it.

Added a couple of swords. Recently picked up an Umezawa's Jitte and a Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite that I'm going to try to put in here. Any suggestions would be great!