Didgeridooda You're joking about Angus, right? I can't tell if that was satire or a serious comment.

I am dead serious. Angus is great.

The planeswalkers are not tier 2. At least not all of them. Maybe the red one.

Edit, mono white, and mono red are not tier one.

thegigibeast I was just saying that under rating my commanders is part of the fun of this list.

Also, Damia, Sage of Stone is tier 1

I think this comment zone is starting to be a war to decide the place Angus Mackenzieshould be. I would like to give my opinion about it (cause why not?):

First of all, he is a good color combination: bant. It allows us for heavy control, ramp, card draw and monsters. It has access to (in my opinion) at least two of the best colors in EDH: green to ramp and play large monsters and blue to draw a lot and counterspell everything. If I was to run him, white would be more for enchantments and removal support, something the other two colors lack.

As an example, like I said in an earlier comment, a friend of mine built an Enchantress EDH deck running Gandalf in the command zone (if you don't know the card I am talking about, wel...). It is really strong, forst because of the color combination, and secondly... BECAUSE THE COMMANDER IS NOT ESSENTIAL TO THE DECK! It is used to play POLITICS in multiplayer. Also, do you know of the combo Fog + Isochron Scepter ? Well this guy IS the combo! If you are playing an aggro deck that relies on combat damage, you would be screwed by this particular guy. Oh, I see you coming "But it dies to Doom Blade!". As does, for example, Krenko, Mob Boss, listed in the Tier 2 in here.

I would say that every commander that can be used not as the main win condition, but as support to the deck should at least be tier 2. My opinion. Only Storm Crowshould be Godly Tier. And maybe Chuck Norris, but it is weak to the most played card in the format... Storm Crow!!!

He puts off till combo well, and allows for control.

Should I post the list of tier 1s listed that I don't think should be there?

Go on, I like to see everyone's opinion :)

Here is my opinion. The ones I left out of the list are the ones I agree could be tier 1.

Borderline

Arcum Dagsson, Azusa, Lost but Seeking

Tier 2

Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord, Karador, Ghost Chieftain, Melek, Izzet Paragon, Prime Speaker Zegana, Sydri, Galvanic Genius

Maybe tier 2

Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger, Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Purphoros, God of the Forge, Iona, Shield of Emeria, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur

I agree, this isn't the place to get into a serious debate about Angus. I would, however, like to quickly list why I personally feel he isn't competitive.

First off, he doesn't win games, nor even advance the game plan. He's quintessentially a pillow fort commander whose only ability is to stall out matches. Admittedly, this CAN be a viable strategy competitively. Oloro, Ageless Ascetic, who is considered quite powerful, plays a very similar strategy in which he slows down games enough to win via Felidar Sovereign. However, he does this without costing mana every turn, and without even needing to be cast. Meanwhile, Angus has to resolve, stick an entire turn-and-a-half. What's worse, he doesn't even effectively shut off damage in multiplayer matches. If two or more opponents are playing beatdown or voltron, he can only fog one of them, meaning that you have to bog down his deck with other sub-optimal fog effects and pillow fort pieces to hope to begin to fend them off. Finally, his ability costs a devastating UGW to activate. Having to keep three mana open every turn is absolutely crippling, even Bant; one of the best color combinations for ramp. The cost alone denies Angus any hope of being viable.

What's worse is when Angus is playing opponents that AREN'T trying to punch him in the face old-school style. Few, if any, competitive commanders win via non-voltron commander damage. The strong ones combo out. Angus is entirely helpless against any kind of combo list from Hermit Druid to Prossh Chain to Deadeye Palinchron. He has to run a hefty counterspell / control package to negate these fast combo decks, which further dilutes the deck. Not to say Bant control isn't a strong, viable strategy (Particularly when Roon is at the helm), it just isn't quite as strong as Esper, Grixis, or arguably Abzan due to its natural heavy reliance on creatures, which have a very negative synergy with board wipes.

Long story short, Angus doesn't do nearly enough on his own to be considered viable, let along top-tier. He also encourages a strategy that, while mildly annoying, isn't particularly effective. He shuts down Brago, Derevi, and a few other "Damage Matters" commanders for a few turns, but he has trouble actually closing out the game.

And damn, pmonk still hasn't updated the list. He still has Jarad, Iona, Vorinclex, Jin-Gitaxias, Kiki-Jiki, Maelstrom Wanderer, Zegana, Sidri, and Vorinclex listed as Tier 1. I may just copy the list and fix it for him, though that would take a painfully long time.

I think Marchesa, the Black Rose Should be at least Tier 2..

Daxos Returned should be in this list as well I think. Low cost and an enchantment deck with the right set up can really hinder a deck.. maybe not so much in multiplayer. But 1v1 this guy would be pretty deadly

Daxos is in the list. He's tier three, which is fair for what he does.

I agree with a lot of these, but one specifically stands out.Roon of the Hidden Realm is at worst tier 2, if you build him flicker-style he has recyclable to answers to any deck you can think of. My roon deck is undefeated.

E.g. Sharuum the Hegemon you just tutor up a Bane of Progress then just flicker it whenever they have a decent artifact base/You have spare mana.

Its also impressively consistent cause of green creature searching as well flickering zeganna. Flicker Prime Speaker Zeganna with roon and your drawing 6 cards MINIMUM for just 2 mana = Value

As soon as you get Prophet of Kruphix Involved the deck just becomes a joke

Indeed. Roon is actually widely agreed to be tier 1. A fully optimized Prison / combo-based Roon list is only a hair weaker than Brago. Having him listed as tier 4 suggests lack of experience against him.

Why is Nekusar, the Mindrazer only tier 3?

@ wordsmith29: It's mainly because of speed issues. It takes Nekusar an average of two turns to kill people after resolving him. That's after casting him on turn 2-3 at the earliest. On top of that, his strategy is to force opponents to wheel through their deck as fast as possible, meaning that 99% of the time, at least one opponent draws an answer and removes him. So, not only is he much slower than a lot of tier 1 commanders, but he's also much less resilient / consistent.

Admittedly, he should still be placed in tier 2. The creator of this list didn't invest a huge amount of time placing each commander, so there's bound to be minor placement issues here and there. I'm still griping after him to fix the tier 1 list.

I agree that Roon is a tier 2 deck. I just did not want to make arguments for commanders that I run since I know I will be very biased in favor of them, and rate them too high.

Such as my favorite commander Merieke Ri Berit being ranked tier 4. I feel she is a solid tier 2, but I am not sure if that is due to my experiences being skewed in favor of her.

I disagree with Iona, Shield of Emeria being tier one and Avacyn, Angel of Hope being tier 3. They are both equal in power, with the same restrictions. About iona, tier 1 is being nice... Tier 2 seems more reasonable. Mono-white has the trouble of not doing so well.

Tier 1 Over-Powered in Multi and/or Single player. When people sit down and see your general, they go for you first and encourage everyone else to do the same.

card:Kaalia of the Vast, card:Rafiq of the Many, cards: Vendilion Clique/Venser, Shaper Savant/Memnarch.

Either change the description or put them into the tier that they deserve. Turn 3 Kaalia of the Vast turn 4 iona/avacyn/gisela/aurelia/master of cruelties is not something that you let happen. Turn 3 Rafiq of the Many, turn 4 Might of Oaks... Mono blue is something that everybody singles out. I can attest to this because I play mono blue and I am always targeted first.

And sorry for the triple post.

Maralen of the Mornsong is tier two. I say this because it is an extreme combo deck that goes off turn 3-5 consistently and is less than $10 to buy.

Sygg, River Guide is tier 3, not 4. I say this because sygg is the go-to u/w voltron general. Unblockable and unkillable with having other merfolk for support makes a powerful deck 1v1 or multiplayer.

Ghave is not tier 1. Ghave is a fair deck by most edh standards (infinte or not).

@ miracleHat: Maralen can only win the first time a new table sees her. After that, one or more opponents will use her tutor trigger to pull an answer for her and completely shut the deck down. Her only somewhat usable build (Ad Nauseam combo) is so glass cannon that she often scoops to a single well-placed counterspell. Tier 3 is being generous. 4 is probably best.

I agree about ad nauseam combo, but want to add... It works once! lol

True... /sob

I disagree with Muzzio, Visionary Architect being Tier 3; with my deck, at least, I can A) gain control of all permanents B) Destroy all permanents except mine C) Create an unbreakable, metallic pillow fort D) Piss people off. I'm not saying he is Tier 1 material, but in my opinion, he is more than an OK commander

Nice list!