foreverthesickestbritain says... #3
how does it beat non creature decks? ie scapeshift/ storm/ lantern?
March 12, 2016 12:33 a.m.
The majority of removal in deck deals with noncreature permenants and can even send back lands early to disrupt progression, but the major threat will be full-blown spell decks such as burn. Lucky for us most modern burn decks rely a lot more on permenants to make them relevant so it's not the end of the world just not an ideal match up.
March 12, 2016 1:18 a.m. Edited.
Nice deck :-)
Although I think you will have a hard time with creature-heavy, aggressive decks like Zoo. Their creatures come out too quickly for you to handle. Also, burn.
March 12, 2016 3:46 p.m.
Against burn yes I do have a hard time but vs most zoo decks I've done pretty well as by the time they begin to play creatures quickly I can often aoe return their field which tends to put me at a relative advantage( especially if I have Warped Devotion out at the time). That being said most people when they take a first look at this deck don't notice how it tends to play as while I do send back major threats, I more often than not target their land base with Eye of Nowhere and Boomerang which can very effectively set them back turns.
March 12, 2016 5:44 p.m. Edited.
Okay. How well does Waste Not do in this deck? Do you think it's worth it considering that Warped Devotion is your only way to get your opponent discarding cards?
Also, I think Bogles (or generally hexproof) could be a problem for you. You could probably play Cyclonic Rift instead of Snapback for a full board bounce. Although you won't always get to 7 mana...
March 12, 2016 6:13 p.m.
Actually total I have 8 means by which to discard 4 being Warped Devotion and 4 being Jace's Archivist which tends to be plenty and yes you are correct Thing in the Ice is not enough to be my 1 stop shop for aoe removal which is why I run 2 Devastation Tide in the sideboard but I will have to see about running some Displacement Waves in the mainboard. I just tend never to see things like boggle in hyper competitive play as it often never makes it past the first few rounds (and by then it drops so low in ranking that I never compete with such decks) that being said my major concerns for hexproof are often the type that come out around turn 3-4 so they often don't threaten me as much due to me having the time to set up.
March 12, 2016 6:37 p.m.
Great deck +1
Jace's Archivist + Waste Not is a great combo!
Would love to see some abuse with Intruder Alarm and Sunken Ruins!
March 12, 2016 6:48 p.m.
Replace Flooded Strand with Sunken Ruins. Replace 2 Serum Visions with Intruder Alarm.
Gives you more defense when you're low on bounce or while archivist isn't on. Then when he is you are consistently generating blue/black mana, card draw and zombies, enough to bounce another creature into their hand, activate jace & repeat until their field is gone and you have a field of zombies.
March 12, 2016 7:02 p.m.
i like the concept the combo but I honestly find it to be rather convoluted and mana intensive when by comparison I could add in a few Freed from the Real to meet much of the same effect. That being said I chose not to go down this path as most of the combo pieces lacked synergy with the rest of my deck while also forceing me to reduce the number of total sorcery/instants I had which was a detriment to Thing in the Ice which often effectively reduced my overall defense and react ability.
March 12, 2016 8:18 p.m.
That's fair but what about 1 or 2 Sunken Ruins to make use of the extra black mana you have from Waste Not?
March 12, 2016 8:30 p.m.
You are correct, a mana converter does prove useful to the deck, as such I have made the change.
March 12, 2016 9:55 p.m.
Geth's Grimoire Might be handy. Another way to capitalize on the Warped Devotion.
March 13, 2016 5:13 a.m.
Geth's Grimoire is a bit high mana cost and while I enjoy draw power I can often get all the draw I require out of Serum Visions and Jace's Archivist.
March 13, 2016 10:07 a.m.
Void Snare seems kinda meh, being a sorcery and unable to hit lands. Maybe replace them with 2 Darkness and 2 AEtherize to give some options against any hexproof or pro blue creatures? I like AEtherize over Whelming Wave/Displacement Wave because it can protect against haste dudes like Reckless Bushwhacker.
March 13, 2016 6:59 p.m.
@revwildo But if it's to be use against haste creatures I would just send it back with any of my instant speed returns as the vast majority of haste creatures do not have hexproof. I also favor Devastation Tide over other aoe returns as it can be very useful at most stages of the game, that being said I do take caution when using similar returns as it is also disruptive to my own field.
March 13, 2016 10:12 p.m.
LordGanondorf says... #20
Hibernation is card to consider for the sideboard
March 13, 2016 11:56 p.m.
LordGanondorf says... #21
Darkslick Shores could possibly help the burn match up with less fetching
March 14, 2016 12:26 a.m.
I see your point, but the advantage to AEtherize is that it's not a 1 for 1 trade, especially if you can lead up to it with a Darkness, and it doesn't set back your board at all. I would think Compelling Deterrence would be better than Void Snare, but that's just my opinion. I guess I just really think Void Snare is underwhelming.
March 14, 2016 12:46 a.m.
@revwildo I agree that there exist better choices than Void Snare at higher mana costs... That being said void snare is superb for being a 1 cost card as this deck relies on consistent board removal from turn one as early removal essentially sets my opponents back entire turns. That being said I do need to see about finding a suitable option to replace Devastation Tide atleast an option that is more one sided in my favor. I will have to take a look into this.
Nef says... #2
I love this idea
March 11, 2016 11:02 a.m.