Now you just have to go and yet it you for a while :-). What we didn't go over is te mana base--colorwise, not as involved as five-color obviously, but there are no basic utility lands that could really help you. Cabal Coffers + Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth is a really powerful mana ramping situation, for example.
August 30, 2012 6:48 p.m.
Johnngrimm says... #3
What do you mean by "utility lands" because I have plenty of multi-colored land?
August 30, 2012 7:52 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #4
I'm not really sold on Pine Barrens , Salt Flats , and Vec Townships when there are better alternatives. I would sooner run more fetch lands than run those three; they're too slow.
Aura Shards needs to be mainboarded. That card is obscenely powerful in token decks and it can be a game winner because of the advantage you generate.
In regards to ameuser's comment, a utility land is not necessarily a "multicolored" land (I rarely consider mana-only lands to be utility lands, quotes because lands are actually colorless). Lands like Boseiju, Who Shelters All , Oran-Rief, the Vastwood , and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth are utility lands because they offer additional, nonmana abilities and are a nice way to expand the potential of your deck.
I prefer Skyshroud Claim and card:Nature's Lore to Explosive Vegetation and card:Kodama's Reach because they find dual lands and put them onto the battlefield untapped.
Twilight Drover might be good here.
August 31, 2012 12:54 a.m.
Johnngrimm says... #5
@ Epochalyptik thanks for getting back to me so soon. -1 Explosive Vegetation , -1 card:Kodama's Reach, +1 Skyshroud Claim , +1 card:Nature's Lore.
August 31, 2012 1:09 a.m.
Johnngrimm says... #6
Also Epochalyptik any suggestion on what to remove for a twilight drover?
August 31, 2012 1:13 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #7
I would drop Pentavus for it, since Pentavus is comparatively expensive and doesn't interact very well with your other cards (given that it doesn't use or make Saprolings and thus only interacts with its own tokens/counters).
August 31, 2012 1:35 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #8
You might also consider Vindicate , Maelstrom Pulse , Swords to Plowshares , Path to Exile , Putrefy , and Mortify as removal.
August 31, 2012 1:37 a.m.
Johnngrimm says... #9
@ Epochalyptik all of your suggestion sound great but I do not know what cards to remove to make room for things like Putrefy , or Path to Exile . (Also wouldn't giving my opponents land be counter productive?)
August 31, 2012 1:41 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #10
Exiling a creature is a powerful effect, especially at only one mana and at instant speed. You must use your discretion to determine whether getting rid of a threat is worth giving your opponent a basic land (it usually is).
It's difficult to say what you should drop. Were I in your position, I would likely start cutting some of the less necessary creatures (which creatures those are will be dependent upon your experience).
It also seems like you're running a few combos in here, but I'm not sure whether those combos are included because they're in your colors or because they're viable. For example, Mikaeus, the Unhallowed + Triskelion would be most effective when used with Tooth and Nail as a means of finding both at the same time, minimizing your opponent's time to prepare or respond. Earthcraft + Squirrel Nest would benefit from more tutor power.
If you decide some of these combos are unnecessary or don't mesh well with the rest of your deck, you could drop them for more useful cards.
August 31, 2012 1:50 a.m.
Johnngrimm says... #11
What you are saying Epochalyptik is that I should narrow my focus on how many combos I have and work towards supporting the remaining ones?
August 31, 2012 2:06 a.m.
Johnngrimm says... #12
@ Epochalyptik: Do you have any other suggestions for what to add/change for utility lands?
August 31, 2012 3:09 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #13
When I design combo decks, I like to make sure that all the combos interact with one another for the sake of resilience and modularity. Having a bunch of independent combos that all use different cards makes all of them somewhat difficult to assemble.
You seem to rely on quite a few basics. You could swap some of them out for more utility lands. In my BUG deck, I run 9 fetchlands and a few other utility lands that help me stabilize my mana production and increase the power level of the deck.
August 31, 2012 9:38 a.m.
Johnngrimm says... #14
@ Epochalyptik: Most of the combos in the deck already interact with one another. The ones that do not are Triskelion + Mikaeus, the Unhallowed , and Triskelion + Mephidross Vampire . So maybe removing those two in favor of three more land? After going through your List of EDH Staples and Power Cards I did not think there were any more lands that would apply to my deck; I am however, unfamiliar with the list. Are there any cards you would suggest?
August 31, 2012 11:02 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #15
You're missing Scrubland . Apart from that, I would at least try the 9-fetch approach. It makes for an extremely consistent and effective mana base.
August 31, 2012 12:27 p.m.
Johnngrimm says... #16
@ Epochalyptik: I took out some basic land and added in some fetch lands. It seems really effective so thank you for suggestion!!!
Also I took out some of the other non-basic lands to make room for the fetch lands and was wondering if I should try to add them back in?
August 31, 2012 1:11 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #17
If you'd like an example of my theory on tricolor land bases, Dominus - Dreamcrusher Edition is my EDH deck. The lands are fairly stable and demonstrate a balance between utility and basic functionality.
August 31, 2012 1:34 p.m.
I don't see why people even bother suggesting cards like Imperial Seal . I don't know of any people that are willing to drop the better part of a grand on one card. But if you can afford it, great for you. It just seems like money that can be used to get a better land base or less ridiculously priced tutors.
September 1, 2012 12:51 a.m.
Hello again! So, Greater Good and Beastmaster Ascension seem like they should go in the dek, the former because it's an awesome sac outlet and theoretically your tokens will have high p/t, and the latter because, well, you have a token deck and it makes your dudes huge fast :-). I'm not sure yet what you would take out, but I'll get back you on that. Maybe the Plague Wind though. It's pretty expensive and it's board-wiping utility is limited to creatures, which there should already be none of on the opponents' battlefields due to your other cards like Grave Pact etc. plus YOUR creatures should e the ones dominating and forcing opponents to use THEIR board wipes...just thinking out loud a little bit. Why do you think?
September 17, 2012 1:17 a.m.
Johnngrimm says... #21
Thanks again ameuser:
-1 Plague Wind
+1 Greater Good
I never thought about the fact that my tokens will have really high p/t. I keep thinking that they are going to always be 1/1s. So Greater Good makes sense to add. As for Plague Wind you are right; the only time I ever used it was playing another token deck. So into the side-board Plague Wind goes.
P.S. "Why do you think?" I think because I can (hopefully).
September 17, 2012 3:21 p.m.
Haha sorry I meant "What do you think?" in regards to my ideas haha
Also, I used to have Defense of the Heart , but it was extremely slow since you need to wait until one of your opponents has three or more creatures in play, and that might take a while, and by then you've lost its value. Also, casting that could turn your game into a 3v1 against you, like it did me. I took it out. Also, it's best when you can search out an infinite win combo, otherwise it's not as good.
September 17, 2012 3:36 p.m.
Johnngrimm says... #24
@ ameuser: I have the Mikaeus, the Unhallowed + Triskelion combo that I normally tutor out with Defense of the Heart or Tooth and Nail . I see your point about being a target though. I will probably leave it in because there are a lot of creature heavy decks in my current meta.
@ Epochalyptik: That could be good. I will look more into it after class.
September 17, 2012 3:51 p.m.
I didn't notice you were missing Decree of Pain haha. It's wonderful with a token deck :-). Soooo much card drawing. And idk how good Diabolic Revelation is. I try not to put it in my decks since it's so darn costly 99% of the time...
Johnngrimm says... #1
Thank you ameuser
-1 Carnage Altar , -1 Garruk, Primal Hunter , +1 Greater Good
August 30, 2012 3:29 p.m.