Awesome primer! Good job dude!

Looking forward to how Plunge works out. Chain of Vapor I approve! :-D

Any viable replacements to tinetwister? Its the only card i lack.

Valaj Hello Valaj, thanks for the question!

So while Timetwister is a great card in the cEDH format, it is by no means absolutely necessary in this deck. This deck moreso uses timetwister for value more than anything and it just happens to have nice synergy with Notion Thief and Narset. Rather than try to suggest an in-line replacements that would just be strictly inferior, I suggest that you try to fill the spot with the next best card you'd want in your deck. I've put a lot of cards in my maybeboard that I think are worth trying out, and so any of them would work perfectly depending on what you need!

Personally, I cannot afford Timetwister on my paper list either. So I play with Muddle the Mixture in my paper list instead atm! But I'm looking to put in Plunge into Darkness very soon too so you could also give that a try!

Thank you very much for the suggestion! Im not familiar with tagging here so I apologize for that.

what about life from the loam?

Robross thanks for the question!

So I've actually tried out Life from the loam for quite some time and I'm honestly not a fan of it in the current cEDH metagame.

If you think about it, Life from the Loam is a card advantage engine that requires 3-4 slots (Life from the Loam and cycle lands) and requires around 3-4 mana each rotation. Personally, I think assembling Life from the Loam takes too long and its mana investment each turn is too much. If Life from the loam is played early game without any cycle lands, you are pretty much only getting fetch lands and then possibly blanking your next draw. In early turns for cEDH, I think just finding lands is pretty weak. In later turns if you find one cycle land and life from the loam, you are essentially just spending 3 mana per turn and drawing one card from your draw step and then one card that will be life from the loam. Essentially, Life from the loam has only given you access to more lands and hasn't actually given you any meaningful card advantage. Dredging Life from the loam does mill our deck, but I actually don't think filling our graveyard with Life from the Loam is that useful. Certainly it helps cast Tasigur easier should he ever die, but I think making your graveyard bigger isn't that great because your opponents will always give you back the worst things when you're activating him for value. So having a larger graveyard just means that your opponents have more opportunities to give you worse options like dorks all the time. Tasigur's primary graveyard recursion is tied to his opponents' choice, so I don't think it is actually very meaningful to throw things in the graveyard just because in the early game. Should we mill a win condition we wanted to tutor for or something, it actually becomes quite annoying. Yawgmoth's Will eventually makes times like that a little easier, but we are only running one type of card with that kind of effect. Instead of playing Life from the loam early, I would rather try make other more impactful plays like establishing mana ramp via dorks / rocks, establishing card draw engines, or even just by casting/ activating Tasigur.

Having Life from the loam with 2+ cycle lands in the graveyard is when you hit the sweet spot of actually getting card advantage. You'll be drawing 2 cards + life from the loam per rotation. Again though, I am not actually a huge fan of dredging and I actually think that assembling Life from the loam + 2 cycle lands does take quite a while (unless you are literally just using intuition, which i'm thinking about cutting pretty soon anyways spoilers). I think it's a very slow card advantage engine (as it requires 3-4 mana per rotation just to draw one card and get back lands) and I think the individual pieces just aren't very good on their own. I think it's great that it's a card advantage engine that is very hard to disrupt, but I don't think that's quite worth how sluggish it is and how many pieces it requires.

I think it's fine if you are in a very grindy meta where you can afford to be making slower plays for value. But I feel like you can be making more significant plays in the early game / late game to be honest and not including the life from the loam package would free up at least 3-4 slots in your deck.

Thoughts on Oko, Thief of Crowns ?

KillDatBUG

Thanks for the question!

Tbh I'm very unsure about Oko. He's actually the least sure thing about Eldraine for me imo. I think his best home honestly might be Tasigur because he can reasonably defend Oko against the 3/3s, which I think is REALLY cool. But the real question I think is-- does Oko have a good spot against the current meta? Obviously potentially he can do some very incredible things against some very commander centric decks like Yisan or Najeela, but he is also pretty slow compared to other answers we might have (1 mana for pongify or 2 mana for gilded drake). He definitely has perks above those other answers such as reusability in the long game, but his perks come at the price of speed. He's in a similar place as Ashiok for me where like he's pretty much ONLY a defensive card, which again gives me reservations. Honestly, he seems more of a meta pick to me than a solid pick for Tasigur imo

I'm definitely going to try him out, but I'm actually not very confident he's going to make it in. I have high hopes for him, but I also have a great deal of doubts for him as well. I hope I'll settle on my feelings with him while i try him out in practice.

Will oko, thief of crowns find place in this deck? Do you think it's viable in a competitive environment?

Robross Thanks for the question!!

I actually just responded to a comment about Oko in the comment before yours LOL. If you have any further questions about Oko, I'd be happy to answer them though.

I plan on putting my full thoughts on the Eldraine set soon when I've had enough time to test it myself. Sorry for the sluggish updates!

But have you considered: Oko, Thief of Crowns ?

..... firerif omg please LOL asldkfjaldskf

I'm ok with bolt to face for mana, but which is more optimal Gemstone Caverns or Tarnished Citadel ?

newrise

Hi, thanks for the question!

Honestly, that's something I've really been thinking about for a really long time. If I had to be honest, I think Gemstone Caverns is probably something that I also SHOULD be on.

I think Gemstone Caverns would really help us have more explosive starts so that we can establish mana ramp and then hopefully card advantage much easier out of the gates (obviously Gemstone caverns itself doesn't establish card advantage, but maybe it can help set up like T1 Sylvan Library or Dark Confidant). That being said, it probably feels awful to draw it later on in the game. My initial thoughts are that like establishing a more powerful board presence turn 1 is way more important than the cons of just being a colorless land in the late game because early game is where we need the most help and if we're in the late game we're already probably in a great spot.

I honestly just haven't really thought of a cut for Gemstone caverns myself. I'm sure it will come in time just like how i found a cut for Tarnished Citadel. I don't really think Tarnished citadel would be the correct cut for Gemstone caverns, rather something else though. I would give you a list of lands I would consider cutting myself, but i'm honestly not sure atm. I'll update you if I ever do think of one though! I know some people are not a huge fan of Reflecting Pool and would like to cut that, so maybe you can look into something like that if that's you're groove.

What would you recommend as a substitution for Timetwister? I apologize if this is a dumb question.

WarSpaniel

Hello, thanks for the question! I appreciate each and every question, so don't worry too much about it.

This is actually the second question I've gotten about the Timetwister, and so I'll actually write something about Timetwister to address everyones concerns about that card!

This is what I said before concerning the replacement of Timetwister:

"So while Timetwister is a great card in the cEDH format, it is by no means absolutely necessary in this deck. This deck moreso uses timetwister for value more than anything and it just happens to have nice synergy with Notion Thief and Narset. Rather than try to suggest an in-line replacements that would just be strictly inferior, I suggest that you try to fill the spot with the next best card you'd want in your deck. I've put a lot of cards in my maybeboard that I think are worth trying out, and so any of them would work perfectly depending on what you need! Personally, I cannot afford Timetwister on my paper list either. So I play with Muddle the Mixture in my paper list instead atm! But I'm looking to put in Plunge into Darkness very soon too so you could also give that a try!"

Please let me know if you have any other questions, thanks!

KillDatBUG & Robross

I've decided to test out Oko recently in my list. I still have the same fears as I had when I first mentioned my thoughts about the card, but I just have a feeling that perhaps Oko might be good in the meta right now. Regardless, I am testing Oko out and replacing Ashiok for him for now. If the change ends up happening, I will write more about why I'm making this specific change.

Not exactly updating the list or anything because I'm not certain of his inclusion still, but I just wanted to let you guys know what I was testing out. If I end up liking him after some more testing, I'll make an official update to the list. For now, I'm merely experimenting. Thought you guys would like to know though~

I'll try the swap out. Got a ton of games lined up for this coming weekend.

newrise

Awesome, please let me know what you think of him!

If you're testing a similar list, I'd love to hear any feedback you'd have for the list overall as well. Thanks!

Gotta admit I've played nearly all of the cEDH deck (I have a lot of cards) and I enjoy your list the most. My deck has everything yours does and I tend to update when you do. The only thing is I ususally don't bust out the Timetwister as it is so expensive to keep on me and have replaced it with a Echo of Eons as it works nearly the same way especially with Tasigur's ability.

In my local cEDH meta I tend to pull out a win more often it seems as I just sit back and chill and wait for someone to try and win then stop them. This weekend I'll be going to a convention and getting in some games, but I don't know the meta so Oko will see a fresh crowd in testing this weekend.

Just wanna also say thank you for keeping up this list and providing such and enjoyable list. I love combo decks, but in cEDH it gets kinda boring to me and with this deck we just do our own thing till people try and win. Once we're in the late game then we usually win.

newrise

Wow thanks so much, that actually means a lot to me ^^

I'm extremely happy that you like the list and I'll definitely be sure to keep it updated! I'm very glad that you can enjoy playing control in cEDH by playing this list! Stopping everyone else and then finally getting into the late game always feels so sweet with Tasigur.

Please update me on how Oko does for you this weekend though! I personally haven't been able to test him out that much myself, so I'd be very curious on the experiences you might have for him.

I apologize, but I have another (potentially dumb) question. What is the purpose of Abrupt Decay in conjunction with Ashiok, Dream Render? Thank you!

WarSpaniel

Hey man, this is the second time you've thought you had a dumb question-- don't worry about that at ALL. If anything, there's nothing more that I love to do than talk about Golden Control and I'm more than happy to help out whenever!

I actually don't want to go super extensively into Ashiok + Abrupt decay, because I'm actually considering cutting Ashiok in my list LOL, but I'll go more in detail how it works for everyone that still wants to try it out.

1. Initial conditions: You have infinite mana from IsoRev and you have Tasigur out. We'll assume you activated Tasigur infinitely so you have your deck and your graveyard in your hand.
2. Cast Ashiok and -1 him to exile the top 4 cards of your opponents library
3. Cast Abrupt Decay targeting Ashiok
4. Activate Tasigur to get both Ashiok and Abrupt Decay back into your hand
5. Rinse and repeat steps 2-4 to exile all of your opponents libraries
6. When you pass the turn, each opponent will die on their draw step

Remember that before ending the turn, you should probably try to set up as much stax pieces as possible so they don't try anything fishy. Also remember to keep as many counterspells as possible to prevent them from doing anything fishy. It'd be cool if you can also blow up all their lands with assassin's trophy to prevent them from trying anything with their lands. Essentially just ensure you can lock them down before you end the turn.

Great deck!!! Is there a way to abuse lions eye diamond here?! An infinite mana combo... a way to use his recursion ability?