Winds of Change seems like an odd choice for a wheel effect. If you need to refill your hand after a disrupted combo it doesn't give you any extra cards to work with.

Also, how do you feel about Simian Spirit Guide? Or are you set on the current number of ritual effects?

Hi PrecintSix6Six, thanks for coming and taking a look at the deck!

Winds of Change is sort of in an odd spot in this deck, and is likely to see a change in the future. You are correct, in that it is a poor wheel the majority of the time.

It currently holds it's spot for the following reasons;

1. It works as an early game filter, if you happen to start with some great early ramp or land cards, but not much of anything else, you can use it to filter your remaining cards into something else, similar to a looting effect.

2. It's a great card to run off Ad-Nauseum, in those occasions you happen to draw 25 cards, but none of which are the ones you wanted.

3. It's a great, cheap disruption card that can play around a good deal of stax thanks to it's cheap cost. When a player across from you has painstakingly tutored into a wincon that you don't have a real way to interact with (the cost of BR decks!), you can attempt to force them to drop the cards they spent so many resources on.

Simian Spirit Guide is absent due to our already heavy use of rituals, his cmc hit off ad-naus, and that he cannot be recast with things like Yawgmoths Will or Past in Flames after being used.

is burnout better than imp's mischief?

Love it and fantastic write up! +1

Doug4130Burnout vs Imp's is still in debate form. Currently, Burnout is holding that spot because it not only works as hard protection, but it allows card draw to replace itself. It also can be cast with R, leaving our all important B mana untouched.

The obvious downside is that it only works against Blue Spells, but that's to our rush game plan, those are often the ones interacting with us to stop Doomsday or tutoring

Imps is more limited in it's use, in that it's nice to redirect counterspells to itself, but is more limited if being used for removal redirection (with the possibility that Grenzo, for example, is the only legal target).

More importantly, however, is that Imp's on a Doomsday turn requires an additional black mana with are often in short supply being required for so many other spells, which still need to operate.

Burnout edges out Imp's for largely that reason: We can cast Burnout without impacting our available black mana.

If your meta is very light on Blue players, Imp's is definately the obvious swap.

I just want to say that when I first started looking at the cards in this deck, I couldn't even figure out how the hell it wins. After reading the description, I am just blown away.

Ditto, Jmax13 ... ditto.

This deck is very creative and it seems like a blast to pilot! Decks like this are the reason EDH exists and will always be fun. I love that feeling of sitting down to a table across from Azami, Lady of Scrolls, Zur the Enchanter and Leovold, Emissary of Trest with something unassuming like Grenzo. The mutual chuckle followed by an insane win makes for some memorable MTG. Hats off to you, sir.

Fantastic primer! As someone who just recently started playing a Grenzo deck, I thoroughly enjoyed reading this and discovering the Mimic-Redcap combo. What are your thoughts on Goblin Recruiter as backup for doomsday getting exiled to help assemble the combo? Would it be worth a spot? Thanks again for the great read!

Jmax13 Thanks for checking the deck out. I appreciate you taking the time to read it!

darkjeti Thanks! I hope you give it a try. It's nice the first couple games when people think they can just ignore you, spam their interaction on each other, and you just drop DD on t3 while they're tapped.

Pseudo-ception Hi! I'm happy to hear you've started Grenzo. He's great fun. Regretfully, recruiter still leaves us in the pickle of not being able to fetch out mimic. He's a strong choice if you're trying to draw into a naturally, but with this particular decks all-in Doomsday strategy, he's a dead card any turn before Doomsday plan fails.

Hey, I have a budget question.

What would you substitute instead of Grim Tutor? Diabolic Tutor, Diabolic Intent, or something else?

Hi Ender666666 . Either of those would be suitable if you're holding onto the rest of the list. If you're using more budget replacements, you may also consider running Dark Tutelage to flow with the pace of a slower game. You can also replace it with something more meta dependent, like Conqueror's Flail or Phyrexian Revoker if it becomes meta necessary until you get the card.

Out of both options, however, I would be more inclined to run Diabolic Tutor, simply due to the low creature count in the deck making it rather unlikely you'll have the fodder you need for it's cost.

Thanks, that's about what I expected

I see you changed out Past in Flames for Recoup. Any other changes?

For those of us who are following this list, would you be able to post what you add and remove when you make changes?

Ender666666 - Hi Ender

Just last night I added another section that carries both of those.

Previously I just had the card test log, but those changes are becoming permanent so last night I added in the "Card Change Log!" where you can find the permanent changes to the deck!

Sweet. Yeah I found it after I asked.

Fantastic.

Also, just in case this comes up and you play on paper. There are 2 versions of Mogg Raider.

The Anthologies one, which tappedout uses (and is still purchasable) has a mana cost of RR.

The Tempest one (identical card) has a mana cost of R.

The Tempest one is the official one according to WoTC! So make sure you're running that one!

Good to note. I do have it assembled in paper with the exception of about $5 of cards. Still need Rain of Filth, Pyretic Ritual, Desperate Ritual and Rakdos Charm (and Grim Tutor) of course

For anyone following this deck, please note this last weekend saw some changes go into the deck and primer.

Please see "Why Grenzo" for a discussion of avoiding Rest in Peace and Leyline effects.

Please see "A Second Chance!" to a discussion of our hot new tech Undying Evil.

Please see the "Testing Log!" to see what's currently on the chopping block

Please see "Card Change Log" to see the big changes that occurred in the deck!

Feel free to ask me any questions here, on reddit, or on the competitiveEDH discord server.

I played this tonight at my local store and did quite well. Very happy with your work so far.

I'm incredibly glad to hear that! Thanks for the support!

Played it again last night and took 3 of 4 matches with it (although the competition wasn't playing highly tuned decks). Overall I like the feel and how it plays.

I'd be interested in hearing more about the thought process behind the changes you make to the list. I've found it a bit hard to get enough red mana to hard cast Kiji-Jiki if necessary.

Hey.

I'll do a short couple sentence writeup on the card change log tonight to bring more insight into that.

You're right. Hardcasting Kiki is rough, as we often try to avoid that route when possible. it truly is our backup's backup plan, so it can be a struggle for sure.

Often when hardcast to win I turn to Adnaus and massive filtering to draw into the Redcap combo, as it can be done with more black mana for 3 total mana less than hardcasting a KIZC. Yes, it is one extra card, but with our curve, AD-Naus should get you there.

I just noticed it when an opponent left a juicy ZC sitting on the battlefield and all I had to do was find KJ and cast him for the win

What about a card like Final Fortune to snag us an extra turn to "go off"?

It's neat, and something I've never thought of to include, to be honest.

I'll add it to the test log once I figure out a suitable cut, and do the math to see if I need to retool landbase to support it.

Thanks!