How do you feel about Cyclonic Rift ?

Rift is awesome and I'm trying to work it in somehow but it's really difficult.

I'd say drop a piece of removal for it (since you COULD use rift as a removal piece in a pinch anyway). You already have 2 x Dreadbore and 3x Hero's Downfall . You could put in 1x Cyclonic Rift for a Hero's Downfall . Removal is bad against control decks anyway, so having the chance to return their side of the board to hand and then Rakdos's Return them seems good :)

Not to mention it's the only answer you would have to a Detention Sphere

Cyclonic Rift is also really great when you wait until your opponent taps out (alot of times right before they attack) and then overload rift and theyll be forced to discard down to 7.

What about that new spoiled guy? King Macar, the Gold-Cursed . It's inspired ability is very powerful, but it has some drawbacks as well: namely, he's a 2/3 for 4, so attacking into a board where they have a creature you want to exile is very questionable. However, he combos exceedingly well with Ral Zerak, and he is a stranglehold against an empty board, because anyone they play during main phase is then exiled at your upkeep. What are your thoughts?

also, Silence the Believers over Gild and Turn / Burn any day

Except that makes it harder to cast as it requries double black in a 3 color deck. What if he only has 2 black and wants to save 1B for a Dreadbore or something else that requires black?

Have you seen how many black sources are in this deck?

Sorry, my mistake. I misread the pie chart. That might be a good point.

By the way, a discussion I wanted to have with most Grix players. I ain't running that many dual lands as you do as I sometimes prefer the speed and lack of life losing coming from simple lands. What do you guys think of Chromatic Lantern ? It is in a way a ramp for us + it allows us to properly tap, I used to use it in my old Grixis, because I had just started playing standard again and didn't have the needed lands, whereas when I got them I just stopped using it whatsoever. Do you guys reckon it's worth a slot in our decks?

Even IF black were the primary color, you still can have mana issues with only having 2 lands out that can produce that color (the main problem with running a 3+ color deck).

That's the fine tuning of Grixis that DrFunk27 and I have been working on for awhile now. I cut Dissolve from mine and ran Psychic Strike in its place as I had 3 DIFFERENT 3 drop spells that all required double color mana costs: Dissolve , Anger of the Gods , and Hero's Downfall .

It made it MUCH more consistent by taking one of those out, and I felt that the switch I made was the right call. Since I also run a main deck mill plan, it just added even more synergy

Understandable, I rarely go for double X color costs. And I am fairly disappointed by Anger of the Gods in my meta. I just think maybe the Lantern will help smoothen out all the picks we have seeing as some spells are just impossible to cast at times, for example hand with 2 Hero's Downfall yet only 2 blue and 2 red on the battlefield :/

I don't think we can afford to have the slot used up for a "ramp" spell. My deck doesn't have early drops and I rely on counterspells and removal to keep the board under control until I can land a win condition safely.

If I spent my turn 3 tapping out for a Chromatic Lantern , from that point on I wouldn't have to worry about mana so it would be ok, but if you top deck it later in the game it's bad and you can possibly get a loss from not top decking a card that will help you.

Since Chromatic Lantern can't win you the game, help stabilize a board state, etc it's just a bad addition.

You got a point. Would much rather drop Ashiok followed by Ral, tho gotta admit at times I've even held off from hands with two Ashioks just because I didn't have the mana needed to continue. Mana can be quite the problem nowadays :P

Yes it can! ESPECIALLY for any 3+ color deck NOT running green :)

Since I've been using mostly U/B, I've branched out into creating a BUG list to see where that takes me. So far it's been testing well and I may need to wait until JOU is released before doing more with Grixis. With Keranos, God of Storms I will have more card draw so that will free up a few slots for either removal/threats/counterspells

Hey, DrFunk27

I was thinking ahead for when JOU is released and us using Keranos, God of Storms .

Would Prognostic Sphinx be a good edition? It adds UU to devotion to the god, scrys 3 (to set up a bolt or a land draw), and can give itself hexproof by discarding a card (which we should plenty since we're a control deck).

The other option I've been thinking about is using Hypersonic Dragon and some of those more expensive sorceries we've seen spoiled that allows you to scry 3 and draw cards equal to CMC (which would be AWESOME card draw for us)

harrydemon117 Yeah, I've looked into Prognostic Sphinx for rotation. After RTR leaves, unless M15 has some form of buddy lands, all of the decks are going to get hit hard, and I'm not sure this deck can survive. If it does, I will most likely play Stormbreath Dragon, Prognostic Sphinx, Keranos, and maybe Omenspeaker to set up scry as well.

I agree with demon about Chromatic Lantern. I've spent countless hours playtesting this deck and fine tuning it. Mana has always been an issue, but I feel that lantern is just a waste. It's extremely sad to draw a lantern turn 6 or 7 and it would just be a wasted spot. My suggestion is play the most land you can to get the most out of your spells. I bumped up to 27 land so I'm sticking with Dissolve as my main counterspell. The scry ability works well with Keranos. Psychic Strike works too, I played it for a week or two.

Do you think there's any room to work Thassa, God of the Sea back in?

Sethes5 With Keranos, I believe Thassa absolutely deserves a spot in the deck. Probably won't happen until after rotation however.

Mogis, God of Slaughter seems like a perfect fit.

-1 master, -1 aetherling, -4 nighveil +2 Mogis, God of Slaughter +2 Thassa, God of the Sea +2 Counterflux

Mogis and Keranos together seems like they could put quite the clock on the board.

You guys keep missing the point that you cannot FORCE them to sac a creature or take the damage...they get the choice.

Yes Mogis, God of Slaughter is good vs control decks as they run very minimal creatures (and it would suck once Elspeth, Sun's Champion was online to thwart it), but against aggro what's to stop them from sacrificing a crappy creature to keep the beats coming?

By the time you have the board state stabilized, you need a faster way to close out the game. AEtherling is perfect for this, and Keranos, God of Storms does it faster AND keeps your card draw / Lightning Strike effects coming. Not to mention if you get his devotion online (GREAT with Nightveil Specter + any other permanent that adds 2 to his devotion) he closes out the game REALLY fast. This is a build that is more "threat oriented" and not necessarily a "super control" deck

Angry_Potatoes wolfsokol Kaitoghost

Mogis will most likely be used after rotation but currently, he isn't a threat. I played him a lot when it was released and it literally didn't change the game that much. Like harrydemon117 said, it gives them the choice, which is a downside because most of the time they would just sac something. Keranos is much different in that it's an ability that happens at each upkeep whether they like it or not. In fact, if an opponent misses the trigger REL rules dictate the consequence could be a game loss in tournaments. Anyways, I may take out master of cruelties for 1 Thassa, but Specter is definitely staying. It has helped win me countless games.

I think that Mogis probably works best in an aggro or midrange deck. He has a reasonable chance of becoming a creature with those decks and he adds extra pressure.