Jamesfurrow says... #2
But thank you for looking at the deck Curius52 and Snapcaster Mage is too good ever take out of the deck. He is always able to bring back an awnser because it has flash. Its a modern loved card for many reasons and it keeps giving you spells to use. Also i found delver and gutter dont synergize with each other very well.
August 7, 2014 3:38 p.m.
Definitely sideboard Blood Moon against 3-color builds and tron. I would also suggest Rune Snag over Mana Leak .
Sweet deck, cool to see it do well at a tournament.
August 10, 2014 12:15 a.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #4
pacman3 wow that was fast and I totally like the idea of Rune Snag jeez that card I completely overlooked it. Definitly a Mana Leak that gets better as you go. And I should use Blood Moon sideboard huh I didn't think of it being there but was considering Sowing Salt definitly should go put in moon instead. Thank you for looking at the deck again
August 10, 2014 12:23 a.m.
No worries. Yeah kind of odd that I checked in right after your comment on the other one. Rune Snag starts off eh, but in long games with digging, it's not uncommon to hit 3 or even 4. Blood Moon is a bit pricey and hits you too, but it's probably worth it.
August 10, 2014 12:34 a.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #6
pacman3 since my deck has so much scry and I'll be running vents. I'm sure moon won't hurt me too much considering I'm very burn heavy. Also snag will work very well because I always see to find myself at turn 6-8 in a game because I keep denying stuff and yea I'm glad you like the you like te deck though
August 10, 2014 12:57 a.m.
The deck is looking great so far. The only thing I'd suggest is getting Steam Vents in as soon as possible. Which you already mentioned. As for dealing with control, I'm looking into that as well. Dimir control is the bane of my Izzet deck.
August 10, 2014 2:29 a.m.
Hi Jamesfurrow thanks again for commenting on my deck Delver (Red/Blue). After looking at your deck I would say you need to get Steam Vents ASAP. Also I would take out the 2x Izzet Charm and 2x Spell Pierce and instead run 2 more Gitaxian Probe and 2 more Serum Visions , because knowledge of what your opponent has in there hand and what you are going to draw next will help you know what spells to counter so you can run less of them and more card draw. Running two different swords is a good idea too because it will give your Delver of Secrets Flip protection from more colors therefore making him harder to block or be removed. I would suggest using Sword of Fire and Ice and Sword of Feast and Famine , because that will negate most of the colors that use removal plus the effects of these swords are the best for your deck. Also I feel like if you are running 4x Snapcaster Mage you are going to need more targets in your graveyard than you are currently running and therefore should run either Lava Spike or Pillar of Flame (if you like to target creatures instead of just a 3 damage bolt to the face) because they are basically another lightningbolt for the same mana cost. To make room for the Lava Spike or Pillar of Flame I would make Young Pyromancer a 2 of because I feel like he is the weakest of the creatures you are running and if you already have 1 of him on the battlefield you are not really going to need another.
As for your sideboard I feel like running 2x Blood Moon over your 2x Stone Rain is a must. Also 2x Rune Snag over your 2x Essence Scatter wouldn't be a bad idea either. Also if quick creature decks are giving you a problem Pyroclasm (which could replace the Pillar of Flame in your sideboard if you decide to run it main board like I suggested above) is always a good answer with Ratchet Bomb . Make these changes and please let me know what you think, I bet your deck will run a lot smoother and have a more well rounded sideboard if you do.
Best of Luck,
August 10, 2014 1:33 p.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #9
DatOneGuy thank you so much for your suggestions and for the Rune Snag I plan on replacing the Mana Leak play set with them because if your going rune you go all out. also I know pyro is the weakest creature in the deck and so it dies a lot. I use 4 because I want to consistently be able to make tokens (saved my ass against pod) and I def plan on putting in Blood Moon into my sideboard just need to get them lol. also why remove Spell Pierce ? the card does a lot of work against control decks. I'm simply curious why it shouldn't be in the deck
the point with Snapcaster Mage is valid but I feel I have plenty of spells so far where Snapcaster Mage is doing a good job providing more counters than burn (I use him when im looking to stall out and rarely for the finisher). and I was considering Pyroclasm but I then looked at theros and went oh look exile Anger of the Gods is my cup of tea because turn 3 for them is when they have the most creatues that would be problems for me to deal with.
again thank you for taking the time to look at the deck and ill change it one here so you and everyone else can see how it should be looking like
August 10, 2014 1:47 p.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #10
You need fetches . Control builds cannot run well without fetches. Then, find some Sulfur Falls and Cascade Bluffs . You will need all the dual mana you can get.
Remove Young Pyromancer , he doesn't provide immediate effectiveness and can be easily removed before any tokens can even be provided. Add in 3x Vendilion Clique instead, as that is pretty much the only form of hand disruption you will ever get in Izzet colours. Then, drop both Delver of Secrets Flip and Snapcaster Mage to 3 each, you really don't want too many creatures, otherwise your control mechanic will just fizzle out and fail.
Then, chuck out Gitaxian Probe , Rift Bolt , Spell Pierce and Magma Jet s for 1x Sword of Fire and Ice , you will want that draw and extra control, 1x Serum Visions , very powerful at a full playset, 3x Izzet Charm , one of the best izzet control cards, so much versatility, and 3x Remand s, the best control counterspell out there, always likened to Time Walk in power. It is why it is a $11 uncommon.
Then you will still have 3 spaces left. You desperately need more lands, 20 lands do not cut it in control. So find yourself 3 more lands, preferable fetches.
Sideboard: Spellskite , Shattering Spree /Smash to Smithereens /Shatterstorm and Grafdigger's Cage /Relic of Progenitus /Tormod's Crypt are all very important to have. Spellskite helps destroy those combo, control and voltron builds. Especially Splinter Twin . Shattering Spree and Smash to Smithereens are obvious single artifact control cards, whereas Shatterstorm is more in terms of affinity. Finally, Grafdigger's Cage helps with Snapcaster Mage and Birthing Pod decks, whereas Relic of Progenitus and Tormod's Crypt are better for Jund and their Tarmogoyf s and dredge mechanics.
Ever thought of going Grixis? You would then have a much more reliable build against creatures, with Dismember , Go for the Throat , Victim of the night and Slaughter Pact . You could then run 2 of all three of these: Creeping Tar Pit , Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and Mana Confluence . Finally, you have the black discard in the forms of Thoughtseize and Inquisition of Kozilek . Just a thought.
August 13, 2014 12:10 a.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #11
Well, you changed the deck while I was making my comment, I'll fix it in a moment.
August 13, 2014 12:11 a.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #12
So here is the general deck-list I was thinking of.
Modern Izzet control
Artifact (3)
Creature (9)
Instant (19)
Sorcery (4)
Land (23)
Sideboard (15)
August 13, 2014 12:28 a.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #13
I'm intrested why you say no pyromancer? The card is fairly effective for me so far in my local area so I may be questioning it because of that. And I like clique just like the fetches I don't think I'll ever be able to afford them though. And a delver deck may have control but it's tempo control not full blown. I also with out a shuffle mechanic need as much scry as I can have. Draw and scry are my decks friends. I'll definitly look into the deck idea you have and see how it works. Thanks for the suggestions I just need to have a bigger wallet for them lol
August 13, 2014 6:12 a.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #14
I say no Young Pyromancer because he is far too easy to remove. At one toughness anything can kill it before you ever get the chance to produce anything. Delver of Secrets Flip doesn't have this issue because you can transform it, even on turn one, so it can still get its damage worth in. Plus being at one cmc he is a lot easier to protect then what Young Pyromancer is. So my gripes with Young Pyromancer is basically that he doesn't provide enough power to be useful, and is far too weak to sustain him in enough turns to make a moderate creature presence. Basically, the problem is that he is a creature without evasion that relies on another strategy to be useful, and that is what makes him weak in comparison with what is currently out there.
August 13, 2014 6:39 a.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #15
Very valid point indeed. Should I go play set of Grim Lavamancer instead so until I can somehow afford fetches and clique I have something doing more than a little bit of token making?
August 13, 2014 10:45 a.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #16
Grim Lavamancer might work, but you might not have enough fuel for it to last, don't know, worth testing.
The other cards I was thinking of are Spellheart Chimera , Keranos, God of Storms and AEtherling , but your choice.
August 13, 2014 9:21 p.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #17
Femme_Fatale i have 2 AEtherling already and i might sideboard them if i fine im having trouble later game. Also i been rethinking your deck idea and i find it kinda takes away the point of delver...hes ment to aggresively hit the opponent as you tempo out spells for removal or counters... The deck idea you made is a control deck not a delver suited deck. I might make a deck like that in blue white after this one is done but i feel the purpose of delver got overlooked in your deck changes. Not that a deck like that is bad just i feel it takes away from delver
August 13, 2014 11:17 p.m.
Oh my goodness. Don't listen to this guy about Young Pyromancer . There's a reason why it's UR Tempo is a tier deck in modern, and that's because of Young Pyromancer . Most of the removal in this game consists of Lightning Bolt , Abrupt Decay , and Path to Exile ; each of which would easily remove other cards such as Vendilion Clique , Delver of Secrets Flip and so forth. The point is, if you play cards that are vulnerable to said removal spells, they better be worth it. Is Young Pyromancer worth it? Hell yes. He can win games on his own, and generates card advantage like no other. If they remove it, so what? It's a 1-for-1 trade for a creature that costed a mere 2 mana.
He's so good that he's even featured in UR Tempo in VINTAGE! The fastest format in the game! Think about this for a moment..
August 14, 2014 12:26 a.m.
As far as REAL advice goes, you absolutely need 4x Gitaxian Probe and 4x Serum Visions . They aid in setting up your Delvers, generating tokens (and therefore tempo) through your Young Pyromancers, and of course provide you with valuable information. Your first "upgrade" with money investment should definitely be a set of 4x Remand , as mentioned by another above, since they are essentially Time Walks, and pair very well with 4x Snapcaster Mage s. Beyond these, you shouldn't use too many spells that cost 3 or more since your archetype is banking on using as few lands as possible (20 or less) in order to ensure that your draws make an impact throughout the game.
August 14, 2014 12:39 a.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #20
tchau204 thanks you for the advise on the probes and visions. Should i take out 1x island and 1x mountain for one of each and then drop 2x Izzet Charm for more draw? I dont want to lose the swords because once i have a Sword of War and Peace i can set myself up with draws and scry to have protection from 4/5 of the colors only allowing blue flyiers to (rarely would go on pyro or snapcaster) to block them while their either 5/4 or 4/3 with one sword equiped but with both making them into 7/6 or 6/5's if the swords should go i will have to seriously think about it
August 14, 2014 11:08 a.m.
I would recommend Remand over Magma Jet here. Most of the things you want to kill aren't going to die to a Magma Jet and you don't want to 2 for 1 yourself if you can help it. The Scry 2 is not worth paying 2 mana to pop someone in the dome for only 2 either. The fact that Remand replaces itself in your hand is incredibly important as well. Femme_Fatale's recommendations are not polite to the wallet but they are solid. I agree with a lot of her ideas, particularly running Serum Visions as a playset, and Vendilion Clique instead of Young Pyromancer . In a tempo deck like this your goal is to drop a Delver and protect him all the way to victory. When your deck is doing what it's meant to do you don't need the Pyromancers because the turn spent playing him should be spent protecting your Delver.
I do not recommend AEtherling however. As I stated this is a tempo deck, not a control deck. If you're trying to Electrolyze /Lightning Bolt stall Tarmogoyf s long enough to play and win with an AEtherling you're in for a long match. Hopefully I've been of some help.
August 17, 2014 10:54 p.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #22
I actually want to mention something to tchau204. Cards that will never see play in modern, legacy, standard or any other format can see play in Vintage. Vintage is where you make cards that are normally utterly terrible in another set, overly powerful in Vintage. The main reason is because of the massive access to the turn one mana with Black Lotus , the moxes and really powerful draw, you can make plays never before seen happen.
August 17, 2014 11:10 p.m.
@Femme_Fatale that's a fair assessment, which I was expecting you to say. However, there's a reason why UR Tempo is actually already a tier deck in Modern at the moment. A major component of that is Young Pyromancer , which EVERY list runs 4-ofs. If you want to make something more original and exclude him, that's your choice, but the hundreds of top 8 results from ptq's, mtgo premier events/dailies and others clearly prove its worth.
August 21, 2014 12:56 p.m.
@Jamesfurrow I would recommend dropping 1x Electrolyze for 1x Gitaxian Probe . Electrolyze is great, especially if your meta has a lot of Affinity players, but, given that your deck is functioning on 20 lands, you don't want to risk getting clogged with too many 3+ CMC cards. I would recommend cutting 1 of your Swords but, you did say you really like them. Furthermore, you could cut 1x Magma Jet and 1x Mana Leak for 2x Deprive which is great in this deck (and much cheaper than Remand ) since you don't need many lands to function.
August 21, 2014 1:02 p.m.
Jamesfurrow says... #25
tchau204 idk if dropping an Electrolyze is really necissary because its at worst 2 burn the opponent and draw. Ik probe should probally be a completed set but i feel with 10 draw cards i am doing fine. And would i really be flooded with only 1/12th of my deck being 3 drops? The odds of getting 2-3 3 drops in my hand are low as it is. Also i like the idea of Deprive its essentially Counterspell that lets me reuse a land for my one drops! Ill definitly put it in once i can get my hand on them especially since its a .20 cent card
Jamesfurrow says... #1
Curius52 the reason Dissolve is not used it because yes it is a hard counter spell the opponents spells only get easier to cast when i use Mana Leak incorrectly. The curve needs to stay low because i need fast cheap awnsers for the speed. Now i placed Guttersnipe in my sideboard because when im agaisnt removal decks or red deck win delver is weak. So i swap delver with Guttersnipe and my deck acually plays a whole lot different but is much more controling because they focus on pyromancer.
That is why i dont think Dissolve is viable in modern for my kind of deck at least
August 7, 2014 3:33 p.m.