I guess I'm in a debating mood, please let me know if i'm off base with any of this.

I see 2 colorless lands, everything else produces colored mana, with the most of that being white. So i'm not seeing the downside to 1 more utility land. It could be Slayers' Stronghold, Wasteland, Strip Mine or Blinkmoth Nexus. Your color requirements really don't seem that severe either. There are 4 cards that cost double anything that are under 4 mana. hitting a Maze of Ith, Kor Haven or even a Cabal Coffers seem great!

I think if you're not running the aether grid, the artifact lands aren't worth it. I think you're opening yourself up to Vandalblast and Ruination for no tangible benefit.

About the chaos warp, just to make sure i'm understanding this. If you play chaos warp on your commander and choose to put her in the command zone you still flip the top card? Could you explain this to me like i'm a child lol. I've been playing it wrong if you're right haha

I also made a bunch of card suggestions that i would love debating you on!

I don't think there needs to be a Cabal Coffers.

You didn't really say any particular reason you wouldn't run a Strionic Resonator or Rings of Brighthearth. They simply get more out of every card and can take over games when ignored. The resonator at its worst can still turn your commander from a Slagstorm to an Inferno (crazy w/ lifelink). There's also a certain feeling unique to copying guys like Sun Titan, Stoneforge Mystic/Relic Seeker, or Argentum Armor. Also the cuteness of allowing Quicksmith Rebel to power up 2 artifacts.

Also for getting everything out of your creatures there's Cauldron of Souls. I'd like to offer Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant even if you believe he's too slow. Metas are wild.

That section was supposed to be mentioning the lands you could hit with a Wasteland or Strip Mine lol. I need to proofread my posts better

hoardofnotions: Oh, I missed your earlier comment! Lemme fix that now...

First post: Boros Garrison can bite you sometimes, but overall I'm pleased with it. I don't own an Eiganjo Castle or fetchlands, unfortunately. Inspiring Vantage is awesome. Sublime Archangel used to be better when I was playing more token cards like Monastery Mentor, but it's still pulling its weight (usually gives at least +4/+4 to my Exalted creature). Inquisitor's Flail is one of my most valuable cards, wouldn't leave home without it. Relic Seeker is much worse than Stoneforge Mystic obviously, but still very good (I need to see if Sram can make the cut as well). I'm not really a fan of Tithe. Lightning Greaves is generally a better card than Swiftfoot Boots BUT shroud isn't friendly in a Voltron deck. Mistveil Plains/Sunforger is not a combo I really like here, to be honest - it's better suited for a slow, grindy deck. Armory Automaton does not work very well with Argentum Armor unfortunately. I'm glad you're enjoying your Aurelia deck!

Latest post: I'm honestly not sure why I have trouble with colors in this deck, but I do. Perhaps I shuffle wrong? But for now I'm not willing to add more utility lands TBH. (Also, I can't run Cabal Coffers obv - what card did you mean?)

The artifact lands DO work better with Puresteel Paladin and Mox Opal (considering adding the latter).

And with regards to Chaos Warp - if you Warp a commander, the top card of its owner's library still gets flipped. This is because the effect that puts the commander back into the Command Zone is a replacement effect, not an effect that makes the target illegal (in the latter case, the spell would be countered and the top card would not be flipped - for example, if the commander in question was sacrificed in response). However - in the special case of a commander being Warped - the commander isn't shuffled in and therefore the order of the library is unchanged before the flip occurs.

Does that clear that up? :)

the_earl_0f_grey: I can't run Cabal Coffers anyway :)

I don't run Strionic Resonator or Rings of Brighthearth because both cards are disappointing - too little effect on their own, and too conditional. In 95% of cases, they are just dead cards. I've tried them and found they just didn't work in this build. (In fact, I find that Strionic Resonator sucks in general, but that's a longer conversation.) There are just too few triggered effects I'm willing to pay mana to copy. I could give you proper statistical analysis if you want, but it's mostly personal preference.

I don't personally think that Cauldron of Souls is worth 5 mana here, especially since it conflicts with my commander's CMC. I actually used to run Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant in here, haha - and I'm conflicted over him. He's amazing if I can drop him T3. He's really disappointing if I drop him T5 (because I'm frequently below 30 life at that point). I cut him due to reliability issues.

I hope this answers your questions!

Still had to come down here. And looking at all the delicate tweaks you made and the list that you present us, I believe there is little to say at this moment. But then I reached your land section. Perhaps I can deliver a solid advise, one that perhaps is not totally surprising, but will encourage you to get the best out of it xD

Consistancy is in the competitive neighbourhood a thing. Your landbase, especially in a multicolor deck, should not hinder you to keep pushing forward. A tapped land at a time, will not let you shine :)

There we go....

Plateau is missing in action... please try to get a hold of this beauty.

Arid Mesa grabs your Sacred Foundry and your Plateau xD Did I push to hard on this beauty of a card ;)

Reflecting Pool to switch with either a City of Brass or a Mana Confluence

Needle Spires do you really need this? Coming tapped in play can be a pain at times. I would avoid this as much as possible

Both lands with hideaway come into play tapped as well. While the hidaway option is too situational if you ask me. I think you have more profit from lands being untapped.

Kor Haven gives colorless mana and serves as a combo breaker when ppl go nuts with a combat phase. I prefer this mid- and endgame.

I see you are doing well with this deck. I am looking forward to have you in the top 10 of EDH decks as well.

Job well done and keep up the good work mate!

PJ

PartyJ: Yeah yeah yeah, I need to get my hands on a Plateau. I just don't have the $60 sitting around (and that old art, yuck). Maybe if I can find a copy on deep discount somewhere...

Yesterday I would have said that Arid Mesa was far too much. But since the enemy fetches are being printed in MM17, who knows...

Reflecting Pool is something I'll consider :)

Needle Spires has actually, astonishingly, won me games before. Turns out that in the late game, if all of my creatures have been lost, a land that can carry a sword with double strike is better than you'd think, haha. Plus my GF gave me my foily copy as a gift, so I'm partial to it ;)

Kor Haven is a good idea, I'll have to add that. And I think you're right that the hideaways can be pretty slow. Spinerock Knoll has pulled its weight, but I think you're right that Windbrisk Heights needs to be cut :(

Thanks, that's a lot of help! Haha.

Wow you're still getting attention on this deck. Good job, man :)

readerrw07: Thanks! I'm close to breaking into the top 10 EDH decks of all time, so I'm pushing it somewhat hard haha :)

I remember when you posted this on my avacyn deck a year ago wen neither of us knew what we were doing. They grow up so fast :p

readerrw07: Things change so fast :')

Your deck really did help me out a lot when looking for direction in this deck. I owe you a favor - if you ever want me help just HMU :)

How's your Avacyn deck faring?

It kinda doesnt really exist anymore :P I took a lot of the same ideas recently and applied them to another deck I made around Queen Marchesa just last week. If you want I can paste the link in here :P

I'm surprised you don't have Hero's Blade since it equips for free and makes Avacyn just a bit bigger-a 9/7 once flipped for free once played is neat, and you have a bunch of legendaries for it to equip to as well(I'd sub out O-Naginata TBH- you lose the trample, but Avacyn already has evasion.

Masterwork of Ingenuity, Semblance Anvil, and Prototype Portal would be really good too, since they'd let you double up(or in Prototype portal's case, as many as you can get out) on whatever equips you really liked. Skyblinder Staff is a bit doofy but is surprisingly good evasion for a flying commander, especially one with damage.

Snacrifice: Thanks for the comment!

I used to play Hero's Blade, but I found that the problem was the prohibitively high equip cost. I know it auto-equips to Avacyn, but if I don't already have it down when Avacyn enters it's just terrible (6 mana for a mere 3/2 boost). It was just too inconsistent, and I cut it because I needed the slots.

O-Naginata has proven itself to be one of the strongest cards in the deck, to be honest. I agree that there are objectively stronger equipment (like Loxodon Warhammer) but the thing that elevates O-Naginata is its ridiculously low cast and equip cost.

Masterwork of Ingenuity is something I also used to play, but it got cut when I realized there were actually very few equipment I wanted to copy (since many of the good ones grant keywords, or are legendary, or are redundant in multiples). I just got sick of drawing it without any good targets so I cut it - consistency is king. Still, though, I'll reconsider adding it, thanks!

I've never tried Semblance Anvil here, but I'm worried it's too vulnerable to removal. While I loved it in a Standard Myr deck back in the day, in EDH it's far too easy to get 2-for-1'd if it's removed, leaving it as serious card disadvantage. Also, I don't have enough of any one permanent to make it worth it IMO.

Prototype Portal is an awesome card, I just don't want to spend 8 mana for my first copy of an equipment that's already in my hand. It also has the same problem as Semblance Anvil in that removal leaves me with serious card disadvantage.

Thanks for your comment! I appreciate your help a lot :) Also, you said on the "Advertise your deck" page that you'd +1'd the deck, but I think the website didn't register it - mind clicking it again? :)

done and done! Weird, didn't register for whatever reason.

Snacrifice: Oh, and I'll consider adding Skyblinder Staff :) For now, my meta doesn't have too much flying (or creatures at all, actually) but if it does, I'll add this in a heartbeat. I'm just worried about that pesky high equip cost...

you should try Grafted Exoskeleton, it's a low-key sac outlet that combos with Gift of Immortality

Hi, so I'm currently working on a avacyn list myself but I plan on going with more enchantment control. I was wondering if you tried out War's Toll? Seems like it'd be great here.

Also I plan to rely on Sneak Attack heavily, abusing Karmic Guide, Reveillark etc did you consider going that route?

you know, I think it's time to retire my avacyn deck. my meta hoses voltron builds.

feyn_do_alduin: I tried it, but I don't like infect, and I found it far too easy to get blown out (by having them destroy the Exoskeleton, forcing me to sac the equipped creature). Also, what's your meta like? Maybe we can figure out a way to overcome that.

dlamars: Hi! I will say that if you plan to run this as more of enchantment control, Gisela, Blade of Goldnight might work better for you. With regards to War's Toll specifically, I always preferred Price of Glory.

But I definitely considered that route, and chose not to follow it. Basically, this is a voltron deck first, and a stax deck second (because playing a lot of stax enchantments dilutes the aggressive nature of the deck). The deck you seem to be making is a stax deck first and a voltron deck second: they may overlap in a lot of the card choices but the focus is different. Regardless, feel free to tag me if you want any help with yours! :)

my meta embraces the silly combos and the doofiest cards. but they've also learned to deal with hardcore competitive players. This includes top tier lists for voltron, combo control, amongst others.

So they've geared their decks in such a way to be prepared in the even of another geared list to join the table, often using silly combos and broken (in a silly way) cards.

for example, I run a decent quality Omnath, Locus of Rage build, in response they started running Ground Assault and Acidic Soil to one-shot me after i've gotten to critical mass. the only way to get around it is to bolt the guy who played it until he's dead before the card resolves

feyn_do_alduin: Without trying to sound snarky, the best way to avoid dying to that is to either proactively protect yourself (not let yourself fall into the life range where Acidic Soil can kill you) or optimize your deck to the point where you can kill them first. Given that Acidic Soil does 1 damage per land and Omnath nets 8 (5 power and a Lightning Bolt) you shouldn't be super afraid of the card?

Daedalus19876 well Price of Glory is cool, but I have Abeyance and Orim's Chant in the list as part of my Sunforger package. I just dig War's Toll since it's effects are so one sided.

If you would like to I've made a first draft you can check out:A church angle, have seen. I ended up with a lot less enchantments than I expected, but Stranglehold, War's Toll, Crackdown etc made the cut. Let me know what you think.

dlamars: Thanks for the upvote! I'll check out your list in a second.

(Also, I find Price of Glory to be pretty 1-sided in my list, because I tap very few lands at instant speed, but it may be different in yours.)

I like this, and the page formatting is neat too. But if you wanted to protect your stuff from avacyn, why not Light of Sanction? I'd suggest cutting something like O-Naginata