Epicpotato says... #2
I see you are running at least 5 board wipes, how is that working out for you? I've only got 2. Should I be running more?
February 2, 2015 3:26 a.m.
I would say that running lots of board wipes and removal is imperative in decks like this.
I can easily recover from a board wipe, and having a full graveyard is as good as board presence for a deck like this. Many games are going to need a board wipe or two when things get out of hand, especially because this deck gets hated on.
Just my two cents.
February 3, 2015 9:48 a.m.
Epicpotato says... #4
Hmm... interesting. I was considering running more board wipes, but not truly because the only game I have completed in its entirety with this deck was while playing with a much more tuned Teneb, the Harvester. (Mesmeric Orb, btw, is fricken amazing)
February 4, 2015 3:08 a.m.
Yeesh, it stinks when you play against somebody with the same deck type as you. I've only played against one Karador deck. It was much less tuned than mine but he got lucky and reanimate a Sylvan primordial turn 2.
Mesmeric Orb is pretty sweet, I have one in my Sidisi self-mill deck, but I don't usually rely on milling myself in this deck enough to justify it taking a spot.
February 4, 2015 12:14 p.m.
BX223Hunter says... #6
I have enjoyed running Mesmeric Orb in mine. Just helps fuel the GY and hoses other players. Especially playing vamp and enlightened tutor :)
Also - Merciless Executioner from Fates is a new Fleshbag Marauder!!
February 5, 2015 1:43 p.m.
BX223Hunter says... #7
Oh and Karametra, God of Harvests is excellent ramp
February 5, 2015 1:45 p.m.
I know! I really wanna grab a foil one!
Karametra, God of Harvests is pretty sweet. Not sure about having a 5-drop be my ramp, but I'll think about it.
February 5, 2015 1:51 p.m.
Just food for thought, I'm not saying this is exactly correct, but I wanted to share my theory based on my play testing.
I've been building a similar list and I've been removing almost all 1 for 1 removal that isn't on a creature's back.
I would replace:Mortify Path to Exile Maelstrom Pulse
with all wraths:Rout, Day of Judgement?!?!?!!, (maybe Crux of Fate). In this case, End Hostilities is actually quite good because so many EDH decks run Sword of Fire and Ice, etc, and try to Voltron up.
If your concerned about enchantments like Rest in Peace, Back to Nature is probably better than a 1 for 1 because you can recover your lost enchantments more easily.
The main reason to wrath instead of target is because you can recover from a wrath far more quickly and efficiently than your opponents can. Plus, a yard full of creatures is where you want to be - especially since you have so many have etb effects.
If you add in a few of these Satyr Wayfinder Grisly Salvage Commune with the Gods Deadbridge Chant, you'll always be able to play Karador, Ghost Chieftan for three, which means you'll be able to play it and (at a minimum) Voice of Resurgence the turn after any wrath. Your opponent, on the other hand, will be at a card disadvantage for every creature lost under the wrath. They may end up in a position where they need to top deck to recover.
Throw in Avacyn, Angel of Hope and wrath effects win you the game.
There are exceptions. Vindicate is so good that it should stay in. But for anything that can ride on the back of a creature, I think you'll be better suited to do so. Reclamation Sage is better in this deck than Krosan Grip for example. Avatar of Woe will almost always drop for 2 and provides an answer for most threats.
February 26, 2015 11:08 a.m.
You bring up some very good points.
The only real reason I use targeted removal like that is that it works at instant speed (and they're pretty flexible in the case of Mortify and Putrefy).
I'll think about removing them. Rout is a great card, I will make sure to get one and an Utter End. I'll have to wait until I can get foil ones however, no use in buying the same card twice.
I would like to keep Krosan Grip, however. It's split-second speed means it can't be countered or responded to, which is pretty valuable. I might also think about Return to Dust.
February 26, 2015 11:20 p.m.
If you're looking for foils, the game day promo for Utter End is amazing. I don't know how to make the promo appear in here... but Google it, it will make you happy.
February 27, 2015 10:58 a.m.
Coinman1863 says... #13
What about Dictate of Erebos and/or Grave Pact? Since you are sacing so many things why not get a 2 for 1?
April 13, 2015 12:51 p.m.
Scroobmaster69 says... #14
Where's the Tooth and Nail and Defense of the Heart?
April 25, 2015 12:16 a.m.
Would Tooth and Nail be better than Chord of Calling? I know I have a Defense of the Heart somewhere, I'll look into it.
Restoration Angel is another cool card, I've never had a copy of one though. Any idea for things to cut for it?
May 20, 2015 10:42 a.m.
Scroobmaster69 says... #18
Lol Restoration Angel is better though karador decks usually don't run Resolute Archangel.
May 21, 2015 5:29 p.m.
MikesUltimatum says... #19
Great deck! :)
I really like this. I have been looking at building Karador for quite some time, and this is probably the most solid list I've seen. I have a couple suggestions though, regarding your maybe list and one other card.
My suggestions:
- Take out Yawgmoth's Will, as it doesn't interact with a ton of your deck.
- Take out Reveillark. Same reason.
- Take out Phyrexian Altar. It doesn't give enough value for sacrificing a creature.
- Add Corpse Connoisseur. It becomes an amazing toolbox card in your deck.
- Add Merciless Executioner. With Karador on the field, he's just recurring sacrifice, like Fleshbag Marauder.
- Add Genesis. You're going to be filling up your graveyard, so go ahead and take advantage of that.
August 8, 2015 2:04 p.m.
Goblinaire says... #20
I can never recommend Liliana of the Veil enough for Karador lists. She's the one planeswalker who's every ability is something karador loves. Not to mention recurrable by sun Titan and not wiped by Pernicious deed which is also recurrable by sun Titan.
September 20, 2015 3:56 p.m.
Goblinaire says... #21
Another suggestion is Diabolic Intent, I like it more than vampiric tutor infact, as I personally prefer cards in hand as oppose to the top of my library.
If you get a Mindslicer as well he's bonkers with karador and can be sacked with Intent to tutor a card after the discard, which can be really backbreaking if you're in a strong board position or pull a draw engine.
September 21, 2015 12:53 a.m.
Devilishly good ideas. So you would remove Vampiric Tutor for Diabolic Tutor.
What would you remove for Lilly (if I ever get rich enough to get another one)?
September 21, 2015 8:35 a.m.
Also, MikesUltimatum: Those are some interesting suggestions. I know I need a Merciless Executioner in here. I'll take out Yawgmoth's Win for it.
Corpse Connoisseur is pretty expensive for what he does. Would Buried Alive be any better? Or entomb even.
I'm not sure about Reveillark. I understand that it fails to hit most of the deck, but it seems every time I get it I end up getting massive value out of it. I'll look into cutting it, though.
September 21, 2015 8:41 a.m.
Goblinaire says... #24
Hmm, I don't know what kind of results you have had with Garruk Relentless Flip but Liliana of the Veil seems like she'd be more consistently reliable. I might even swap out regular Liliana in favor of cheaper tutors, outside of Demonic Tutor and Diabolic Edict you may enjoy Eladamri's Call (note the Instant speed) Tooth and Nail and my personal favorite Defense of the Heart. The latter two could pull up Mindslicer and Magister of Worth simultaneously in 1v1, which is actually hilarious.
Definitely drop Crucible in this deck since Sun Titan can pull your lands and ramp you if they are indeed hitting the grave often, and i second the hell out of Entomb and Buried Alive. If you haven't guessed I like tutors.
I'm basically showing you combos from my own Karador deck to consider, as I've played them out before and know they work.
September 21, 2015 2:44 p.m.
MikesUltimatum says... #25
Lhurgyof - Corpse Connoisseur is expensive, but remember that with Karador, you can use him over and over again, unlike Buried Alive. Reveillark combined with Karmic Guide gives you a lot of infinite combos. It's a must imo.
Lhurgyof says... #1
Oooh, Pull from Eternity is neat. I only like Riftsweeper because I can recur it multiple times.
I could look at a Worldly Tutor in here as well, I fell that it'll work nicely in here.
Thanks for all the comments!
September 30, 2014 6:17 p.m.