I generally disagree with Liliana's Caress . It slows you down too much to be worth it. I'd much rather have a Wrench Mind on turn 2. It'll deal damage, but you can do that once your opponent has no cards in hand with your Nantuko Shade . Other than that, it looks pretty good. Check out my deck Put Those Cards Down (Black Red Version), let me know if you have any ideas for me.

Valid point twospires, but I have won way too many games off a caress to take it out.

I think that your deck looks good. The only thing I can think of to possibly help you is adding a Painful Quandary . Liliana's Caress would work well with it!

Ooo, painful : )

Great deck. Maybe a Liliana's Reaver for a little bit of muscle.

Decent idea sir.

Wow cool deck! Looks like it does some serious damage. I just wanted to suggest a few things.

First: What's your main objective? Do you want the opponent to have to discard and then lose life from Liliana's Caress , or swing at them with creatures? Though I know you definitely aim to mainly make them discard, I say this because some of your creatures don't really add anything to the combo you already have going. Maybe rather than 4 Nantuko Shade you add in 4 Augur of Skulls for block and discard, or even Wight of Precinct Six if you feel as though that extra power helps (I like Hypnotic Specter by the way!).

Second:... Even though Rakdos, Lord of Riots adds to the overall character of this deck, he's really quite useless. He has a small drawback to play, which isn't too bad, but then his ability really doesn't help you at all considering it only affects your Specters. Rather than him, wouldn't Desecration Demon be a lot more powerful? When playing a discard deck, you're looking to keep the battlefield clear of enemy creatures so you can hold out until you get a good combo going. Desecration Demon poses a huge threat on the battlefield just like Rakdos, except that he makes the opponent consider sacrificing his/her creatures, which is exactly what you want. If not, he swings for massive damage. Additionally, Desecration Demon isn't legendary, so you can have as many on the field as you want.

Finally, I thought that Shrieking Affliction might be another enchantment to consider.

I really like how you splashed red in here with awesome cards like Blightning and Rakdos's Return !! +1 from me! (Sorry for the extensive comment!)

I like it, but wouldn't it be worth it to take the Demonic Tutor out, and play it as Legacy? I would also agree that Desecration Demon would outperform Rakdos, Lord of Riots in this deck. Hell, even Shimian Specter would work pretty well in that slot. I really like the deck though. +1 from me

@juliandusett, thanks for the excellent feedback. My main objective is to cause discard/ life loss with Liliana's Caress . I'll explain my thought process behind the creatures: Hypnotic Specter is obvious. Nantuko Shade was added because in a lot of games, my opponent would have no more cards in hand and I'd have all this mana with nothing to use it on, why not dump it into the shade? It also acts as a good creature if they manage to get any out, as my only removal is Lightning Bolt . I just needed some creatures to finish off their remaining life points if I don't get The Rack or more burn quick enough. Ideally, I would love to replace Rakdos, Lord of Riots with Desecration Demon s, but not at their current $$pricetag$$. Does that make any sense to you? Let me know please = )

@Froggy7521, It wouldn't be worth it. I don't play any formatted events yet. All casual. And Demonic Tutor into Liliana of the Veil has proven extremely powerful! I like the Shimian Specter idea, but I'd rather have a beefy creature. Definitely need me some Demons though. Thanks!!

@cakrause86, no problem! Yeah I've just been lucky and I've gotten 3 Desecration Demon s in packs, but they are on the more expensive side. Also, if you find yourself getting more mana than you need, consider adding in the card Raven's Crime . As soon as you start getting mana flooded, just continuously use this card and you'll realize how awesome it can be! Anyways, good luck with your deck!

Very interesting idea juliandusett. Thanks for your assistance. I very much apprecite it.

this deck can be real nasty but it can be beat the same way it kills if you Thoughtseize the real good discards or damage ones you can cripple it and destroy it

@mrtibbs24, much like the way every other deck in the game can be beaten. And I'd have to disagree, it would take more than 4Thoughtseize to stop this deck. The burn can kill you, the creatures can kill you, or The Rack can get it done. Way too many targets to get rid of. Not saying it's bulletproof, but your comment essentially says "dies to removal"=Duh! : )

Megrim and Despise and Shrieking Affliction . maybe Wrench Mind and Nyxathid

Liliana's Caress out classes Megrim . I think The Rack outclasses Shrieking Affliction . Hymn to Tourach outclasses Wrench Mind . Nyxathid seems fun. Thoughtseize outclasses Despise and Duress . Any other suggestions hungryGoliath?

Someone help me take out 2 cards for 2 Thoughtseize .

I would remove 2 Liliana's Caress . I'm not sure if it works differently enough from Megrim for my experience to carry over, but I had Megrim in my discard deck for about a year and found that it slows you down too much. The Caress keeps you from dropping that Hymn to Tourach until turn 3 because you'll get 4 extra damage out of it. The thing is, once you've ripped your opponent's entire hand away, you can have all the time you want to kill them, especially with Funeral Charm working almost like Time Walk . Again, that is only my opinion of Megrim , but I thought it works with Liliana's Caress too.

I also don't like the idea of Rakdos's Return , just because by the time you get to enough mana for it to count (probably 4 or 5), if you're doing it right, your opponent won't have anything left. I'd rather go with faster discard spells to make sure hey don't drop anything before you can make them discard it.

to add the thoughtseize, -2 lightning bolt for them

I actually cut 1 Liliana's Caress and 1 Tainted Peak . Gotta have 4 Lightning Bolt ! : )

Why Liliana's Caress over something like Shrieking Affliction ?

Also I'm not entirely sure I'd run Rakdos's Return in a 19 land deck when you could run Inquisition of Kozilek or Raven's Crime or something similar. I suppose RReturn would be good as a 1-of but I don't think you have the mana base to support it.

I feel the same way about Desecration Demon - maybe not enough land to be able to make it work. Besides if you do want a 4 drop hitter you really want Phyrexian Obliterator really.

Why do you have Nantuko Shade ?

This deck is freakish and always mana floods. Thats why i run only 19 lands now. Some one suggested the Demons. Seemed like a good idea. The nantukos are for all the extra mana. Its hard to imagine but it always gives me a bunch of lands. But i havent extensively used it in person with the demons yet.

But in all seriousness ChiefBell, do you think I should replace all 3 Liliana's Caress with Shrieking Affliction ?

You didn't ask me, but I think it would improve the deck.

Thanks. : )