i see noyan is t3, is it really that easy to kll people with a inkmoth nexus, or steal creatures with the mirror weave cheese? i feel like he should be moved down. thoght?

Noyan being T3 almost seems like mercy. His ability is irrelevant in most competitive situations.

Also is thassa able to do anything other than hightide? Competitively speaking

Sharuum is easily tier one. Her ability to protect her combo and have it readily available at all times makes her a threat at almost any point in the game.

Except she's 6CMC to cast..

Sharuum is very good, but her win conditions are somewhat clunky and slow to assemble, and shes a 6 drop. I'm afraid she is no longer fast enough for tier 1. In that regard she is in good company. There are a large number of excellent generals in tier 2 that are about a turn slower and somewhat less resilient than the top decks in the format.

bossofthisgym - We recently bumped down Narset and Sharuum to T2 because of their CMCs. In light of the new mulligan rules for commander, their consistency at dropping early has been significantly reduced.

Hello all, can someone please explain to me why Prime Speaker Zegana is Tier 2? I just don't get it.

@Wee_Dragonaut: She's a surprisingly good Food Chain commander. With Chain and Misthollow Griffin or Eternal Scourge, she can draw her entire deck.

Every cycle of Scourge or Misthallow being exiled by Food Chain and recast nets 1 additional mana. Repeating grants you infinite mana of any color that can only be used to cast creatures. You can then repeatedly cast Zegana and exile her back to the command zone, drawing cards every cycle until she's holdingher entire library. Then usually Laboratory Maniac is cast.

I have been mulling this over for a while. I question The Mimeoplasm's spot in the top tier.

From a pure speed perspective, The Mimeoplasm is certainly fast enough on color scheme alone. It can "1 card combo" with Buried Alive (necrotic ooze+triskelion+phyrexian devourer), but that is an 8 mana win condition that is only viable in the first 4 or so turns. There is of course synergy with Survival of the Fittest and Intuition, but again most games it is better to tutor for then use a Victimize or Reanimate. The other good combos for mimeo only kill one player with infect dmg, which are wasted slots in multiplayer.

Having an reanimation spell in the command zone certainly provides a degree of resilience and redundancy to graveyard based combos but that is about all it adds to the strategy. Is that really better than Sidisi, Brood Tyrant, which is an outlet for a MUCH faster "2 card combo" ( that can win the game for a 4 mana investment on turn 2-4 very consistently Eternal Scourge + Food Chain ). food chain combo also brings extra toys for Laboratory Maniac to win with (ex. Tainted Pact). Between these interactions, Sidisi is faster (on average) at winning the game, if less resilient since both generals can use Necrotic Ooze and Hermit Druid combo with about the same efficiency. If Sidisi, Brood Tyrant is tier 2 (which is a reasonable placement for her given her strengths and weaknesses) what does The Mimeoplasm do that is so much better?

There may well be several things The Mimeoplasm does to deserve its spot. I just never see much talk about the mimeoplasm anymore in competitive circles and I wonder what the rest of you think?

At the risk of revealing my utter ignorance here, are there any T1 decks/variants that don't win off a combo, but rather more conventionally -- ie overwhelming damage from creatures, spells, or general?

BaronBS: Yisan, occasionally Brago (if he can't find the combo), Derevi, and Edric usually win through combat damage.

I wouldn't have expected Brago -- thanks for the info.

Is Edric's strategy really that powerful in cEDH? He seems extremely easy to disrupt to me. I thought combat oriented strategies weren't generally very good?

Lilbrudder - To quote NarejED from about a month ago:
"A big part of it is his color identity. BUG/Sultai is naturally the best 3-color combination for Reanimator builds. It has access to Buried Alive, Intuition, Survival of the Fittest, and nearly every other relevant reanimator spell. A big part of it is the commander himself though. The deck wins either by assembling Necrotic Ooze combo, activating Hermit Druid, or cheating Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur or another bomb into play. Mimeoplasm is relevant to all three of these strategies. If another reanimate effect isn't available, he can be used to copy Nooze from the graveyard and win. If Hermit Druid cannot be reached, Plasm can copy Mirror-Mad Phantasm. It's 2-mana ability has the same effect as HD here since its ability will fail to find, thus milling the whole deck. Finally, Mimeo is amazing at cheating bombs into play. Not only can he grab relevant creatures from your own graveyard, he can grab them from ANYONE'S graveyard. If Karador is foolish enough to entomb Boonweaver and pass the turn, BOOM, Mimeo disrupts his plan and nets a relevant creature. Having such a powerful piece of utility in the command zone makes the deck worthy of Tier 1, if only at its lower end."

Yisan doesn't need to combo win. It just tutors for Craterhoof through Yisan or another bomb.

Do we not have an ideal Leovold list? I've been using Lilbrudder's list as a guide to build my own, but I'd like to compare a few.

Edit: looking for all in doomsday, not interested in a backup tendrils plan.

I do not agree that General Tazri or Yisan, the Wanderer Bard being tier one at all.

@kyuuri117: What about a backup of Mind's Desire instead? That's what my build runs. Link

why is phenax t3 isnt kozi common in Cedh?

Watason723, Wow! So nice of you to bring that interesting and unusual opinionated statement to the table. It's such an infrequent discussion point that I'm sure expounding upon it in discussion would benefit all parties involved!

I wonder... Could you possibly have garnered some information regarding the Teir 1 relevancy of those commanders on your own before posting? I'm sure it would be a difficult endeavor, since Yisan and Tazri are so rarely talked about, but I think that checking the decklists posted for them on the description and reading through the comment stream (the one you just posted in) might well be viable starting points. (And if scrolling through the comments seems too dreary for you, you can always ctrl+F "Tazri" and "Yisan.")

May fortuitous learning be upon you.

sonnet you monster. literally wow. (good job)

sonnet you monster. literally wow. (good job)

@sonnet666 this seems a little harsh?

@Watason723 can you be a little clearer as to why these generals seem inferior?

Dredge4life Maybe sonnet666 was a bit harsh but to be fair those are HIGHLY discussed generals and Watason723 didn't bring anything to the table other than "I don't agree", not a why, not personal experience, nothing.