I don't think we want tier 1 being viewed as "broken" or "banable" because then we have the possibility of them actually being banned on a regular basis if such ideas take hold. We don't want cEDH to be a "rotating format" like modern has turned into.

And yes, I know it's a different group of people who do EDH bans, and I don't know if they're even monitoring this forum, but I think it's still a dangerous way to portray the top tier generals.

The RC never bans for competitive concerns, nor power level in general, so calling any of these generals bannable is a big stretch.

Also, before calling anything broken, consider we're playing with somewhere between Vintage and Legacy card pools. Given that, I think the speed at which some decks can win when built optimally is pretty reasonable relative to other Eternal formats.

The RC does whatever they want. You have to figure, if they wanted to slow down cEDH they could ban select combo pieces. Stuff like Hermit Druid and Food Chain would be big pieces. That is sure to effect the Tier lists.

Ad Nauseam Doomsday Zur doesn't actually NEED Zur. The combo can be ran in any Esper deck. It is actually in the same spot as Grixis Storm. Neither need the Commander, those are just the best Commanders for it.

Now Zur is a great Commander by himself, don't get me wrong. The deck that is viewed as the best Zur deck doesn't actually need him. He just provides that little extra, like Jeleva, Nephalia's Scourge does.

The RC won't do that. Their ban list is never based off power level; it is off of things that create undesirable game states for a number of reasons. Worrying about combo pieces being banned because they are powerful is asinine because it is never going to happen.

You can say the RC does whatever they want, but what they want never concerns competitive players unless a card that is widely used competitively is also ruining games in the type of playgroup that the RC envisions as "ideal".

The RC doesn't care about cEDH, nor does it care about moderating or crippling it in any way. Ad Nauseam, Doomsday, and other cEDH staples like them are never being played how they are in cEDH in your "average" EDH game, which makes them not problematic. I'd bet you an arbitrarily large sum of money that none of those cards that have no negative impact on the enjoyment of casual EDH will ever be banned.

I am in 100% agreement with you RivenVII. I was just making an example. I think it help put into perspective why I think it is okay to call Tier 1 - Overpowered

I'd just call T1 "Best of the Best" as the very nature of cEDH is that everything is crazy powerful and those 15 just happen to be a bit subjectively better than the other 40 powerful legends in Tier 2.

I say subjective because we have no tournament results to base anything off of, just the experiences of an admittedly small group of players in cEDH.

Glad we seem to be on the same page though. I personally love the RC's approach to the format because it makes my 75% games where I'm chilling with my friends and other non-cutthroat players fun and makes sure that the potential explosiveness of the format is untouched.

Really though, just imagine how many cards could be unbanned if Deadeye Navigator went away.

Also, if RC is listening, please, not my baby. NOT MY BABY!

By my count, three.

Primeval Titan - Although the ban probably wouldn't be lifted if Deadeye Navigator was banned. I'm giving you this one for free.

Sundering Titan - Probably stay banned as well. Deadeye is just one bounce effect.

Sylvan Primordial - You know what, I give up. I don't think anything will come off the banlist if Deadeye got banned.

@iAzire probably why it's not banned then, lol.

Voting for a comment sweep lol

I know its probably not going to be in many (if any) optimal builds, but I really like Cataclysmic Gearhulk.

I also think we should have certain "gatekeeper" commanders to help define the tiers. For example, The Mimeoplasm could set the bar for what is consitered tier one.

Lilbrudder it fills daretti's grave while dealing mediocre- amazing damage. it isnt THE worst card he could slot in his flexes.

I think we are talking about different cards :-) I like the red one for daretti alot as well.

You forgot to add Storm Crow, it is easily tier one!

Indeed, also does anyone have a optimized Selvala deck

Lilbrudder oops we are. the cataclysmic one is a cool thing in standard, but he is outclassed in edh over other board wipes, like wog.

Hello this is a question / deck recommendation, to thegigibeast or NarejEDI have been working on a Yisan, the Wanderer Bard for awhile now, and after looking at the Yisan, the Wanderer Bard list you feature, I realized mine was probably better. Especially because it has a description. I was just wondering how you make the scroll downs in your description? Like when you click Tier one lists and a list pops down?Thanks Marcus Heres a link to my deck [http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/tier-1-commander-deck]

The red one is absolutely bonkers in Feldon as well. Reanimating it every turn is just..... Mean

TheMarcus: Sorry, but no. I'll go over why, in no particular order.

• Vitalize and Mobilize are too win-more. If you're getting enough value out of them, you should've won already.

• Slow cards: Mosswort Bridge, Lunatic Flute, Elvish Harbinger, Fecundity ("Here you go Prossh!"), Thousand-Year Elixir, Birthing Pod, Ring of Three Wishes. You don't really need creature tutors (what does your commander do?), 10 mana tutors, or cards that probably benefit your opponents more than you.

• Realm Seekers does nothing useful.

• You have no stack interaction. If a combo deck goes off, you're dead.

• Now that I look at it, I don't think you have any instant-speed interaction. No removal, so if any combo deck starts to do anything, you can't stop them.

This deck isn't very good. It's slow, non-interactive, and is weak to powerful permanents. You can't reasonably beat any other tier 1 decks. We should keep Shaper's list.

Sorry for the double post, but I realized that the deck doesn't actually have a description yet.

Hotcake_Gotsyrup: Yeah its not great or even playable in most optimized decks, especially if you try to use it like wog, but an etb effect like that is extrmely abusable. Sharuum could probably do some stupid things with it especially in a build that has alot of blink effects. I am always happy when WOTC prints cards like this.

Leinahtan: Glad someone gave my some constructive critism, the only way to get people to help you with your deck is say it's super good! HAHAHAH

Also Realm Seekers will tutor up Wirewood Lodge and or Gaea's Cradle to combo with the Yisan 4 of Argothian Elder

Vitalize both increases mana signifiganty and untap Yisan, the Wanderer Bard I have used Vitalize with Eternal Witness, Temur Sabertooth, and Karametra's Acolyte for the game!

This deck does not run much interaction that is true, but most decks can not combo as consistently as Yisan. And alot of the time Torpor Orb, will screw me up. Also Krosan Grip isnt enough to beat most decks.

I realy apreciate the fact that you made an entire comment critisizing my deck, its realy heplful to know what people think. My games store is: Pats Games, Austin Texas, and my deck is extreemly competative there.

The ShaperSavant list uses stax effects like winter orb to stall the board and give you enough time to Yisan to victory.

It also runs a high density of artifact removal to power through any annoying permanents.

Perhaps good things to take away from his list.

Does anyone have an optimized Ruric Thar list? I have been trying to build it for days and it is driving me crazy. kthx