ThrunTheTroll628 in the case of Najeela, the point of going with hulk is firstly to put the deck firmly into fastcombo territory and secondly to get overlapping combo lines without making the commander as value engine and win option weaker. Just to give you an impression, I'm tracking win rates for all players and decks in our meta and my Najeela currently stands at a ridiculous 68%...one big reason for that is the unpredictability that the layered combos provide.

Winterblast, again, would love to see a decklist, you could definitely be right but what's the point of discussing it if we are not on the same page?

I'm particularly interested in what you meant by overlapping combo, as Najeela's combos have no overlapping pieces with any hulk pile I've ever heard of.

The list is still missing Kazarov, Sengir Pureblood , by the way.

ThrunTheTroll628 I think it has been posted multiple times here, by other people as well and it was already on the list before the restructuring. The combo overlap is well explained in the primer and I've been collecting data to back up the claim that it's an effective approach. The reason why it's effective obviously can't be expressed with numbers, but I strongly believe (as seen in gameplay and in discussions with my local meta and other people) that the mixture of board presence and being able to assemble a kill with the same cards from the hand, graveyard or out of the library makes it hard to predict while keeping a small number of combo-only cards. Even people who know the deck by heart have said they have difficulty in seeing from where the kill is coming and therefore can't judge where removal and counters are best used. On the other hand, the different ways to assemble the same kill make it hard to lock the deck down with stax pieces and that's probably what caused my current results.

Being fastcombo also means you don't have to waste resources on protecting your commander (which the combat only decks have to) along with preventing other people from winning because you are usually the fastest deck, or at least equally fast and casting the commander can be either a bluff or a kill setup and people never know what it is.

Najeela's Hulk Pod Project (cEDH Primer)

Commander / EDH Winterblast

SCORE: 160 | 131 COMMENTS | 28807 VIEWS | IN 71 FOLDERS

Im interested to see what decks come from the new commanders from the modern horizons list. Especially Sisay, Weatherlight Captain

New Sisay seems to be really slow and low impact. She's an outlet for having infinite mana of all colours, but I think casting her for value is so weak that it's probably not worth it.

Im not complaining or anything, im just curious what puts Selvala, Explorer Returned in the tier that she's in? I have a selvala deck EVERYBODY PARL(T)AY (which is open to comments/suggestions as i take it from stax to elfball combo) that seems to do quite well with some of the top tier commanders here, as my playgroup runs food chain with proshh, lockout Zur, and op kess.

Just curious though, is it the 2 colors making her slower? Or?

Where would you put the new urza

Where would you put the new urza

@Winterblast I agree she is on the slower side, compared to the ones on the max power list. I think she would be decent as a stax/combo commander though. Start her off as stax then when you get your combo started you can combo off by putting her out and starting a value chain. Just a thought. Someone better at deckbuilding than me might break her but at least as superfriends combo I've tested her out with a proxy and she did better than Atraxa of the same archetype.

@davidsays1 Selvala (while close to my own heart) is a great, strong deck that can win through some stax (though is shut out by the most prevalent in the format - Suppression Field , Cursed Totem , Null Rod ). Despite this the deck's really quite strong - I'm not sure the amount of play-testing that's been recorded by avid fans of the deck, but innately the card gives card advantage as it plays.

Having a combo piece in the command zone like Thrasios / Ishkana wins the game and can provide utility during the game without aiding your opponents. I believe the referenced Selvala list uses stax in order to make the additional card per turn seem a lot less relevant and allows you to use her as a grinding engine from the zone. Due to Selvala's aid to opposing decks I'd guess that's why she's not considered the most competitive, despite the power that she has.

If you'd like to change that then by all means go for it! Maybe your decklist performs better than the one posted. Some Reddit posts such as the Shimmer-zur 100 opening hands (I think that's the one) show the strength and consistency of the deck. You should be able to find some good ideas on ways you could 'prove' your build (and therefore Selvala's strength) worthy of a higher tier.

There's other ways to promote your deck also, but in the Elfball strat' I'd suggest trying Yisan, the Wanderer Bard as it not only balls more efficiently, it also uses a compact stax-package that helps you to close out games without the need to draw opponents additional cards (or if you're cool, try the listed Yeva, Nature's Herald - that deck is mono spice).

Hello!

Just a rookie commander player here! Out of curiosity, how did you come to the decision of having Arixmethes, Slumbering Isle as "High Power?" I mean as advantageous as it is, I see it as a Simic alternative to something like Goreclaw, Terror of Qal Sisma, which is in Mid Power.

Is having Arixmethes as a land and having access to blue that much more significant?

Is it really a good trade off having something that taps blue&green once per turn versus something that reduces mana cost for creatures all the time?

Commander_JAR This is a list comprised of "Competitive EDH" placements for generals, rather than your standard 'EDH'; for more information I believe that the cEDH reddit will be able to give you the brief guide on the difference between the two far better than I. https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveEDH/wiki/index#wiki_faq This has all of the information you'll need on the differences.

On the other hand, assuming that you know the difference and are still curious, the basic response to your argument is: having access to additional colours and a general who works well for storm (ie: untap creature/land spells) is strictly better than most mono-green generals (with a few notable exceptions). It's strictly better as it offers more relevant application, a better arsenal of stronger cards that can be used, and access to more relevant combos (ie: flash-hulk)

Oh RIGHT Storm! I forgot about that!Thanks, CyborgAeon!

Earlier I had suggested a deck-list for Prime Speaker Vannifar , but I didn't have a lot of data on how the deck performs. Also I saw that you don't have an accepted deck-list for it...
Here is the decklist:
Vannifar cEDH
Here is the data:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tpI4PWrcXqoSMy_l3oxXQCAr82eI4-1Y8X3pZJdpF9M/edit?usp=sharing

goconnor

You played 50 games and won 40? I mean I am absolutely not flagging this as BS, but that data is haaaaard to believe bro......

FYI in 1v1 (Duels) Van is banned rendering a lot of the data nullified regardless of it's awesome stats.

Furthermore, there is not 1 game where you have sat down with 3 opponents in a god tier FFA in that data set, so it is kind of meaningless here I'm sorry to say.

So, I gotta say thanks for this resource, the only way to really balance EDH is to squish the power level to max, otherwise it's a bit of a farce, STILL FUN, but fascicle non the less.

This list and linked primers has paved the way for countless hours of tight, nail-biting drama and my pod and I are extremely grateful.

We pretty much agree with the list except for one thing, Godo...... Sorry to bring it up again, I did read the comments above. Like, in a sea of decks built without budget restrictions (a lot of re sleeving happens) Godo fights, and wins regularly enough, not a notable win rate % either way, he just sits there and goes toe to toe with Najeela, yissan, kess, PST builds....... We goldfished the deck to get a feel for it and it does feel underwhelming, but in open play, it is surprising. We can't even put out finger on it, it just finds a way to win despite the odds. I recommend you sleeve it up dudes and give it a full test drive, it's brutal!!!! Don't mean to open another debate, and TBH I respect everyone's opinion greatly, but yah, godo works against meta decks well :)

I’ve seen queen combo off very quickly sometimes, admittedly yes 5c cmc can be challenging at times but you can run plenty of options and fixing, I saw a list before but unfortunately I can’t find it as I don’t remember who posted it but it’s certainly tier 2 potential

goconnor

Not saying I'm an expert on this commander but... For all the data i'm seeing is that most games are 1 vs 1?

We have 2 players in our LGS that almost run the same list as you but they get killed really easy in a Multiplayer setting. I'm talking shimmer zur,Gitrogh monster,CVT,Najeela Tempo kind of decks, most are Full blown non budget decks.

Not here to diss or disrespect you just seems far fetched.

I want to believe you won 30 games of the 40 but i just can't. Seeing that these decks in my LGS run so bad in multiplayer. Bad Pilots who knows got some video's or something ?

@Fuzzbox, goconnor, Alexrb19

CyborgAeon

Thanks for the reply man! That makes a lot of sense and I agree with almost everything you said. Godo is nice because casual players can pick the deck up and compete immediately. Not sure of another deck that can boast this. However the fact that it’s easy to play shouldn’t be factored in. Snobbish players see that as a reason to dislike it.

When I watch a godo win, it’s either break neck nut draw, or, sneaks up as the decks packing interactive heat cancel each other out. the deck needs a sniff of an opening and it’s GG. I understand it doesn’t pack the raw power of other decks in the meta, but in that vacuum for weird reasons it holds its own. It benefits from being less powerful!?!?!? The other decks in the meta just aren’t good at being constantly primed to stop a 0 card combat combo that can punch through blockers.

Having said all that, you’ve made me feel at peace that he’s sitting where he belongs in the competitive tier hahaha.

Are you sure Jazal Goldmane belongs in "Mid Power" when Ezuri, Renegade Leader is in "High Power"?

They are extremely similar, you could even argue Jazal is stronger due to the lack of a tribal restriction and more power for the same mana cost. (downside being not granting trample, but white has plenty of flyers anyway).

Sephyrias

Let’s not forget regenerate...... Built protection from wipes propped up by green’s big mana virtues. Built in protection from the biggest problem the deck faces is HUGE. On that note, Ezuri doesn’t need a wide board to be relevant. Another thing to add to @n0bunga’s comment is that green has so many creature tutors and ability to draw cards. Jazal is a total dude though, can’t bring to take him out of my cats duels deck, gonna have to now they printing some more changelings.

So, with the release of Modern Horizons I do believe Teferi has to move down to just "Competitive". Urza Clearly has taken the Tier 1 Mono Blue slot.

IE: Urza Feeling Lucky - cEDH Primer #1 Mono Blue

For the Decklist Database in this Tier List's description, can someone explain to me the difference between the Primary Database and the Fringe Database?