@Anjuna: But with your reason for consultation, all 5-color commanders should have a high power level because all cards and combos can be played. And yes, grixis is very strong, but compared to an eminence ability that triggers from the commandzone at no additional cost, Mishra as a card alone is not an absolute star. To appease the whole Mishra fanboys here, I admit that he may not be tier 7. But only because he's in grixis colors and costs only 4 mana.

Nevertheless, the other commanders are worth comparing and if someone wants to prove the opposite to me, they are welcome to play some games with the respective commanders in Xmage against me.

To the editors, thanks for editing the list. But it would be interesting for me, why you don't atleast add Edgar (+ Wintota/Zaxara) to the high power tier. Although they correspond 100% to your "high power" definition (they're played in a lot of cedh-groups and some are mentioned on the cedh database, too).

smilodex I completely agree that the placement at the lower tiers is a bit wonky. And by my reasoning should a card like O-Kagachi, Vengeful Kami by much higher.

The rankings for non-competitive commanders is tricky since there isn't an objective ranking for them (while competitive commanders can use competition outcomes).

The solution would be a massive commander tournament where every commander is pitted against every other one... We can only hope

One that isn't top tier, but is probably too low is Zacama. If the deck is build to essentially operate with Zacama as a lesser Palinchron it can do some real damage if the game gets to turn 5 or so. It's extremely easy to go infinite and its also easy to run Heliod / WB as a backup since you're running WB already. I've seen it win in a Najeela / Yuriko / Animar pod a couple of times and the other decks are tuned to at least 90% of cEDH potential. The combo in the command zone isn't as good as Najeela but it's as powerful as Prossh in worse colors.

your first statement is nonsense if you've read the description. the first 4-5 tiers contain cedh decks. From a certain point on it is no longer possible to talk about cedh.

Of course, not every commander can be replaced by another of the same color, which I did not say. there are still exceptions. e.g. you can take a Kenrith list, instead play Cromat or Child of Alara as a captain and sit at a cedh table and win. Of course, this makes the deck weaker, but you could still go over and start arguing if chronmat should have a higher rating (which is not my intention here).

Why doy you think they're puzzling? they can't be that puzzling, because the editors have implemented some of my suggestions and you also agree with some points. So I don't understand your problem, according to your justification, Edgar and Zaxara should at least be set to "high power" or "fringe competetive" because they are listed on the cedh database (which I also suggested)

1. we are talking about the mid and high power level category and not necessarily cedh. Apparently you have never played braids and not too much idea how to use them, because all of your arguments can easily be invalidated with the right deck construction. Braids will of course be flashed in (emergence zone, leyline etc.) and of course you will ensure that your opponents do not have enough removal and maps such as (Kederekt Leviathan, Scourge of Fleets, Cyclonic Rift, Wash Out, Paradox Haze, Maze of Ith etc.) Benefit more from braids than yourself. In addition, your deck is designed for braids and your opponents' decks are not.
2. I see the same thing, you have feather as the only boros commander in fringe competetive (which I think it belongs to very close)
3. True, I overlooked the fact that he can sacrifice himself.
4. I do not vote here, I am sharing my experience here, which is mostly based on the performance of my decks, which I have tested sufficiently, including on playedh.

I own many of the decks myself or have played against them several times, which is why I, as an old magic hare, can definitely form my opinion. I also find it interesting how some people feel directly attacked here instead of having a healthy discussion.

From my experience I'd argue that Emry is tier 1.5

n0bunga Edgar has a combo with Oathsworn Vampire and Phyrexian Altar and his eminence ability. I don’t know if I’d say he belongs higher, but saying he isn’t part of a combo is factually incorrect.

In the past I have seen some Edgar Markov lists which are designed to cheat out Razaketh, the Foulblooded and then leverage Edgar's eminence ability with a bunch of 1 drop vampires to create a tutor chain and allow you to deploy your combo. So while Edgar isn't a combo in the command zone like first sliver is, he acts as a combo assister which you don't technically need, but who helps streamline the deck lines. In addtion, you can use Oathsworn Vampire as both a tutor chain and actual combo outlet with Razaketh.

I can't talk to how good the combo packages actually were, only that I had seen them employed like this in a similar way that you would see Razaketh lines in a W/G/B deck. They were interesting builds for sure. Just comes down to whetehr they were actually playable or not, which I'm unable to comment on.

Why is Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder tier 1.5 while Maelstrom Wanderer tier 2.5? Does the cmc difference and inclusion of black really offset the vulnerability to being countered? Maelstrom Wanderer can always cascade even if countered. I believe it is very difficult to keep Yidris on the board AND attack a player compared to MW. Help me understand please :)

I think that Yidris is higher because of how it can properly storm off when used and is usually built around so people can try to interact with it as best as possible, the same could be said for Kykar because of it needing to be on board and to perform an action in some way in order to start, but as you have likely seen, it can be very consistent. Also, the cascade effect is usable for the rest of the turn and storming off into things that eventually will be useful and with the ability to use underworld breach, it is much easier, mana intensive, when every card you could hit is a hit and often can grab more than one card. While I agree that if games are very denial heavy, the Maelstrom Wanderer is VERY powerful but, this format requires more time. Again this is my opinion from the two people I had before covid in my competitive pod that each had a deck designed around Yidris. Peace!

Beatismcscoots: The reason that Yisdris is stronger that Wanderer is for a few reasons: 1) Yidris costs half as much mana, 2) Yidris has access to black (including top of deck tutors in the form of Vampiric Tutor and Imperial Seal which are great for setting up cascade), 3) While wanderer gives you two additional spells, Yidris can generate a lot more than that in a turn since he gives all spells from your hand cascade. So you can potentially generate a lot more value that just two spells. Not to mention that Yidris can give you spells cascade multiple turns over since in most cEDH metas Yidris is one of the stronger beaters on the batlefield.

If you have a look at a few cEDH Yidris lists, most of them will also have a very cheap curve and so they can just chain spell after spell after spell.

Edgar, while not cedh, is still very powerful. At my LGS: Where all decks are about power level 7 or 8, edgar, dominates the table of equal power decks. And Mishra in comander seems janky. You cant really tutor for anything.

Rith, the Awakener should be higher on the list then Tana, the Bloodsower. He can summon way more tokens then she can. He can easily get out of control with saprolings.

ABaggins: Mishra works by breaking parity with e.g. Nether Void (you let the spell countering resolve first, then you "search" your graveyard for the same card that you just cast). Don't ask me if that's good enough for high tier tho ¯I_(ツ)_I¯

ProBertels: all partner commanders are rated as if they were optimally partnered, and Tymna tips things in Tana's favor trough an extra color and providing a draw engine (plus, they're both quite a bit cheaper)

ProBertels: The issue with Rith, the Awakener is that not only does she cost 6 mana to play but that you have to sink mana into her ability each turn in addition to that. And then on top of that, worst case scenario you only make 1 token. So while she can generate a large boardstate, there is the potential to be quite slow in doing it.

Tana, the Bloodsower comes down two turns earlier, which in competitive games is a huge difference. And the fact that she couples with Tymna the Weaver makes her very strong. On top of that, the typical build for her is a stax deck which uses the tokens to keep above parity to sacrifice effects, so the main goal is not necessarily to just flood the board with tokens anyway. And in this case, the fact that she costs 2 less is much more important than the fact that you can make a bajillion tokens in an optimal scenario.

question... as far as Food Chain decks go, is The First Sliver way more powerful than Cazur, Ruthless Stalker  ^Flip? Or are they pretty parallel because the mana base is a little easier with the Cazur, Ruthless Stalker  ^Flip style deck. trying to decide which one to focus on. I have FC Prossh. I did FC Niv. Now trying to decide which version of FC is best.

DasTree Fcfs is definitely more powerful. Having all 5 colors just makes it the most versatile foodchain deck we have. Ukkima is definitely good but it's a glass cannon type build. so if someone stops you the deck has a harder time making a comeback

Coward_Token thanks for the explanation. Makes him seem a little better but not sure if higher than Eddie. Eddie is great because if you don't cast him in the game, he still rewards you with tokens. Aside from the WBR color combination, he is a solid commander, and vampires are a very developed tribe.

The main thing I've learned from these comments is if you think a commander is more competitive than what is listed, build a list, then play your list against other cedh decks.

what this list actually need is a serious update, there are commanders missing on it that have been out for months, like Neyith of the Dire Hunt. I do feel sorry for ShaperSavant when the new commander legends draft set comes out and they release 70+ new partner commander + all the other ones. but yeah this list needs an update.

Literal_Cancer DINGDINGDINGDINGDINGDINGDINGDING

Is Tabernacle and Timetwister really necessary for the cEDH Urza list? I want my deck to be equal in power to the 1.5 list so I have a snow island and time reversal in the respective spots for now until I’m lucky enough to possibly get one if it’s really needed.

MagickedOne: It depends on your meta for both cards.

Twister acts as both a wheel but also forms a recursion engine with Narset's Reversal so that you can do things like build a bird army with Swan Song. You can potentially swap it out with another card that allows for an engine, however the deck will technically suffer for it.

Tabernacle is just a strong stax card, especially against things like Najeela or Blood Pod who want ot build a board state. At the end of the day, having it is better than not having it however if you're coming from a really instant/sorcery heavy meta with commanders like Zur and Kess then not having is not such a big deal.

Is Xyris, the Writhing Storm or Nekusar, the Mindrazor stronger?

I got a Emiel the blessed deck going and it seems like it has a high potential for being competitive. What do you guys think?

Beatismcscoots honestly, neither will ever be competitive, but having access to black is really strong. However, Xyris can go off more easily without a wheel, so... I don't really know. Play some high power (but not cEDH) games with both and come to your own conclusions.