What's this? An optimized 5C Scion list at long last? (http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/scion-druid-win/)[http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/scion-druid-win/]

Sorry, that link failed horribly. Link

Are you guys only ever going to have tier one and two lists?

Probably. The majority of Tier 3 commanders get a lot less attention, particularly by competitive players who would potentially be building optimized decklists. The amount of work required to create a decent compendium of Tier 3 decks simply isn't worth the payoff.

why's Odric, Master Tactician only tier 4?

If you're looking for lists for any commander, use edhrec.com to at least get a place to start.

Trtl: He's a mono-white commander who has no good abilities outside of combat. Combat-based generals are usually bad, and add that to the worst color identity in the game, makes him a pretty bad commander.

MagicalHacker: EDHrec isn't great for finding lists. For example, if I look up Brago, I'll find nice stuff like Reflector Mage and Strionic Resonator, but then I'll also find stuff like Venser, Simulacrum, Whirler Rogue, and Geist-Honored Monk. It would be better to look at a list, which at least is somewhat refined and has competitive cards.

I thought we were talking about getting lists not on the sample decklist part of the description...

Edhrec is a good place to start, but it's not the end-all be-all of lists, at least not competetive ones. But If you want to find commonly played cards, it's a good place to look. A bit of research, common knowledge, and conversation will tell you that certain inclusions should Be actually exclusions.

Decklists updated!!!

I am sorry but earlier in the comments some one said blue is the best mono color. How is it not black?

Countermagic.

Black also lacks good answers to enchantments and artifacts.

Blue does a better version of almost anything black does.

What's difference between tier 4 "have trouble winning in competitive metas" and tier 5 "can't win often in competitive metas"?

Tier 4 might squeeze out a win once in a while, it's possible. Tier 5 decks I've never ever seen win a single game of competitive EDH, except as color identity placeholders. thegigibeast can you update the descriptions to say that? Sorry for not making that clear.

Shouldn't Reya Dawnbringer be tier 5 then? 9 mana commander which doesn't do anything until your next upkeep and not guaranteed to do anything even then and it has only access to white. I just can't see how it could win in any competitive game. I've only casual EDH though (and sometimes Edric, Spymaster of Trest, before mulligan change) so it might be I just don't understand how competitive EDH works.

Updating tomorrow if I don't forget :p (on my phone right now...)

Im not sure if anyone has made a case for this yet but i feel like Nekusar is good enough to be tier 2 if played the right way. Most Nek decks i see are full of howling mines and janky control spells but there is a variant referred to as "chaos ramp combo" that is really powerful. I've seen that deck destroy tier one decks. I know a few newer lists are out there that are omitting $75+ cards but the best i've seen is a little older. http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/511377-nekusar-mindwheeling-pain

With a few updates (the deck is from 2013) and simple modifications, this archetype is easily tier 2. It is brutally consistent and wins on turn 2-6 if played well and with the optimal list.

I just put together this list as an example of a more up to date and optimized version of the list mentioned in my last comment.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/wrath-of-the-lich-king-3/

r/cEDH built Jhoira of the Ghitu for their weekly Brewsday Tuesday. It's a consideration since we don't currently have a Jhoira list. Link

Interesting list. Fun to think of commanders like this. Also a great way to start a lot of arguments. The ones I take most issue with are:

Tier 5

diaochan - t: destroy 2 target creatures has to at least be good enough to get you to tier 4. I mean, I know not all tables politic too much, but come on.ghost council of orzhova - a nigh-invincible sac outlet can be handy. At least better than tier 5.ob nixilis, the fallen - a likely 9/9 for 5 with a little life-drain isn't super exciting, but definitely not tier 5 material.Phelddagrif - I don't think I can forgive this placement, unless you have a no-talking rule or something. The ability to offer tokens, cards, life, etc to coerce the table into doing what you want makes phelddagrif unique and awesome. Hard to use, granted, but definitely not tier 5.*stitcher geralf - never used him, but I just have a hard time seeing that ability be THAT weak, even if he is a bit slow. I mean, phage the untouchable is in tier 4, and she makes you LOSE THE GAME WHEN YOU PLAY HER.

Tier 4

Alhammaret, high arbiter - this is tier 5 garbage.dralnu, lich lord - this might be the biggest mistake on the list. If you untap with dralnu with a competitive list, you should win the game, period. Every tutor becomes a nearly unlimited supply of extra turns, and black has an absurd number of tutors, plus a few from blue. Dralnu is a must-kill threat, putting him in tier 4 is ridiculous, he's at least tier 2. And don't say it's because he has a tap ability, there are loads of tap ability creatures in tier 1-2, and most of those don't win the game on the spot.ib halfheart - is there some combo I'm not aware of? He seems like hot trash.iname, death aspect - pretty sure this deck is built to just win the game the turn after iname with some mass-reanimation spell. I think it was, at one point, one of the most powerful decklists out there in the competitive scene. I haven't played it, but you might want to look into it a little deeper.kagemero, first to suffer - board wipe every turn? Seems better than Tier 4 to me.kataki, war's wage - no one has ever played this as a commander. Tier 5.Lazav, Dimir mastermind - just because idiots play this card as a mill deck doesn't mean having a hexproof version of your opponent's best creatures (Which you killed) is bad. He's a really strong commander for control in my experience.Nahiri, the lithomancer - I've wrecked tables with nahiri easily, because she gets huge benefits from white's biggest strengths - boardwipes, landwipes, and most of all, humility. I've never seen a card neuter a table as effective as humility in Nahiri. Sure, she's mono-white, but if other commanders can be mono-white and still in the upper tiers, she damn sure ought to be.phage the untouchable - ok, fine, command beacon is a thing, but seriously, this is the definition of tier 5. maybe tier 6.ryusei - how is mono-red supposed to use a death trigger? Tier 5.sygg, river cutthroat - potentially multiple cards per turn on a 2 mana commander in one of the best color combos? Does not seem like tier 4.uyo, silent prophet - this is another pretty big mistake imo. Uyo is nuts. You play her with a bunch of mana ramp, then dump her out on 10 mana. If a board wipe happens, np, replay her. If someone wants to spot remove her, you can copy it twice and throw them in his face. If no one kills her, you drop time warp or some ludicrous bomb sorcery like blatant thievery with a ton of mana up, then copy the crap out of it. It's powerful and annoyingly hard to disrupt without screwing yourself over too, since she can copy enemy spells.Varolz - someone else said it, I'll reiterate it. There is a lot of infect in the game. There are a lot of tutors in BG. It is very easy to kill someone turn 4 with varolz. Turn 3 is definitely possible. Saying "you'll get combo killed by someone else on turn 5" is a stupid argument - we're talking about tier 4 commanders here, not comparing it to top-tier combo decks. Varolz is a very fast way to kill people compared to almost any other combat-focused commander.*zhuge jin, wu strategist - who? tier 5.

tier 3

crosis the purger - was a cool card when invasion came out. He is now a piece of crap. Tier 5 imo, tier 4 at best.dromar the banisher - see crosis, although he's arguably a little better. But he usually bounces himself, which is dumb.why is ezuri in the same tier as eladamri? Has anyone ever made an eladamri deck since ezuri was printed? I get that sometimes tiers are kind of broad, but if those 2 are in the same tier, it's probably too broad.freyalise, llanowar's fury - there's no way freyalise is in a higher tier than nahiri. Know who's great at protecting planeswalkers? White. Know who sucks at it? Green.mishra, artificer prodigy - there's all of, like, 3 cards that make mishra more than a vanilla 4/4. It's cute that people have figured out ways to make him actually do something, but that does not make him tier 3.nicol bolas - does someone just really like grixis dragons? Bolas is garbage tier by today's standards, although he's still better than crosis. If I wanted an 8-mana hand discard spell that everyone could see coming a mile away, though, I'd just tutor for my myojin of night's reach, rather than fumble around with my lightning greaves and pray to god that no one kept up an stp or something.ojutai, soul of winter - does not deserve the same tier as his sleeker, later counterpart. There are no good dragons in WU anyway. Tier 4-5.sen triplets - this card sucks. Everyone will target you. You're playing control colors with a commander who only works when you cast stuff at sorcery speed - stuff that won't synergize with your deck. Looks cool, is awful.seton - no one actually plays druids, even with that OP land-stealing lord.sigarda, heron's grace - a 4/5 flyer with no interesting abilities for 5? Sign me up! for tier 4-5.surrak dragonclaw - a garbage vanilla legend. Tier 5.venser, shaper savant - he's a powerful card with certain combinations, but I cannot imagine how he'd be any good in the command zone.volrath the fallen - lol, so a 1-shot commander on turn 3-4 (varolz) is tier 4, but a 1-shot commander on turn 5-6 (assuming you have what, draco?) is somehow tier 3? wot.yosei, the morning star - I'm mostly curious about this one. Are there really reliable enough reanimation in white to justify this guy as a legend? Black has oodles of tutors and reliable reanimation like volrath's stronghold and corpse dance to guarantee their commander doesn't get stuck after a death trigger, but can white really boast the same? I feel like one countered reanimation spell and you're out a commander for the foreseeable future.

Tier 2

sidisi, brood tyrant - as someone who made some of the first sidisi decklists, I can't say I ever thought she was particularly good. I highly doubt tier 2.teneb the harvester - this card is slow and boring. Tier 3 at best.*shattergang brothers - this card is too expensive and slow. also, why is savra a tier lower? her ability costs no mana and lets you get extra value out of sacrificing to something else. Granted, that means you need other sac outlets, but that's not exactly hard in BG.

Tier 1

edric, spymaster of trest - maybe it's just my experience, but edric sucked for me. I always ended up fending off board wipes or having my commander removed before combat damage, and ended up with hands flooded with lands and difficulty keeping creatures on board. Not to mention, enemies can take advantage of him too and wreck you. Your lack of a competitive decklist makes me suspect he's not actually tier 1.Calling karador and scion of the ur-dragon "tier 1 lists" is, imo, ridiculous. The combos they accompany have little to nothing to do with them. If you're going to include the most powerful version of a given commander - ignoring how most people would build it to be synergistic with the commander, i.e. mass dragon reanimation or dredge for scion and karador, respectively - then you may as well put atogatog in tier 1-2, since you can build a very-nearly-as-strong HD combo deck with atogatog. Frankly, almost any commander can be extremely powerful if you just ignore them and build whatever the fastest combo deck in your colors is, but that's a very boring list. If you think it's necessary to include decks like HD, doomsday, adnaus, or whatever the latest degenerate flavor of the week is, then I'd include those as their own decklists rather than tie them to a commander that doesn't do anything particularly powerful other than be the best option in the required color scheme.

I would like to comment on Scion, because is HD list is better than with creatures like Atogatog in IMO, because he has access to backup combos while others don't.

Any 7/7 Sliver has also access to backup combos.

I think Scion can tutor them much more easily... I mean, Sliver Legion can't combo as easily as the others, Sliver Overlord could tutor, Sliver Queen could easily combo, but I just think Scion can combo easier... But I never actually played an HD deck, maybe I am wrong.