I didn't, I'm just saying it's possible. I just find the whole process of comboing off, which takes a good 15-20 minutes, tedious.

kyuuri117, You're probably ordering the abilities inefficiently. I worked out the math way back when, and if you use all of the extra chain veil stacks to +1 Teferi when you recast him and then start -1 looping him on your last activation, it nets you the most mana, and it's actually impossible to fizzle assuming no one disrupts you. You'll be allowed to shortcut your actions since the exact number of activations per recast is known ahead of time (there's a formula).

It's not like four horseman where you might whiff and not hit a Narcomoeba before hitting Emrakul, each loop is a predictable quantity.

this list is pretty dang good however putting dralnu as a tire 4 is sacrilege he may seem bad but ask anyone thats seen him in action and they would disagree.

This certainly isn't the first time Dralnu has been brought up. Maybe it is finally time to move him up to Tier 3.

Optimal Dralnu is definitely tier three to me.

thank you i agree with that as well

I concur

because blasphemous act (only time plays in the background) in all fairness if u don't own/ have seen him played he seems rly bad XD

I may have found an Azami list. It has some head scratchers but on the cEDH subreddit he explains reasonings for some of them. Either way it's the closest I've seen to tuned.

Azami, Lady of Scrolls: Combo

I have been playing Edric, Spymaster of Trest for roughly 5 years and have a fairly fine tuned list. I can upload it to Tappedout and create a description later today if an Edric list is still something people are looking for. I would love to have the feedback/help of this community in refining it even further and I believe that together we can create a truly phenomenal deck.

@Ohthenoises: I might be able to do one better. I started working on Azami after it became clear that an optimized deck for her would not materialize. Here is what it looks like thus far.

MoxProxy: I would be interested in seeing your list

@ NarejED

The sheer arrogance of that statement is beyond me

gl hf with those "optimized" lists of yours then

Winther To be fair you said yours was in progress.......

That's like me getting mad that someone thinks my sidisi deck is a poor representation of competitive when it's intentionally built to be less competitive.

@Winther: ?

Okay then.... Thanks I guess?

I made the promised Edric, Spymaster of Trest list: Someone So Small.

Feedback? Lets pimp this thing out so that we have a list for every T1 general. Any help is appreciated.

I started working on Iname, Death Aspect recently because I had an idea, I know it might be better in 1vs1 but... Maybe he deserves a better place than tier 4? I think there are good enough spirits (Kuro, Pitlord, Horobi, Death's Wail and Kokusho, the Evening Star amongst others). It is far from the best black deck, but I think this is stronger than tier 4 when comparing with other mono-black commanders ranked tier 3.

He is a better Entomb for spirits, and with all the mass reanimation and tutoring available to black, it should not be that difficult to achieve the "combo".

For sure, graveyard hate is a thing, but I think this deck fits well with tier 3 description. Just my opinion though, would like to get some feedback on this before I start thinkering about some more competitive plans with him at the helm.

@thegigibeast usually I'm all for fun obscure-ish commanders, but no. he's not very good at all. spirits really limits his options and only 1 of the guys you mentioned is TRULY good. He fails the vanilla test, doesn't even have a keyword, and the number of other reanimator commanders is boundless. He should stay where he is, with the fun theme commanders that will never make it.

and what exactly makes him a better entomb for spirits? he costs more. 5 more. sorcery speed. I mean, I guess you can blink him but that's about all he has going for him.

ajacobik - while that may be true (and I'm not convinced it is), there is little to no reason to cut the third colour in doomsday. Jeleva, Zur, and Tasigur are all better options.

@DERPLINGSUPREME

I mean... I thaught he was a better Entomb for spirits because he is accessible from the command zone and he can put more than 1 spirit in the graveyard at once... Yes it is sorcery speed, but still...

My main idea was to put lots of spirits in the graveyard, then mass reanimate them. To generate fast mana, we have access to Crypt of Agadeem, Songs of the Damned to benefit from having many creatures in the graveyard. Then when we have Kuro, Pitlord and Horobi, Death's Wail in play at the same time, we can get rid of any creature at the cost of one life point, and we can ping our own Kokusho, the Evening Star to gain a bunch of life (15 in a 4-players pod) and continue reanimating him.

We can also access Yawgmoth's Will to cast back some creatures of the graveyard or simply cast back rituals and Songs of the Damned for even more mana...

For starters, Yawgmoth's Will won't help recast creatures from your graveyard if you require a loop to happen because after they are sacrificed again they will be exiled.

The combo condition you described there also has a problem related to this - it doesn't loop. Usually if you want to kill a table instead of just one person (which is the purpose of multiplayer commander), your win condition needs to be some sort of recursive loop. The only recursive loop like this in question is Chainer, Dementia Master+Soldevi Adnate+6 or higher CMC creature+Sac outlet+Haste. Already this is pretty unlikely, but assuming that you can get out all SIX pieces, you can generate infinite black mana and recur creatures from your graveyard indefinitely. Specifically this can be used to recur Kokusho, the Evening Star and/or Gray Merchant of Asphodel. However, if you have all these pieces together already, why would you need stuff like Kuro, Pitlord, or Horobi, Death's Wail? So the combo you've described doesn't loop and is inferior to an already existing, hard to assemble version that does loop.

There's also not much else you can do with Iname besides the combos you mentioned that it does better than any of the other tier 3 mono-black commanders. Crypt of Agadeem+Deserted Temple for a big Exsanguinate or Songs of the Damned+Yawgmoth's Will for TWO big Exsanguinates seem tempting, but Chainer, Geth, Xiahou-Dun, and especially Mike all have access to better, more resilient combos.

And obviously it kind of goes without saying that this strategy is vulnerable to graveyard hate. For other graveyard based decks like Meren and Karador this isn't much of an issue since they have access to so much removal to get rid of that hate, but since mono-black doesn't interact with enchantments well, there's not much that Iname can do about Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void.

In short, Iname isn't a garbage-tier commander, but it doesn't lend itself well to any combos or other advantages that are important in a multiplayer game. Having a six-mana Buried Alive in the command zone just isn't good enough compared to other options for mono-black commanders.

All that said, I am a little tempted to build Iname Ad Nauseam now. It'll be strictly worst than Sidisi, but it still seems like a cute deck.

While Iname has issues preventing it from being tier two, I think it has plenty of advantages making it better than tier four.