LeeRoy_Jenkiins, not having enough ways to pay life has been a problem that I run into occasionally. Best way to get those dethrone triggers is Treasonous Ogre, so if there are more cards like that, I'd be all over them. As for Toxic Deluge, I'm just not sure what to cut to make room for it. I've been tempted to add a boardwipe or two in there since I've added Thrilling Encore.

Thanks for the suggestions!

Sadly, I don't think there are any other similar cards. :( Unless you want to pay 1 B to filter Mana.

I have a budget version of the deck that is full of creatures that enter with counters or easily obtain counters, sac outlets and paying life. Most of these abilities do not cost any Mana and allow me to respond whenever I want.

One weird card that has preformed quite well is Souldrinker. It provides itself with protection while paying life. Spawning Pit is an underated sac out let that can create you tokens.

Also I think board wipes are quite good in these decks because Marchesa's ability easily allows you to kill all of your opponents creatures while you lose next to nothing.

LeeRoy_Jenkiins, your mention of Souldrinker reminded me that I do have Unspeakable Symbol in the deck, which has been an absolute all-star. I like Souldrinker, but I don't like that he only puts the counter on himself. I'll consider finding a spot in the deck for him if I make some cuts.

I like Spawning Pit, but I'm on the fence. I'd never use the creature generation ability, meaning it'd only be a 2-mana sac outlet. While that in and of itself might not be too bad, I'm not sure if I want a card that I'd only use half of in the deck, especially when there are so many 2-mana or less sac outlets out there (Goblin Bombardment, Viscera Seer, Carrion Feeder, Skullclamp, Greater Gargadon, Bloodthrone Vampire, Dark Privilege, Dross Hopper, etc).

I think you've got a good point about boardwipes too. I should find some more to put in the deck. Been thinking about Damnation and, as you'd suggested previously, Toxic Deluge.

Thanks for the suggestions!

You could switch Spawning Pit for Altar of Dementia. Pit has the same CMC, sacs a creature for free and in my opinion pit has a better ability than than altar.

I think that you don't actually gain anything from altar milling an opponent. You don't run any reanimation from the graveyard or anything else to benefit from it.

If you keep altar I would recommend Sepulchral Primordial. This card can be repeated value using marchesa's ability and primordial has some evasion stapled on it.

Hi, awesome deck! i cant quite figure out why you included conjurer's closet in this list...why is that?

LeeRoy_Jenkiins, I particularly like Altar of Dementia because it thins out my opponents' decks while also potentially depriving them of valuable cards. I don't think I'd ever use Spawning Pit's second ability to make creatures. Having to pay one mana, as well as having to remove two charge counters seems like it might be a little more difficult to get up and running than simply sacrificing a creature to mill an opponent a few cards.

I've been waffling over Sepulchral Primordial for a while now. I'm not too crazy about the mana cost, but I certainly do like that he hits each opponent's yard. I think you make a good point about including him if I keep Altar of Dementia in the deck.

Thanks for the suggestions!

Dizzy10, thanks for the compliment!

I've got Conjurer's Closet in there in case I don't have a sac outlet on the field. If I Act of Treason an opponent's creature, I don't have to worry about Marchesa, the Black Rose's Dethrone ability triggering and then sacrificing the creature in order to keep it, I only have to flicker it with the Conjurer's Closet.

Please do let me know if you have any other questions about my card choices or their interactions.

Thanks!

Puppeteer Clique is a cheaper and slightly less effective primordial.

It also has natural eveasion and you can combat the -1/-1 counters with dethrone along with other means.

LeeRoy_Jenkiins, ha! It's funny, Puppeteer Clique was one of the cards that I originally cut from the Inalla, Archmage Ritualist that turned into this current deck. I think, if I'm going to put one of the two in there, it'll most likely be Sepulchral Primordial, since he spreads the love, even if he is slightly more expensive than the Puppeteer Clique.

Thanks for the suggestion!

Awesome deck! I have a very similar one myself. I love her second ability. One thing I would suggest is to add all of the Graft cards. They synergize extremely well! Marchesa enters, instantly graft to her, then sac your grafter to get its counters back. If they wipe your board, the grafter sees everything enter with it, so you can instantly graft up Marchesa and the rest of your team. Best of all, if a creature is a 0/0, it instantly dies. However, the last known state is used for all effects. In this case, the last known state was a 1/1, aka, having the counter. I'm told that you can just graft away the last counter and it will still come back with Marchesa. Good luck!

Two more suggestions ;)

Coffin Queen

Hell's Caretaker

mtgftw2014, thanks for the compliment and suggestions! Marchesa, the Black Rose is probably one of my favorite Grixis commanders. Her ability is super unique, and her colors make her a perfect commander for innumerable underhanded tactics.

While I do think that Graft is a neat mechanic, there aren't many cards to choose from that would really benefit the deck. There are four that I can think of that are blue, and they'd either let me untap a creature (Vigean Graftmage), draw a card (Novijen Sages), give someone flying (Helium Squirter), or steal a creature (Cytoplast Manipulator). To be honest, I've been on the fence about Cytoplast Manipulator for some time now. Seems to me like that is the only Graft card that would benefit the deck, as well as fit the theme. I think I may have to find a slot for that one. I can see how Graft could be conditionally useful in some specific boardwipe situations, but I don't see myself running into those situations often. Getting the +1/+1 counters back on my dudes post-resurrection isn't too much of an issue, especially if I have something to ensure the Dethrone trigger like Unspeakable Symbol, Treasonous Ogre, Phyrexian Reclamation, or Greed.

I'm also afraid that Graft doesn't work quite as you'd hoped though. Marchesa, the Black Rose's ability looks for the +1/+1 counter on the creature as it dies. If we remove that last counter, the creature will become a 0/0 and it'll die without returning.

As for Coffin Queen/Hell's Caretaker, I think I'll have to find a place for Coffin Queen in the deck. I prefer the Coffin Queen since she doesn't discriminate between my graveyard and my opponents'. Hell's Caretaker is a little too restrictive with the requirements as well. I'd need only to either flicker or resurrect (via Marchesa, the Black Rose's ability) the stolen creature in order to keep it and use the Coffin Queen's ability again. I like that.

Thanks again for the suggestions! Looks like I have some updates to make!

Love the deck! I'm in the process of making my own version now, and I'm curious how well your manabase works. How do you consistently have enough mana for a 3.7 avg CMC deck with 33 lands and 4 ramp spells?

Also, if you have any advice on cuts or additions for my current decklist, I'd appreciate the help!

allanwlevy, thanks for the compliment! As for the mana, I'm not sure if I've just been getting super lucky in most of my games or what, but mana is only very rarely an issue. I usually try to mulligan until I have at least one or two steal spells and three lands--seems to work out most of the time. In the rare occasion where I don't have enough mana to make my plays, I switch to a defensive strategy and try to employ politics and bluffs, which, of course, end up having mixed results that largely depend on the playgroup.

Cutting a few cards for more lands would probably make the deck a little less risky, but I just love all of the non-land cards too much. I've been fortunate enough to be able to test out most of the tricks in the deck, and I've been unable to pick one out that doesn't perform as expected. Makes cutting cards for more mana kinda tricky.

Thanks for giving me something to think about for the deck! I'll be sure to check yours out as well!

Nice! I've got a Maestro Fresh Kresh that steals and sacs people creatures (to beef attack, then beef Kresh), and a Lazav, Dimir Mastermind for stealing them permanently. I have a Marchesa, the Black Rose card, but if I went the same route, I don't think my playgroup would include me anymore... So, I'm just making her into a Janky madness deck.

The main card I see missing here is Grave Betrayal. Ultimate synergy with Marchesa, the Black Rose!

Reef Worm in here is fantastic! I just realized you don't even have to hit the player with most life, just attack... ohhhh sac fodder!

goldlion, thanks for the compliment! Kresh the Bloodbraided has been on my to-do list for a long time now, he always seemed like he'd be fun to pilot. Let me know how your Marchesa, the Black Rose deck turns out, I'm always interested in seeing other folks' builds.

I've been on the fence about Grave Betrayal for a while now. The effect is absolutely stellar, and it certainly would fit the theme of the deck. But the steep cost of 7 CMC has me wondering if it would be worth the mana. The only cards in the deck that are above 6 CMC are Razaketh, the Foulblooded, Expropriate, and Insurrection. I'm not even too sure about Razaketh, the Foulblooded's inclusion, since it still takes me another turn to play the Expropriate or Insurrection that I'd find from his ability. If I end up cutting Razaketh, the Foulblooded, I'll most likely put Grave Betrayal in there, since it is such a rockin' card. I just like Razaketh, the Foulblooded because he's a sac outlet and a life drain, so I can use him to ensure Marchesa, the Black Rose's Dethrone ability triggers.

Thanks for the suggestion, I'll definitely have to put some thought into swapping something out for Grave Betrayal.

PS: Reef Worm has been an absolute all-star in this deck. I would fully encourage its inclusion in just about any Marchesa, the Black Rose deck. Once I have a consistent way of putting +1/+1 counters on it, it gets outta control pretty quickly.

Thanks again for the thoughts and suggestion!

Wow, Expropriate is wild! That'd go nicely in my Lazav, Dimir Mastermind deck. Definitely expensive though. I might prefer Insurrection in your deck, for the fact it needs creativity to permanently steal their creatures (I like that challenge) - but they are both nuts in there. I see what you mean about Razaketh, the Foulblooded, and the lag to play one of those other two after you search for them...

...If that's the win-con package, maybe some passive ramping could help? A couple examples of what I mean would be Pitiless Plunderer and Black Market. I run both those in my Ghave, Guru of Spores to great effect. A Ruthless Knave, rather than the plunderer, offers a sac engine while creating two treasure tokens. Not efficient enough for this deck I think, but more for inspiration :). He offers a mana sink if you find yourself with extra mana in the first 5-6 turns and helps you position yourself for 1 big turn.

Maybe, after playing this version a bit, swapping your high cmc for Grave Betrayal and some one sided board wipes like Plague Wind could be an interesting take to try out?

I put an Unspeakable Symbol in mine as well. Seems like it was made for her, taking your life below your opponents while putting on the counters. I dream of having it out in this "Steal Yo Gurl!" style, with a Champion of Stray Souls on the battlefield. If the sequencing and mana could work... Value town.

In regards to the version I'm working on: We have a lower level player in our playgroup who doesn't quite have the cards or the know-how for stronger deck building. I wanted to make something less powerful than Kresh and Ghave, for playing him while still enjoying myself. Madness is a really fun mechanic I'm building around with a lot of trigger opportunities through the draw, discard to cast, and different recursion. Such great value, just not the power. Madness fits naturally with the Innistrad vampires that get +1/+1 counters for dealing damage. Great synergy with Marchesa and it's letting me play interesting cards, including some sweet old commons, that I probably wouldn't play otherwise (ex: Bog Witch). Cards like Archfiend of Ifnir and Squee, Goblin Nabob become elite. I'll let you know when a version is online.

One jankyish build I was thinking for Marchesa: If I can find a more ways in her colours to put +1/+1 counters on creatures, I could run Highway Robber type cards with Blood Artist triggers.

Hello I’m building a similar deck, but having issues with both mana and card draw.

I run 35 lands, so not maybe I’ve just been unlucky the few times I’ve played. I’m gonning to add some of the card draw you have.

I have two suggestions for you, Black Market, Phyrexian Tower. Both do really well with in a Sacing deck. Obviously the Tower is exactly the type of card you want.

Another recommendation Grave Betrayal.

;)

One other question. have you tried Neheb, the Eternal?

I was thinking Neheb, the Eternal and Scourge of the Throne could be good in this deck as well. What are your thoughts?

i would consider running creatures like Archaeomancer so you can get your threat instant and sorcery cards back from your be

goldlion, I like the idea of including something in the deck to help with mana, but I feel like Pitiless Plunderer would be too circumstantial to be counted on. I could for sure see Black Market going in the sideboard, in case anyone else is playing a graveyard-ish deck, but it would take too long to get going by itself, and would be removed before it could really start helping.

Plague Wind , Garruk's Wake, etc., sound good in theory, but I can usually pull off the same effect with Ashnod's Altar and Grave Pact , or a similar combo. If I'm in luck, all of my board wipes are one-sided, if I have a +1/+1 engine up and running!

Champion of Stray Souls seems like he'd be a fun card to include in Marchesa, the Black Rose decks. Let me know the card does in yours!

Thank you for all the suggestions! I'll be sure to check out your Marchesa, the Black Rose deck to see how it's going. I'm terribly sorry it took me so long to reply to your comment! Thank you again for the cards to ponder!