What are you looking at from modern horizons? Generous gift seems like it could fit.

I'm curious why no Selvala, Heart of the Wilds . She does everything the deck wants: Ramp, fixing, and card draw. Have you tried her out? If not I highly recommend it.

I lOOVE this list!!!! Maybe once it's printed Generous Gift , would be better than Chaos Warp ?

@bankrupt_on_selling & KylerStar Modern Horizons looks really sweet for Commander overall, but unfortunately doesn't add much to this deck. There are only a couple of 5+ power creatures, and none of them are very good. I do like Generous Gift , and rather than replace Chaos Warp I'm working to make room to run both. They're top caliber removal, and I'm happy to have some redundancy in those slots. I'm also trying out Prismatic Vista and Sunbaked Canyon , but my mana base is really tight and I don't know if they'll make the cut.

@aloofmilk I've tried her out, but she never performed as well as I'd hoped. For starters, the card draw almost never happened. Most of my creatures have exactly 5 or 6 power, so over a typical game she'd trigger only once or twice for me - and that's not even taking into consideration how often she triggers for my opponents. Secondly, the fixing was mostly redundant. I'm running a "perfect" mana base (ABUR duals, shocks, fetches) and so rarely find myself in need of color fixing. The ramp was really the only thing that payed off, but for the same cost I can run something like Cultivate . I don't doubt that there are Mayael decks out there that get better mileage out of her, but she just never quite fit in well with my particular build.

KindredDiscovery I mean the fixing is nice, but she also taps for aproximately too much mana.

Hey! Would you mind making one or a few budget lists? I saw your comments, but I would love to be able to import a deck list and build it. The Urza deck having a few tiers (Sub $500, $1000, max) is SUPER helpful.

How do you like the C19

Have you considered running wirewood lodge? I think it could work very well with wilderness reclamation and a Mayael. Another seed born muse essentially. I also began play testing the Purphoros package and I really like it.

What's the reasoning behind the latest changes? More haste/flash for losing protection I gues?

@Ataraxey Yeah, a budget list is a great idea. I'll let you know when I've got something together. The latest changes have been a response to a shift in the meta. Overall decks have gotten faster, stronger, and more synergistic over the years - which has been great, don't get me wrong! But even jamming casual games this deck struggles to keep up lately. I realized that I was relying on Mayael to hold the game plan together a bit too much, and whiffing in this new meta is very punishing. In short, I've had to adjust the way I play the deck. That probably means it's time to update the primer too. I'm still organizing my thoughts, but here's the basics:

1) DRAW MORE CARDS. I never used to run much card draw because I had always considered Mayael to be a card advantage engine in her own right. This is wrong. In reality, activating her ability typically means choosing not to play cards from your hand that turn. That really only generates value in slow, grindy games, and frankly most games don't last long enough to see that pay off. This was the first change I made, and over time it lead me to make changes #2 and #3.

2) MAYAEL IS A LATE GAME PLAY. Okay, so when is it smartest to play Mayael and activate her? Two basic scenarios. One: you're out of gas, and she'll help you dig for it. And two: you have enough mana to use her ability while still playing from your hand. That usually means waiting until you have 9+ mana at your disposal. You've got to think of her as (primarily) a late game closer. Of course, you may be able to steal a game here and there by deploying her early, but that strategy requires careful assessment and a good knowledge of your opponents' decks.

3) SHORTEN THE CLOCK. And we arrive at the most salient point. We need to get to that 9+ mana threshold as quickly as we can. That means making the most of our early turns ramping. I've come to believe that ramp is the most crucial element to keep in an opening hand. We can also speed things up artificially with cards like Wilderness Reclamation - play from the hand on our turn, activate Mayael on opponents' turns. I've also cut out a lot of beefy guys that do nothing but wall us in and don't really affect the board. We've got very tight slots for our creature choices, and they really need to have good ETBs or threaten to close out the game. So, out with Sigarda, Host of Herons and in with Cavalier of Flame . Oh, and Vedalken Orrery deserves a nod here too. Flash is no joke with all these big creatures, and denying your opponents a turn to respond feels like it speeds up our clock. This is also why haste is so important.

There are a few more ideas I've been mulling over, and if they bear fruit I'll talk about them in the future. But this is where I'm at right now, and I'm rather pleased with how the deck is developing. It's never really finished, which is one of the things I love most about this format.

@Rene_the_great The mana base of this deck is where I have the least wiggle room. It runs near perfect every game right now, and the only real flex slot I have is currently held by Rogue's Passage . That card ends games. I love Wirewood Lodge , but does it end more games than Passage? Probably not. I think it definitely has merit in budget builds though.

Glad you're enjoying Purphoros, God of the Forge so much. My number one choice with Tooth and Nail alongside Avenger of Zendikar .

Great to understand your thoughts on the updates. I built this deck a few weeks ago and just finished it but havent had a chance to play it yet, so I'll update it now and let you know how the newest version does!

Also - maybe a decent option is Natural Selection? Seems to synergize well with our commander.

Really appreciate the new update. I've noticed the same shift. It's been really difficult to keep up lately. Getting out tempo'd by a precon feels really bad when you've spent 8 years fine tuning and foiling out a deck.

What do you like from the new set? The great henge?

You ever consider running krosan tusker? At best its thinning your deck for fatties at worst its wiff insurance for mayael

@Ataraxey I've put together a budget list, which you can find here: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/budget-mayael-edh-4/?cb=1569430018

I'll have some more in-depth commentary on it in the near future. I was surprised to find how much of the deck was fundamentally unchanged! The mana base obviously suffers, but the ramp, draw, and removal packages are nearly identical. 5 power creatures are worse too, of course, but there are still so many suitable options that the deck doesn't feel like it loses too much in that regard.

@bankrupt_on_selling There are definitely cards that I like in Eldraine, but I don't know if I like them enough to find a spot for them. Castle Garenbrig and Fabled Passage are real nice, but they're outclassed by Gaea's Cradle and Prismatic Vista . I'm testing, but I don't know if there's room in an already tight mana base.

I think The Great Henge is right on the cusp of playability. It's super great in a Mayael deck when you're ahead, but downright terrible when you're behind. And as I mentioned in my last post, this deck can often feel like it's on the back foot. I think Henge is at its best in a deck that plays lots of mid-sized threats, where you can get a good (but usually not full) discount early in the game. Honestly, the best part for this deck would be the card draw, but something like Elemental Bond fills that role better.

Return of the Wildspeaker is the only card that I immediately knew deserved a slot. Compare to Shamanic Revelation , a card that has always pulled a lot of weight for me. It's the same mana cost, but easier to cast, instant speed, usually draws more cards, and has an alternate mode that can help close out the game. It's rare for a card to come along that offers such a clear upgrade.

@GlubDaPhish Krosan Tusker is a great budget option that I used to run. My mana base usually runs like clockwork now days, so I like for my fatties to mostly serve other roles like removal or recursion.

Hey KindredDiscovery, what are your thoughts on Realms Uncharted ? I’ve had it in my Mayael deck for a while and I think it’s served me well enough; its instant speed and filters out 4 lands in my deck which is nice cause it increases the chance of landing a creature with Mayael, but at the same time it lets your opponent choose what you get to keep. Would I be better served if I had a different kind of RAMP?

@NinjaKitty778 Realms Uncharted ! One of my all-time favorites! I used to have it in, swapped it out a while back, and totally forgot about it. The deck is caring more and more about what's in the graveyard, and I think it's high time to cycle it back in. It serves a similar role to Cultivate and Sylvan Scrying , so I'll be cutting both of those (and slotting in Restore too so I'm not down a ramp card). I think you're fine to run it in your build so long as you're already running 12+ mana accelerators. With the deck demanding so many high cost cards you really don't want to skimp on good ramp.

KindredDiscovery one other question. How many sac lands should I run to make use of Titania, Protector of Argoth ? At the moment the fetch land set is above my budget but I’m making use of other sac lands. Do you have any recommendations?

@NinjaKitty778 I'd say 7-8 at a minimum. More is better obviously. 10 or 11 is probably where you'll start to see real consistency. And you should mostly think of her as a ramp card. It's rare that you'll make more than a token or two in an average game, I think my best has been 6 with Sun Titan shenanigans.

I got most of my fetches when they were standard legal, can't really blame anyone for not buying into them now. $100+ for a single card is obscene, you'd probably have more fun building a whole new deck with that kind of money.

I've been playing Mayael off and on throughout the years, never too consistently as I don't always have the patience or fortitude to carry on when being repeatedly stomped by more competitive, more consistent decks... but salt aside, the question I have is: Have you considered the new Atla Palani, Nest Tender ? I'm thinking of converting my Mayael deck into a more token/populate-oriented likeness of a Mayael deck, but under Atla. If I kept Mayal as general, I might consider running her as an officer? She could do some things.

Why the removal of Vedalkan Orrery? It seems great, but in practice did it not play well?

Do you like Highcliff Felidar for this deck?

@thewyzman I think you could easily argue that Atla Palani, Nest Tender is the stronger of the two in the command zone. She doesn't have the same deck-building constraints as Mayael (throwing in some sac outlets for those egg tokens is waaaaay less demanding than 25+ big creatures) and is pretty much guaranteed never to whiff. I've even seen some really cool combo builds with only a few creatures in the deck, so saccing an egg token is effectively like tutoring for your win-con. If you're looking to be more competitive, I'd recommend retooling your deck to run Atla as the general.

As a second in command, she's perfectly serviceable. Don't expect to be maximizing her value though. There are not enough utility slots in this deck to include the really good sac outlets for those eggs ( Skullclamp , Ashnod's Altar , etc.) so you'll usually have to wait for them to die on their own.

@Ataraxey Vedalken Orrery was working well, but I think Birthing Pod outclasses it. Both options allow us to be more responsive to our opponents' plays, but Pod is both faster and works better with our substantial creature toolbox. I haven't been playing with it for very long, but it's gotten me out of quite a few jams already. Saccing an obsolete Wayward Swordtooth to grab Surrak, the Hunt Caller , then dropping a hasted Balefire Dragon feels incredible.

@bankrupt_on_selling I really do like Highcliff Felidar . I'll be testing it for sure, probably in place of Thorn Mammoth . Felidar is likely to kill more things, but Mammoth gives you the option to snipe pesky utility creatures that Felidar can't hit.

Wouldn't Bountiful Promenade be better than Canopy Vista ? And Spire Garden instead of Cinder Glade ?

bankrupt_on_selling: Canopy Vista and Cinder Glade can be searched for via fetch lands like Wooded Foothills , whereas Bountiful Promenade and Spire Garden cannot.

But you have Plateau , Savannah , Taiga , Sacred Foundry , Stomping Ground , and Temple Garden for that.