Pheardemons says... #2
I like Tragic Slip. My only problem was the couple times late game when things are no longer dying, but I will definitely reconsider it. Especially with Smallpox. Honestly if I had to choose between Abrupt Decay and Beast Within I'd probably keep the mainboard Abrupt Decays because otherwise counter decks would simply have their way with me. Especially the Splinter Twin combo would suck game one. However, I do understand where you are coming from with the Beast Within though. I'll keep it in mind. I'm going to take a good hard long look at this deck with all of the suggestions I'd been given this far.
January 9, 2016 4:53 p.m.
ComboCrazy says... #3
Keep in mind how few decks actually run counters except W/U control decks. I hardly see counters anymore, even in modern. They don't pop up very often, and if they don't counter Abrupt Decay they'll counter something else, which could be more important. The incentive for a control deck to counter a Beast Within is almost nonexistent because control is almost always very lacking in creatures.
January 9, 2016 5:09 p.m.
Pheardemons says... #4
I actually play against a lot of counter decks in my meta. Well I did before I moved. Not sure what is around where I live now. That's why I am very keen on keeping Abrupt Decay. But maybe even two and two. I have Dark Confidant to continuously draw so half and half might work pretty well. Or 3 and 3 if I decide to take out Go for the Throat (even maybe Tragic Slip as I was debating on switching those out). We'll see what happens.
January 9, 2016 5:48 p.m.
TheFoilAjani says... #5
Have you ever considered going B/W Smallpox? It is a little less aggressive, but it looks like it would be a little more effective.
January 9, 2016 6:31 p.m.
Pheardemons says... #6
TheFoilAjani Green is only there because of Abrupt Decay, Maelstrom Pulse, and right now also considering Beast Within. I am willing to take advice on certain cards in white that could help. I forsee white being a more control route. I obviously know of Oblivion Ring and Path to Exile for the control aspect. Aggressively I'm not sure what would benefit. What cards would you recommend? And what cards would you suggest taking out for the recommended cards?
January 9, 2016 6:38 p.m.
TheFoilAjani says... #7
So I do like this B/G route, it is more aggressive. But just for reference, this is what white does.
In white, you do get these things:
Obviously, you get Path to Exile and Oblivion Ring for Removal
In terms of helping with Smallpox, you get to run Flagstones of Trokair, which is an insane advantage.
You gain Lingering Souls, Sorin, Solemn Visitor, and Intangible Virtue if you're feeling frisky.
In B/W Pox, you run Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and Thoughtseize. You can run either Phyrexian Crusader or Mirran Crusader as alt wincons.
You do lose a tiny bit of removal, but you can still be offensive.
January 9, 2016 7:45 p.m. Edited.
Pheardemons says... #8
I do like your ideas TheFoilAjani but this deck is mainly centered around the reanimate factor or the creatures. Phyrexian Crusader and Mirran Crusader are out of the equation because I would be changing the theme with those creatures (meaning to take out the reanimate creatures for them). I do really like Flagstones of Trokair IF I was running white. Lingering Souls and Sorin, Solemn Visitor are more for different types of decks; tokens or B/W agro. Sorin, Solemn Visitor +1 would definitely be great for my deck, but adding white doesn't seem to have the advantage of what I want for this deck. You definitely gave me an idea for a different deck though. Thanks for the thought!
January 10, 2016 5:12 a.m.
Pheardemons says... #9
ComboCrazy, Bloodspawn, TheFoilAjani, Sk0oMa, Red_X, TheLivingCME, and RedJokr let me know what you think of the update and the deck thus far!
January 10, 2016 11:10 p.m.
TheLivingCME says... #10
I like how the deck mixes together aggro with little creatures and control by blowing up all the threats on the board. It seems to me it can get the advantage on the game quite quickly, too.
One question: why do you run so many fetchlands? You play 8 with 8 fetchable lands. I see fetches can have various synergies in this deck, but maybe 8 is too much?
Then, some cards that may interest you.
If you want more "control" cards, you could try some sac outlet like Viscera Seer or Thoughtpicker Witch. Since your choice of creatures, it would be simple to use them effectively. Mind Slash could be a bomb, too.
A compromise with the two faces of the deck can even be found in one of the newest card from BFZ, Catacomb Sifter.
Finally, have you thought about running some fatties which can end the game fast if unanswered? Some choices could be Demon of Death's Gate (great, but if they can answer it you got REALLY hurt), Demonlord of Ashmouth (recurrent threat, and with virtually no drawback here) and Abyssal Persecutor (if you are sure you can get rid of him later, it's a great beater).
January 11, 2016 4:57 p.m.
Pheardemons says... #11
TheLivingCME nice to talk to see you again man!
Other people have recommended the sac outlets, my main issue is what to take out for them? Any suggestions that you think could work? Do you really think they are worth putting in?
I run those fetchlands to try and abuse Bloodghast. With Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth I can hold the fetches until I draw Bloodghast. Granted 8 may be too many, I just haven't had any problems with them so I haven't thought about it.
An end game beater hadn't occurred to me. I like Abyssal Persecutor because I have Smallpox and Tragic Slip to deal with him if needed, but overall a pretty good concept. What would you recommend to take out for an end game beater?
January 11, 2016 5:19 p.m.
TheFoilAjani says... #12
I think you could cut one or two Gravecrawler for a Phyrexian Obliterator. You have only 1 land not producing black, so it could work.
I don't like one of your arguements against Maelstrom Pulse. Like I stated above, only one of your lands don't produce black. There is no situation where you couldn't cast Maelstrom Pulse where you could cast Beast Within.
January 11, 2016 6:57 p.m.
This looks really fun to play with!I haven't played Magic since last year though ;~:.Last year as in....Well....December.. XD.
January 11, 2016 7:59 p.m.
ComboCrazy says... #15
Well given that I had no idea that Catacomb Sifter existed, I didn't suggest removing your Dark Confidant, but I would suggest switching him out for two Catacomb Sifters and maybe an Ob Nixilis Reignited. Those two would make for good control and draw, especially if you start getting clumps mid-game.
January 11, 2016 10:05 p.m.
Pheardemons says... #16
TheFoilAjani, while you are absolutely correct on the ease of casting both Maelstrom Pulse and Beast Within, the main reason for the switch is the instant speed. I don't believe a 3/3 creature would be too much of a problem with all of the removal that I have especially with the possibility of an end game beater. I do like your suggestion about Phyrexian Obliterator. Will take to heart and consideration. Also let me know when your b/w pox deck is made. Would love to check it out!
ComboCrazy that isn't a terrible recommendation. Especially if I decide to add a 4 mana finisher the switch would be pretty decent. However I would probably want Phyrexian Arena over Catacomb Sifter for card draw/advantage.
RedJokr good to see you again man. And I was about to say you make way too many decks to not have been playing for more than a year XD
FOR EVERYONE GIVING SUGGESTIONS!!
How do yal feel about the switch from Dark Confidant to either Catacomb Sifter or Phyrexian Arena? Also how do yal feel about the finisher being Phyrexian Obliterator? Any other suggestions that some people have? I do kind of like Abyssal Persecutor with the flying and trample aspect, but Phyrexian Obliterator is such a powerhouse. Let me know how yal feel!
January 11, 2016 10:47 p.m.
Pheardemons says... #17
I am a little weary about adding in another card as a late game finisher. Honestly one of the reasons that Quest for the Gravelord is there. It can create a 5/5 basically for one mana based on how this deck plays. Specifically adding another card to be a beater seems like a little redundant and maybe unnecessary. But always willing to take suggestions.
January 11, 2016 11:11 p.m.
ComboCrazy says... #18
Pheardemons. Dude. When you have a phyrexian that fits with your deck curve and strategy, you add it. Period. Phyrexians are the most RIDICULOUSLY OP sh*t ever. Add it. Not only would it help deal with creatures, such as the 3/3 that Beast Within would create, but it also suppresses an opponent's aggressiveness. Given that most of your creatures can't block, that'll probably come in handy.
January 11, 2016 11:19 p.m.
Pheardemons says... #19
Lol well since you put it that way I'll reconsider it more heavily. I would love to have a deck that can put Phyrexian Obliterator to good use. We'll see. Thanks man.
January 11, 2016 11:25 p.m.
Pheardemons says... #20
How does everyone feel about taking out 2 bitterblossoms for either 2 Phyrexian Obliterators, One Phyrexian Obliterator and one Abyssal Persecutor, or one Phyrexian Obliterator and one more Liliana of the Veil? Just a thought process. Bitterblossom has helped, but a lot of times it has hurt with the lifeloss. Basilisk Collar is supposed to help with the lifeloss but I don't always get them in the same hand.
January 12, 2016 12:02 a.m.
Pheardemons says... #22
Thanks for the input TheFoilAjani. I'm really starting to warm up to the idea of an end game beater. I'll playtest and see how it goes.
January 12, 2016 12:17 a.m.
TheLivingCME says... #23
Phyrexian Obliterator is a powerhouse, no doubts about it, just be sure to take out any removal from your opponent's hand, since he has a giant target on his head. I would suggest to proxy and try the split 1/1 between it and Abyssal Persecutor anyway, just to test them both. Oh, and I wouldn't remove Bitterblossom, since that it's an important aspect of the control side of this deck. I'd take out 1 Quest for the Gravelord and maybe 1 Smallpox. Or maybe 2 Quests.
Regarding the Confidants, they fit very well with the low curve of your deck, so switching with Phyrexian Arena is not a good idea. 3 is even a good number of them, and running 2 Bobs/1 Catacomb Sifter doesn't feel right. Try to remove a Bloodsoaked Champion for him, maybe.
As for the sac outlet, I think they could work wonders here. Sure, if you play the Sifter, Viscera Seer is useless. I would choose between Thoughtpicker Witch and Mind Slash to run as a single copy, since they both filter the cards in your opponent's hand and are redundant/repeatable. I'd take off another Smallpox.
January 12, 2016 5:18 a.m.
TheFoilAjani says... #24
Aight, this is my list; A Pox on Both Your Houses!
January 12, 2016 11:07 a.m.
XD.I've been playing for two years though.It's great speaking to you again too XD!
ComboCrazy says... #1
Just DON'T get rid of Abrupt Decay! I want to make that super clear, don't remove that beyond sideboarding it. It's a really good card for this deck.
January 9, 2016 4:50 p.m.