Nekusar's Wheel in the Sky

Commander / EDH evncrbch

SCORE: 27 | 57 COMMENTS | 4612 VIEWS | IN 11 FOLDERS


DarkRequiem says... #1

On a side note, let me do something else:

Batterskull - I'd swap it with Vampiric Link. Nekusar hardly ever attacks.

Elixir of Immortality - Diminishing Returns or Time Reversal for extra pain.

Otherworld Atlas - requires too much work; Font of Mythos is better.

Life's Finale - although fun, I'd use some other form of mass removal; Black Sun's Zenith or Killing Wave instead? I love the Wave; if your deck supports it (ie, you end up with big hands), Kagemaro, First to Suffer is great; Starstorm is good too, at instant speed.

Prosperity - I'd play Diminishing Returns or Time Reversal, whichever you didn't pick to replace Elixir, instead.

Beseech the Queen - straight out bad with the amount of swamps you're running; Demonic Tutor?

Diabolic Tutor - too much mana to cast it; Vampiric Tutor? I know its an expensive card though (same as Demonic Tutor) so I might run the much more budget friendly Merchant Scroll and Mystical Tutor if most of the times you fetch for instant or sorceries.

Increasing Ambition - another very expensive tutor; Anvil of Bogardan for extra cards and hand disruption?

Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker - I find his cost quite prohibitive on a Nekusar deck; Evacuation is awesome before a wheel effect.

Swan Song - fun but hardly what you want since you shouldn't be offering free creatures to your opponents (unless you're playing Vicious Shadows, Vile Consumption and/or Pendrell Mists); No Mercy could be fun since it adds to your defensive enchatments.

Consuming Aberration - although fun, it requires that you attack, something that Nekusar doesn't seem too pron on (more so if you add the already suggested recycling sorceries); more wheel effects! Winds of Change is painful too.

Sheoldred, Whispering One - too high cmc (remember, you'll want to maximize your spells and with high cmc creatures you won't be able to do much else that turn) and with recycling sorceries, she does too little; Whirlpool Warrior for more wheels!

Mikaeus, the Unhallowed - Clout of the Dominus is easy to cast, lowers your curve and protects Nekusar. What is there not to like?

Grave Titan - again, nice card but not for this deck; Kederekt Parasite is one very, very nice Underworld Dreams on legs.

Whispersilk Cloak - good but due to mana restrictions I might prefer Lightning Greaves.

Darksteel Plate - I might prefer Diplomatic Immunity but that's not a big deal.

Other than that, you might be running too many mana sources (I might cut down to 40, maybe 30 lands + 4 rocks?), freeing up 2 slots for other low cost spells...

Landwise, I'd squeeze in a Bojuka Bog to exile someone's pesky grave if reanimator decks are a thing in your meta. Rogue's Passage might be a candidate for the swap, although you want to combo it with Master of Cruelties. Terramorphic Expanse and Evolving Wilds seem a bit iffy, as do the Guildgates. City of Brass could be good. Reflecting Pool is great too. Mikokoro, Center of the Sea is nice too. Depending on your meta, Exotic Orchard could be good. I kind of enjoy Cephalid Coliseum...

August 8, 2015 8:51 p.m.

evncrbch says... #2

Thanks for the suggestions! I will definitely work on this in the next few days and take what you have said into consideration. Budget is a constraint here so I may not be able to do all of these changes immediately but I will keep them in mind

August 8, 2015 9:40 p.m.

DarkRequiem says... #3

Looking forward for the results. Nekusar can be quite expensive de to land consttictions. Spellwise depends on what you want to do with it. There are lots of budget-friendly options out there.

August 8, 2015 9:48 p.m.

evncrbch says... #4

DarkRequiem and gnarlicide - updated the deck with some of your suggestions. Dark Requiem - I decided to leave in Diabolic Tutor because I was already adding value to the list so I didn't want to add in the Mystical Tutor just yet, and Merchant Scroll doesn't hit enough for me to think it better over Diabolic Tutor. Plus, Diabolic Tutor can find things other than wheels, for instance if I need some defense because I am getting hate from the table, I could find a defensive enchantment like No Mercy. Also, I'm not sure about your point about Beseech the Queen being bad because of swamps, it looks for land count, not swamp count, unless I am missing something? You also suggested swapping out Swan Song, but for now I think it will stay because it is a cheap counter and I think it is worth giving an opponent a 2/2 in a 40 life format to keep my stuff safe from removal. Thank you both for your input in the deck so far, it has helped a lot! Keep the suggestions coming and I will try to see what I can do to improve the deck and maintain my budget.

August 9, 2015 4:39 p.m.

DarkRequiem says... #5

My bad on Beseech the Queen. Somehow I always think it counts swamps but that's not the case.

Do you need the Leyline?

August 9, 2015 5:17 p.m.

evncrbch says... #6

I like the idea of casting Nekusar on an opponent's turn. It allows me to get his advantage first, and then if I'm waiting to equip something onto him to keep him safe it speeds up the process a little. I'm not sure if I will keep it but I at least want to test it out for now.

August 9, 2015 5:20 p.m.

Brionac says... #7

You say you don't want Time Spiral because it's too expensive, but you have a Bloodstained Mire. Those 2 are almost equal in price where I looked, so Spiral shouldn't be too expensive.

October 6, 2015 10:08 a.m.

evncrbch says... #8

I already owned the bloodstained mire @Brionac.

October 6, 2015 11:33 a.m.

Brionac says... #9

evncrbch Didn't know that, sorry.

October 6, 2015 5:11 p.m.

usaDiabetic says... #10

I noticed you don't have many ways to protect Nekusar. So maybe find space for Lightning Greaves, Whispersilk Cloak, Swiftfoot Boots, ect.

Budget wheel effects like, Wheel of Fate and Magus of the Wheel could be good.

August 18, 2017 11:59 a.m.

DonQuijote says... #11

August 22, 2017 10:07 a.m.

evncrbch says... #12

usaDiabetic - I may add in another card or two for protection. Probably will start with Swiftfoot Boots as I already own one and it still allows me to enchant him with Helm of the Ghastlord. Wheel of Fate may be worth trying, but timing things with it will be tough because my opponents have so much notice that it's coming. Magus of the Wheel is mediocre because he has to survive a round of the table which will nearly never happen.

DonQuijote - Windfall is already in the list. I used to run Jace's Archivist but since he has to survive a full round around the table to do anything I found him underwhelming. He rarely survives.

Thank you both for your suggestions!

August 22, 2017 11:12 a.m.

Sumosnake says... #13

i have just completed my own Nekusar deck and two cards i would recommend are Spiteful Visions,which acts as a second Fevered Visions and Ebony Owl Netsuke which can play a similar role, only without the additional card draw

August 23, 2017 7:34 p.m.

Caerwyn says... #14

Sigil of Sleep and Phyresis can both be devastating when played alongside wheel effects--the former can cripple many creature based decks, and the latter can win you the game in a single turn.

August 25, 2017 9:02 a.m.

evncrbch says... #15

Sumosnake - I actually removed Spiteful Visions from the deck recently because it hurts me when I draw cards as well, and I am drawing many more cards than my opponents sometimes. If I have a Consecrated Sphinx on the table, I can't even use its ability if I also control Spiteful Visions because I will kill myself too quickly. In addition, most of the time, cards don't sit in my opponents hands all that long, so forcing them to keep 7+ cards in hand by their upkeep is pretty difficult. It also makes cards like Sire Of Insanity much worse, and I think players having no cards in hand is much less dangerous than opponents with full hands. They could be good includes in the right list, I'm just not so sure this is the right 100 for them to be in.

cdkime - Sigil of Sleep looks VERY interesting. Definitely will look into that. On the other hand, I will never make this list try to kill with infect. Everyone I play with believes the only way infect should be included in EDH is if the entire deck is based around infect. Slapping infect on an easy damage outlet feels really cheeky to us (myself included), and thus I will not give Nekusar infect under any circumstance. If people have a play group that doesn't mind losing to one wheel effect, then it's a great include however.

Thank you both for your suggestions! Feel free to let me know if there is anything I have missed in my analysis of your suggestions or if there is anything else you think I should include.

August 25, 2017 9:30 a.m.

Caerwyn says... #16

evncrbch

Agree completely on infect, but figured I would suggest it anyway.

I also looked at your list a bit more in-depth, and wanted to add some more suggestions:

Teferi's Puzzle Box--massive damage and disrupting your opponents' hands.

Chasm Skulker--with massive card draw, this can be quite potent, spawning a swarm of blockers on its death.

Kederekt Parasite--inexpensive to cast, and if you have your commander on the field, his effect will trigger.

Psychosis Crawler--I have had mixed results with this one, mostly because I'd rather use the 5 mana to cast other things. When I actually put it on the field, it works quite well.

Sangromancer--With the discard effects from wheels, this can net you obscene amounts of health.

Smoke--inexpensive to cast, and you are not generally tapping down your creatures.

August 25, 2017 11:33 a.m.

evncrbch says... #17

cdkime - I actually just removed Teferi's Puzzle Box but I think I am going to try to find room for it again. I have seen Chasm Skulker in lists before, and cannot say I have actually tried it yet. I probably will try testing him out, but I'm just not sure what he replaces yet. I also removed Kederekt Parasite recently. He is good when Nekusar is out, but otherwise there are so few red permanents in the list that if they remove Nekusar they effectively removed Kederekt Parasite as well. Psychosis Crawler was originally in the list, but I don't think he is worth the five mana investment, as you said. Sangromancer is a neat defensive card that I will probably test out. Finally, Smoke seems like a perfect card for this list. It's great against the decks that go wide, and good against a generic creature-based "value" deck. Its only weak spot is it's dead versus voltron lists, but that just means I need to be smarter with my removal and countermagic. Great find, thanks so much for brining that card to my attention, and thanks for all of your other suggestions and analysis. If you wouldn't mind taking a look, what cards in the mainboard right now would you think about cutting for some of these suggestions or other cards in the maybeboard, and why would you choose those cards? Cutting cards always seems to be the hardest part of EDH deckbuilding for me, so I would greatly appreciate the assistance there.

August 25, 2017 12:01 p.m.

Caerwyn says... #18

Jace Beleren--I playtested him, and generally found his effect too slow to justify a space. One extra card and one extra damage is not significant. Further, he is not protected by your pillowfort cards. Temple Bell has the same issue as Jace's +2 ability.

You have a lot of tutors in your deck. Given the inordinate amounts of card draw this type of deck generates, I found tutors do not add that much, and you could probably cut a few of those.

Breathstealer's Crypt the reveal effect is nifty for scouting what your opponents will do, but even with creature-heavy opponents, you're not getting that much out of the card.

Seizan, Perverter of Truth--I never found myself casting this card. While the damage it inflicts to yourself is inconsequential, I usually found better uses for 5 mana.

Sire Of Insanity works poorly with a bunch of wheels. Many wheels give you cards equal to the number in your hand. If their hand size is zero, your primary "burn" spells fall flat. As you stated, an empty hand is less threatening, but it slows down your kill considerably.

Lim-Dul's Vault is a great card in many decks, but, like other tutors, you are drawing enough cards, and there are enough viable paths to victory that finding the right card is not quite as important.

August 25, 2017 12:35 p.m.

evncrbch says... #19

cdkime - I also had Jace Beleren and Temple Bell on my list, so it's good to hear some confirmation there. As for tutors, I think I'm only running two with Mystical Tutor and Demonic Tutor. Mystical Tutor I think stays for sure because I can wheel, and hold priority to cast the tutor, place a wheel on top of my deck, then draw it and use it. You make a good point about drawing enough cards that I don't need a lot of tutors, so maybe I will toy with cutting Demonic Tutor, the downside of course being I sacrifice some ability to find cards for specific scenarios. One thing I am worried about with cutting Breathstealer's Crypt is not having enough damage. Your argument against Sire Of Insanity is valid, I will pay close attention to that as I continue to test the list before purchasing any updates. I was also underwhelmed with Lim-Dul's Vault, so I'm glad to hear someone else thinks it's not super strong here. As for Seizan, Perverter of Truth, I really like this guy. With Nekusar out, he's dealing 4 extra damage per turn to each opponent, and he helps me dig through the deck faster to find more wheels, draw spells, etc.

I think my main concern is not having enough ways to hurt my opponents when they draw cards. Perhaps I need to add Kederekt Parasite back in to make sure I have enough effects. I do think Spiteful Visions needs to stay out though. I don't think I have enough in the way of defence to manage hurting myself as well as being hurt by the rest of the table. Are there any other pain permanents I'm missing that you know of?

August 25, 2017 12:58 p.m.

NV_1980 says... #20

Looking good; +1!

September 19, 2017 1:32 p.m.

SaskeSaskia says... #21

I made a nekusar edh deck and thought heavily about putting Dissipation Field in it. The problem with that card, though, is that it affects you as well as your opponents. So, if you have a card like Spiteful Visions out, it'll just return that card to your hand. Looking good though!

I would recommend looking at Mindcrank and Phyrexian Tyranny, that is a pretty good combo

September 20, 2017 1:31 p.m.

evncrbch says... #22

SaskeSaskia - I really do like Dissipation Field, which is part of why I removed Spiteful Visions from the list. My issue with Phyrexian Tyranny is the same as the issue I have with Spiteful Visions. It hits me. So beyond the damage I would deal myself with it, it can also just bounce itself if I have Dissipation Field out, making two strikes against it, hence why I didn't include it.

September 20, 2017 7:21 p.m.

butthurt_qrow says... #23

First thing I typically look for in a Nekusar deck is Bloodchief Ascension, as it is a cheap CMC, is extremely easy to activate if Nekusar is out, and gives you sustain ability.

I also would highly recommend you find a place for Teferi's Puzzle Box, as it just stocks up damage quick. With only Nekusar out, if your opponent has a full hand, they will take a total of 11 damage during their draw step (2 from first draw, 9 from the box). Now imagine that with more damage dealers or more card draw. The damage stacks up quickly.

One strange card I have in my Nekusar deck is Whip of Erebos. It helps me sustain, as I gain all the life my opponents will lose from Nekusar.

September 25, 2017 10:15 a.m.

hey, I have a competitive nekusar primerand ive been playing him since printing so nearly 5 years now,

obviously my list is budgetless but it might help you get some budget ideas, some i dont see would be:

Memory Jar and Notion Thief are some of his best cards.

memory jar can easily be copied to exile the first jars hand of cards, all while discarding them to the wheel engines you're also missing, Dream Halls and Mind Over Matter its also a cheap, easily casted wheel

notion thief may negate the draw damage, but after a single wheel youve drawn more cards than a consecrated sphinx and can damnation into wheeling out

you also run a bit too many creatures for the amount of board wipes you run, and the upkeep ones are rather slow and easily dealt with

you also need a lot more draw engines as backup in case you cant wheel to loot more cards

Teferi's Puzzle Box may seem bad, but with Notion Thief it forces your opponent to bottomdeck their hand and draw 0-1 cards while you draw the rest

Necropotence no reason you shouldn't run this if you have Anvil of Bogardan, it negates the downside and allows you to draw enough cards to win as soon as turn 4 if you cast anvil turn 2 and potence 3 exiling 1-39 cards

other backup draw engines (self only, howling mine just gives opponents card advantage.) besides potence i dont see are Mystic Remora, Phyrexian Arena, Geth's Grimoire, Dark Tutelage, and, more importantly the game-winning combo wheel engines, Dream Halls and Mind Over Matter

also Memory is a great new wheel with a counterspell/bounce to boot!

overall id suggest running much less creatures and cut the walkers, as the planeswalkers are very low impact and you have very few ways to block them getting stomped, ive even ran megajace and dack and found them less than useful, i only run Tezzeret the Seeker for the artifact ramp/tutor, but he isn't budget friendly of course :(

I would add even more creature hate such as Evacuation, Rakdos Charm,Deadly Tempest, Incite Rebellion, AEtherize, Cryptic Command

anyways, +1 for playing the best damn commander there is

check out my primer and see if you get any ideas from the budget cards or combo descriptions! if it helps feel free to "like" it, and hope my suggestions were of help

4 life

may your wheel be done

September 25, 2017 11:05 p.m. Edited.

your deck is like 50% identical to mine and looks eerily similar to my early deck stages, so you're definitely on the right track

September 25, 2017 11:08 p.m.

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