Pir Imagination

Commander / EDH firerif

SCORE: 40 | 29 COMMENTS | 17043 VIEWS | IN 18 FOLDERS


Ishmokin says... #1

The deck looks fun! how are its matchups in the cedh meta?

June 13, 2019 10:32 a.m.

firerif says... #2

It’s a blast to play. You just spin your wheels and eventually win. No combo to set up, no specific cards you need to resolve, just a ton of cantrips and mana rocks.

I’ve had a lot of success in staxxy metas (so long as there’s no null rod) and heavy permission metas. Anywhere where you have the time to just cast cantrips and grow toothy. Fast metas are a bit trickier, since the deck has very few big stax pieces (except tabernacle) and while you have a lot of interaction, you don’t really want to be the control deck at the table. Not to say you can’t do it, but you prefer to be cantripping mainphase so you can dig deeper and hit rocks to continue your dig.

I’d say it plays a lot like edric, snowballing kinda slowly at first and not really giving your opponents and good targets to interact with, then at some point just becoming impossible to deal with.

June 13, 2019 10:59 a.m.

BalkanDS says... #3

Is the only win con Jace?

June 18, 2019 7:58 p.m.

firerif says... #4

Jace is the only hard win-con. If you can’t use him, you can just make a bunch of mana, bounce your opponents creatures wheel people’s hands away with Narset, and beat down with a very large Toothy. I’ve never had to do that in a game, and labman, or fishbowl might be reasonable includes if you were playing against extract, but since, when you are trying to win, you tend to have most of your deck in hand, unless jace is exiled you will generally be able to figure something out in regards to resolving him or getting him back.

June 19, 2019 1:46 a.m.

TacoBoy says... #5

firerif I'm a little confused. How are you running both as your commanders? They do not have 'Partner'. The 'Partner' mechanic is, as far as I know, different from the 'Partners with' mechanic from Battlebond. Or is there some errata to the rules that allows the Battlebond mechanic to act as the Commander 'Partn

July 2, 2019 3:01 p.m.

TacoBoy says... #6

You know, Google is a Hell of a drug. Never mind my inane question!

July 2, 2019 3:04 p.m.

Hissp says... #7

Why are you running rocks instead of dorks, only need blue Mana? What turn are you usually about to storm off? Why aren't you running Mox Amber ?

September 12, 2019 12:37 p.m.

firerif says... #8

Yes the deck needs its blue mana a lot. You could run a mix of rocks and dorks on a budget and even in non budget versions running arbor elf and birds is fine. But my more recent versions have cut those as well. In a deck with as many basic islands as this they can be hard to cast turn 1. The one other note towards rocks is that we can play cursed totem- a card this version doesn't play, but my more current versions do.

The storm turn is very contextual. You want to storm off the turn before the slow decks try to win, but the turn after the fast decks try to win. Around t4 at a normal table, but in a slower pod it can be as late as t6.

As far as mox amber goes, it doesn't cast toothy and adds too little mana to be worth including only to make storming easier.

P.S. My most current version of the deck can be found here -> https://scryfall.com/@firerif/decks/c0ab85df-0274-4711-902d-8843478bab91

September 25, 2019 12:20 a.m.

trancer99 says... #9

I really want to play this, but I do not understand how it wins...? Can you add a wincon section ?

October 19, 2019 10 a.m.

firerif says... #10

It’s at the bottom of the description. Basically you just draw your deck with labjace.

October 19, 2019 11:52 a.m.

create812 says... #11

I hadn't considered Gush, what's your reasoning for it being one of the better cards in the deck?

October 24, 2019 9:59 a.m.

firerif says... #12

Gush is one of the best enablers for getting through one of the most critical parts of the deck's play patterns; the time when Toothy is small enough to be removed without drawing 6+ cards. This is the most dangerous period for the deck as having Toothy removed at this time sets you back multiple turns in tempo loss. Recasting Toothy for 6 mana is painful. This is why the deck plays sub-optimal cantrips like careful study, tolarian winds, and thought scour. Just getting those initial counters on Toothy is so important. Gush does this extremely well, often being a fairly free way to draw 2 cards as once we land Toothy we don't need that much mana.

October 25, 2019 12:52 p.m.

create812 says... #13

I see, cards like Brainstorm and Cephalid Coliseum drawing 3 for a single U is big game here.

October 30, 2019 8:50 a.m.

create812 says... #14

How do you feel about Spark Double, and Hardened Scales? Doubling or tripling up on Pir's ability is gross. They're probably not suited for faster metas I suppose. I'm not usually facing fast and expensive decks, so I'm running them for now.

No Laboratory Maniac? I guess because you're super creature light due to running Pendrall Vale? But still, redundancy in win cons is important, no?

Also, you're missing Command Tower! Why not cut an Island for it? Also, any particular reason for the Snow-Covered lands? I'm running them mostly for Into the North (my list has a landfall sub-theme).

October 30, 2019 9:48 a.m.

create812 says... #15

How is Summer Bloom? The deck is so land light; is the idea that you'll draw so many cards that Summer Bloom is a nice one-off effect?

October 30, 2019 10:52 a.m.

firerif says... #16

Ok, lets go through this one at a time: Hardened Scales: Pir is actually very unimportant. Toothy gaining counters on his own is enough to win the game. You cast Pir when you can. But often you never even cast him. Hardened scales is a card you could play, but will often just be a dead card in hand or a useless card on the battlefield.

Spark Double: This card is way too expensive for its cost. Take a look at the deck's curve. The only card that actually costs more than 3 mana is the deck's main way of winning. Its just too slow to be a viable value engine.

Labman: No need. We have a back-up win-con using copy artifact on Isochron.

Islands: Basics are actually quite good. The type "island" is important for Gush and Mystic Sanctuary. And being basic is important both against opposing Blood Moons and our own Back to Basics.

Snow lands: Mainly bluff value. Mouth of Ronom is a card the deck could play, and the fact that you have snow basics means that theoretically your opponents should play around it.

Summer Bloom: Summer Bloom turns green and colorless into Blue mana during the storm turn. Blue mana is what the deck tends to run low on during storm turns.

October 30, 2019 7:39 p.m.

create812 says... #17

All good points. How is Copy Artifact on Isochron a win-con?

October 31, 2019 1:27 p.m.

create812 says... #18

Also, what does a storm turn look like for this deck? Cantriping, blinking toothy, and untapping your artifacts until you've drawn out?

October 31, 2019 1:45 p.m.

firerif says... #19

Copy artifact: assuming Iso-rev is already in play, you have infinite mana and infinite untaps. From there you can copy artifact isochron scepter, imprinting; winds of rebuke, swan song, narset’s reversal, or some other spell that with infinite casts should win the game.

Typical storm turn starts with flickering toothy with ~8 counters on it. From there you cast your fast mana, try to cast pir, and try to find more flicker effects. You cast the minimum number of cantrips possible, saving mana for actually storming. Mana is always the big holdup, so you may have to take lines where you tutor dramatic reversal and just cast it. Assembling Iso rev is convenient as a way to win when you are low on resources, or you have to play under taxing effects, but often without those taxing effects in play you can just use dramatic reversal as a ritual without much trouble.

November 3, 2019 10:22 a.m.

Magnivore says... #20

I love the deck! I've played it a number of times now to great success, and should even be published on YouTube sometime in the near-ish future! What I'm curious about is why does the deck not run Cyclonic Rift ? Blue in cEDH means a number of things to generally include Rift, so why not play it?

November 25, 2019 6:53 a.m.

firerif says... #21

Rift is fine but I personally dislike having bounce spells that can’t double as a way to bounce toothy as you don’t infrequently end up using your own bounce and kill spells on toothy as a way to initiate your storm turn. It’s probably correct to include it in more stax-y metas but being so low on tutors means that the deck can’t really make use of unique effects and if you’re just relying on drawing it at the right time it loses a lot of its power. And it’s non-overloaded effect just isn’t strong enough.

November 25, 2019 8:06 p.m.

Cazzeo says... #22

Are Baral or Jace VP any good here? Both can reactively draw to put a counter on Toothy while providing extra utility.

February 2, 2020 10:57 p.m.

Davidoff says... #23

I built the buget deck, Toothy Storm and I play with people who play competive magic and it works the most of the time

February 9, 2020 8:32 a.m.

firerif says... #24

JVP is fine. It was early builds of the list. Part of the issue is that there aren’t really too many spells you want to flashback. He’s honestly better as a creature than as a walker. I don’t think I would play him alongside cursed totem so if that’s a card you want to be playing I wouldn’t play jace.

Baral in the other hand is pretty mopey. It realistically discounts about 15 spells in the deck and that’s kinda too low.

February 9, 2020 12:56 p.m.

mossy66779 says... #25

Jace over Thassa's oracle? thought since its cheaper it would be better? Or have you not updated the list also would upping the islands for high tide be any good time spiral seems pretty decent and snap can return toothy!

February 12, 2020 4:22 a.m.

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