[PRE-PRIMER] Burning Autumn

Frontier* VraskaTheCursed

SCORE: 8 | 17 COMMENTS | 1009 VIEWS | IN 2 FOLDERS


divinagon says... #1

Neat deck, but I'd like to point out that with the new mana-cost rules, Never / Return is 7 mana.

July 1, 2017 8:42 a.m.

@divinagon yep, that's why its included over Ruinous Path. Sin Prodder deals 7 with it, and its another cmc to return with Seasons Past

July 1, 2017 10:09 a.m.

divinagon says... #3

I know, I'm only saying it because you have it sitting under 3 drop instead of 7 drop.

July 1, 2017 10:36 a.m.

@divinagon oh lol actually the categories are automatically created by TappedOut when i click on sort by cmc. even on the graph on the right it's like that unfortunately

July 1, 2017 11:57 a.m.

divinagon says... #5

Ah. I thought you had set it up customary the whole time lol. Guess you only just changed it. Still think it's a great deck.

July 1, 2017 12:40 p.m.

Thanks a lot. Yeah I decided to change to custom to correctly portray that cards cmc, adds to the overall presentation of the deck

July 3, 2017 3:28 a.m.

Fairmount says... #7

You should call it 'A small spark vs a great forest'

July 7, 2017 11:48 a.m.

How do u like the new title :)

July 8, 2017 12:53 a.m.

Fairmount says... #9

I dig I dig

July 9, 2017 4:26 p.m.

I like this list very much, though I firmly believe Abrade is far better than fiery impulse. Realistically all impulse has over abrade is that it's 1 mana cheaper, but mainboard hate against any deck utilizing vehicles or marvel, in my opinion is worth the extra mana.

August 5, 2017 2:41 a.m.

@leviathan_cross thanks for the suggestion. Abrade can be considered, but I already run the highly efficient Kolaghan's Command as mainboard artifact hate, and Fiery Impulse is good simply because it has a 1 cmc. In most cases it is 3 damage (like Abrade), and I need a 1-drop in its slot anyway to be returned by Seasons Past.

August 5, 2017 8:42 a.m.

Cabaye21 says... #12

This deck is awesome!!

September 21, 2017 5:17 p.m.

Michael999 says... #13

First off, love to see someone else in the Frontier community trying to build a seasons past deck, it is my pet card and the innovation around this card has been pretty much non-existent if you want something somewhat playable competitively. So in my mind, you're already off to a great start. But, while I will be your biggest fan in that sense, I am going to play devil's advocate.

When I say I have done my testing, I mean I have done A LOT of testing. I have tried Junk, Jund, and BUG (I have come back to it in the past day and will let you know if you wish on how it is going. At this point in time the list is quite rough to say the least).

Jund has a lot of things going for it as burn is highly underrated in the frontier format and cards like Abrade and especially Kolaghan's Command (did someone say 2 for 1?) are very powerful spells. I have played a deck similar to this with a different removal suit, no chandra or wayfinder, and some different creatures which I now realize were probably less than optimal. Additionally, I have realized the way I thought of building this deck, which now coincides with deck, now makes my previous decks practically obsolete.

With that large note out of the way, I find this build to be not good enough. First, a little knit pick-y thing that always bugs me whenever I see a seasons past deck is that the optimal petition to past ratio is always 4 dark petition 1 past and 1 past sb for the control decks to protect you from their counters. There is no real good way to use seasons past before land drop 7 while dark petition is much more versatile and you can find w/e you want whenever you need it a lot more useful. Secondly, this deck is going to get kicked while it's on the ground because frankly it's very inconsistent. What I have found through my long testing process is that seasons past CANNOT be your win con and lord knows that 3 kalitas, 1 chandra, and 2 liliana are definitely not going to win you the game.

My newest approach is basically saying: Here I need to make a 55 card deck that is able to utilize seasons past as its "oomph" to push it past late game, but even if you don't see a seasons past or if you just dark petition for a removal spell, you will still win the game. This deck just does not do this. More specifically, if you satyr wayfinder or chandra (neither of these cards I play for this reason) just so happen to mill/exile the seasons past, you are absolutely loosing this game - there is no way for you to realistically win the game as your opponent unlike you has all the pieces to win the game while you might be able to fend off some scrapheap scroungers for only so long. While this is the main issue, a couple other problems I see are:

1) What is Dragonlord Atarka doing in your sb? This is a deck that should be able to win the long game with your looping so another reactionary spell like this, which also costs a ton of mana, is a waste of space in your sb.

2)Infinite Obliteration, while at the time in standard was your only option did the job, we now have much better deck exile spells. I recommend 1 Lost legacy to get any emrakuls or Saheeli's etc. and 1 Dispossess to get Marvels or gearhulks

3) Never // Return is this deck's premium removal in 3 fold (so I suggest at least two): A) it's going to be able to kill anything except a scissor or ulamog B) You can exile any pesky card in the opponent's GY like Worldbreaker, or the annoying scrounger a.k.a. the bane of any attrition-style deck and my favorite C) the cmc is 7 so that just gives seasons past yet another mana cost to capitalize while still being able to recur another 3 drop which this deck definitely uses a lot of (Also this should go without saying: Runious Path was good, Never // Return is strictly better so...yeah)

4) I think there is a lack of flip nissas in this deck. From the builds I have played a 2 of Nissa with 3 forests are very good as this deck t3 or t4 loves a good ol' borderland ranger and lategame it's another wincon/draw engine that makes a body

Finally, as a deck builder of the deck I leave you off with some questions cause it's hard to get deck help about this deck with others as without knowing how this deck plays out, it's hard to really be able to give solid advice of the deck.

1) What is your opinion on discard maindeck vs. sideboard I've played as much as 5 discard spells main board (3 duress 2 Transgress the Mind) and 2 sideboard (2 collective brutality) and now trying a much lighter amount (1 duress 1 collective brutality mainboard) and I'm not exactly sure what is correct...Thoughts?

2) Have you tried mainboard exile effects like infinate obliteration? I have tried both and I'm not exactly sure where I am (i.e. 1 lost legacy mainboard 1 disposses sideboard vs. both in sideboard). What's your opinion on this?

3)What's your thoughts on Emrakul? I have no idea if this deck needs him as a way to say: You have offically lost or if he's irrelevant b/c seasons past is enough to get the win

4) How does the deck do with only kalitas as its only way to gain life. When I've played with this deck orignally kept finkle's Nissa's Renewal (and a ton of basics) as the 7 life was a tremendous way to close out a game and a highly productive thing to do t6. What's your thoughts on that?

5) How do you deal with enchantments? I know fervered visions isn't exactly a mainstay in this meta, but there are others like scissors and when that's enchanted to an indestructible land, how do you win? My answers have always been naturalize but that card is so underwelming

6)Radient flames vs. Sweltering Suns: I know it is RR, but I have found that even as a sb card, the cycling is relevant as a way to turn on a spell mastery or two which has been the reason I've won games. Just a thought.

Well I have either been extremely annoying or hopefully slightly insightful and I would love to exchange thoughts on this deck. Additionally, I would love to know how your deck works vs. certain meta match ups especially the artifact aggro variantsYour friend,-Michael

P.S. sorry for writing this much...looking at the preview of this comment is scary

October 16, 2017 3:24 a.m.

Michael999 says... #14

One thing that I also managed to forget is another small thing I think is definitly something you may have overlooked: Urborg. This card is great as it's a mana fixer and makes fetch lands tap for mana which is good against aggro decks where that lightning bolt of damage caused by lands are relevant or when you get to the later stages of the game where you simply run out of targets for fetches. The downside of sometimes helping your opponent is not a big enough deal to warrant not playing it

October 16, 2017 3:52 a.m.

@Michael999

thanks a lot for your in-depth comment.

first off, I should REALLY update this list, because I've gone through even more testing and settled at a slightly different 75. Most notably, 2nd mainboard past is gone, as is dragonlord atarka.

So far, a 1/1 emrakul split has seemed good, although I haven't had much of a chance to rigorously test this ratio. However, my favorite recent addition to the deck (which is undocumented in this list) is Vraska's Contempt. this card can deal with indestructible creatures (like the Ensoul Artifact onto Darksteel Citadel which you mentioned, Rhonas the Indomitable, and more), as well as pretty much any other threat our opponents throw at us. the life gain helps a bit too.

I love the flip nissa suggestion (I don't remember why I digressed from it early in testing...should really try it again). nissa's renewal has been very underwhelming in my testing, and I found that sticking a kalitas gave me enough life gain to win against aggro decks.

thanks again for you suggestions! (I know I haven't addressed all of them, but I promise that I read them!) I'll certainly keep them in mind as I continue to improve the deck.

October 16, 2017 9:29 p.m.

Michael999 says... #16

If you ever want, I would love to test with you on the different versions of this deck. I currently play frontier on cockatrice as there is a decent sized community that plays competitive in the format on it. We even have a tournament going on and it's nice as everyone ends up playing different decks and this ends up making a very diverse format which I like. If you decide to try cockatrice (it's free so there's really no reason not to :) ) let me know and maybe we could exchange ideas!

Good luck on this deck because I know as much as you do that this is not an easy deck to create successfully!

-Michael

October 17, 2017 12:10 a.m.

Thanks man, appreciate the offer.

I'm actually part of the Untap Open League, which hosts a frontier tournament every month or so on Untap.in. Not sure about Cockatrice (I don't have the time, sadly), but thanks again.

October 17, 2017 5:38 p.m.

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