Hey man nice list but why arent you running staff of domination? it enables so many combos. and karn silver golem and voltaic construct are both must haves for a deck with this many artifacts. and why not run shimmer myr and a few other lands like scorched ruins and glacial chasm? i also cant help but notice you arent running candelebra of tawnos or mycosynth lattice, darksteel forge?? Its a nice list man but i dont honestly think its as optimized as you think?

like karn with voltaic construct and any rock that taps for 3 is infinite mana.

metal worker and voltaic construct with 2 artifacts in hand is infinite mana.

metal worker and staff of domination with 3 artifacts in hand is infinite mana, life and card draw.

karn silver golem, voltaic construct, infinite mana with staff of nin, infinite damage.

karn silver golem, voltaic construct, infinite mana, planar portal= infinite card selection, and if you have shimmer myr it means you can cast your deck at instant speed in response to anything.

cloud key, alhhammerets archive and senseis divining top is infinite card draw/ selection.

krark clan ironworks, nims deathmantle wurmcoil engine is infinite wurms.

myr battlesphere with infinite mana and infinite un taps with trading post is infinite life, card draw and creatures.

Karn with infinite mana with staff of domination is infinite untap effects.

basalt monolith with rings of brighthearth infinite mana.

basalt monolith with rings of brighthearth and clock of omens and voltaic key is infinite untap effects.

Karn with voltaic construct, infinite mana is also infinite untaps.

Doubling cube past a certain point, with staff of domination and clock of omens plus 1 artifact creature is infinite mana.

mycosynth lattice with darksteel forge and nevirinyalls disk = destroy all permanents but yours.

mycosynth lattice with karn silver golem= blow up lands for 1 mana.

there are literally tons more but its 1am in the morning where i am. (Australia) and im pretty tired.

Im also surprised you dont run more Ramp lands. like the tron lands. the cloudpost lands. scorched ruins. deserted temple. lotus vale. city of traitors.

I also think that oblivion sower. mage ring network and burnished heart/ solemn are a waste of time. i get that they are good cards but why give up the slots that you could be playing better lands in? i only run 2 wastes. for things like path and ghost quarter.

why no null brooch? or scroll rack?

Like i really do like your list and its admirable that your trying to be a fairer player, but saying that Kozilek or karn are tier 3 and then saying that your deck list is optimized is a bit far off the mark in my opinion.

And hows ugins nexus? without prototype portal to go infinite with it i imagine its a little lack luster? but i havent used it so please give me some insight on how useful it is?

No akromas memorial either?

why no tower of fortunes?

we always end up with tons of mana so why not put it in as a mana sink that draws you four cards? tower of fortunes with rings of brighthearth + 10 mana = draw 8 cards?

also why no cloud key?

Also sorry for all the messages but its late im tired and have a little too much energy for some reason?

also have you ever hit an opponent for annihilator 12? with kozilek? i have it feels amazing :) rings of brighthearth with strionic resonator is sick :)

Or tower of fortunes + Karn silver golem + Voltaic Construct + infinite mana = infinite card draw? :)

I have already tried many of the cards you mentionned above. This is not intended to be a combo deck, hence why I am not running all the combo cards you listed. Most of them are also useless outside of combo: for example, Voltaic Construct alone would not be that great, it would need Karn and a rock, making it a 3 cards combo, which I am not a big fan of. Secondly, to include most of the cards you mentionned, I would have to cut what is already in the deck, and a lot of rocks, and that would loose me the consistency I get with this deck.

For cards like Akroma's Memorial, it was cut after the mulligan change. Yes it was good, but having too many high CMC cards in the deck was leading me into horrible opening hands, with 3 or more cards I could do nothing with early... Cutting them was hard, but it improved the overall speed and consistency of the deck.

For Wastes and their ramp package (Solemn, Burnished and Bauble), since I included them, it greatly helped me with the speed (see above), and they are additional sources of ramp. In my meta, there is a lot of non-basic land destruciton (Ruination and friends), so having access to basics is essential for me.

I just don't think combo is the way to build Kozilek... I am doing a Karn deck atm, and I will use the combos you listed above as a reference to help me for it, because it is going to be a deck full of infinite combos. I just feel like Kozilek is stronger without all the combos. I am already running some, and I can already win with them, I don't feel like I need additional ones.

Thats fair enough but thats just a matter of preference. not optimization?

Yeah, maybe you're right and I just like my deck too much and call it optimized ;)

But I am using your suggestions for the karn deck I am building, and the idea will be to have more combos available than there are cards in the deck (even if it is impossible, the idea is to jam in as most overlapping combos as possible). Check it out (far from finished!!!!)!

[Primer] Karn, Silver Golem

Commander / EDH* thegigibeast

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i was play testing your deck and i acheived infinite mana and drew your entire deck with kozilek and ashnods altar with strionic resonator and you didnt have any combos or ways of winninf on that turn? you should definitely atleast add akromas memorial?

also voltaic construct by itself is far from useless. after playing your deck im sorry to inform you but i think its quite a casual list and far from what i consider optimized.

the only way i found of winning on the turn i gained infinite mana and drew your deck was to win with basalt monolith + rings of brighthearth + voltaic key + staff of nin for infinite damage.

like with out a way of giving all your creatures haste or using an obscure infinite combo to win then how do you win when you get infinite mana?

I promise im not trying to be nasty or anything its just ive run this general for years and have spent thousands on my deck and i crush like every deck in my meta unless i get very unlucky because i normally go infinite by turn 3-4 sometimes even turn 2?

and for some reason you have him and karn tiered as tier 3? colorless decks when built around combos are brutal, you never have to worry about colored mana and you can accelerate faster then any other type of deck. coupled with the fact that i have so many ways of gaining infinite mana and the fact that i run lots of infinite draw combos means i normally end up with infinite card selection very early every single game (which means i have access to atleast 20 different combos) how are normal decks supposed to win through that? even most tier 1 decks cant. with colorless artifact decks you can literally get to the point where you can go infinite in response to anything and still win anyway.

Yep I do have many infinite combos, we just need to be creative. For exmaple, with infinite mana and the entire deck on the battlefield, Staff of Nin + Rings of Brighthearth + Voltaic Key would be infinite damage. There are many others like this so I won't list them all, but it is quite easy to kill once the entire deck is played.

Paradox engine and stroionic resonator go infinite with any mana rock that makes at least 3 mana

Also magistrates scepter for infinite turns

El_Rey1570 Magistrates scepter is banned.

I have a commander deck very similar to this one except the commander is Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger. I've been searching for another eldrazi commander deck for 2 years and here it is! We need more of these +1

Hall of the Bandit Lord is a really good card to consider, its a tap land but giving koz or any eldrazi haste is so powerful it is usually worth playing