I had considered Debt of Loyalty, but was worried about how conditional it is. I went for the red Threaten effects instead. If I had one, I would trial it, but I don't. Maybe I will look for one to pick up, because it may be great, especially with all the death touch creatures in the deck. Thanks for the suggestion.

Love the deck and the primer, inspiring me to build around her.

Really love this deck and your primer explaining it-- I've wanted to build Queen Marchesa for a while and was about to build a really nasty stax deck with her, but came across this and loved the idea of controlling the game without making everyone hate me, you know?

I've just now posted my work in progress that was inspired by your primer and I like how it looks so far, but I'm a little stuck and unsure what to remove to be able to fit the rest of my lands in, and what cards in my maybeboard would be valid to try mainboard, too (there are explanations on my thoughts on those in the description). If you would not mind, could you provide your insight on it? I'd really appreciate it, because I'm kind of stuck, I think.

Olivia Voldaren could be a good inclusion here. She draws hate away from your commander, she's a threat but not an active threat unless you want her to be, and she can steal creatures.

couple her with a Basilisk Collar and hot diggity. You have some other synergies that could help that too... they get a little comboey but the collar and Darksteel Plate could go on a few of your creatures. An indestructible High Priest of Penance pinged by lady voldaren...?

Then again that may be too aggressive for what this deck is trying to do.

precociousapprentice, I am wondering what you think of these new cards from Commander 2017:

Stalking Leonin

Disrupt Decorum

Teferi's Protection

I am considering them all as they are all political/pillow fort

Teferi's Protection seems like a card that would fit well in pretty much any white deck in general, especially something like this. I won't say no to putting it in mine.

Disrupt Decorum seems like it was made for this deck

Come to think of it, that new Mathas, Fiend Seeker looks really interesting too, as a card that encourages opponents to use resources to kill other opponents' creatures (and in fact, could be a great alternate aikido commander if you want a break from Marchesa.

MatsuriFramboise, I am considering using Mathas in the deck too :)

Hey, I've been out of commission for a couple of weeks camping. Good for the soul, but it has definitely kept me from responding to comments.

As for C17 cards to consider:

Stalking Leonin looks to be interesting, but I feel like it would be too soft of a deterrent. I am not sure what the psychological effect of the threat of a possible retribution would be, but I am afraid it would be much less than an assured retribution. I would love to hear about your experience with it though, MegaMatt13.

Disrupt Decorum will definitely be a card I trial, possibly in a Threaten effect slot. This will be a massive board state disrupter, if nothing else, and could enhance my general strategy. I may find it a little too disruptive, though, and it may disrupt my general plan of allowing each players' deck to accomplish my goal of winning. I often find that forcing things with this deck end up with less than optimal results. We shall see.

Teferi's Protection has a home in this deck, I just have to figure out where to fit it. This is a definite. Amazing protection. Potentially the most powerful Fog effect ever printed. Sort of combines the boardstate protection of Boros Charm with everything Dawn Charm does, only better. It artfully combats board wipes, it is an asymmetric Fog for you alone for every turn until your next, and it can keep you out of the fray for a setup round before a big game ending attack of your own.

Mathas, Fiend Seeker is a card that will likely be antisynergistic with the deck, similar to wrath effects. I want them to keep their stuff, just point it away from me. Definitely not a viable replacement for Queen Marchesa as commander. An interesting commander in it's own right, and would even play well with many of the cards in this list, but with a different battle plan. I don't plan to include it.

Curse of Opulence is a really interesting card that may find a home in the deck. It combines ramp with encouraging people to aim threats elsewhere. With a CMC of , it fits the low curve nicely. I imagine Curse of Opulence could have a similar effect on opponent choices as Duelist's Heritage, but with the added effect of ramping me as opposed to just beating down my opponents. I definitely want to trial this card. The talk on the usual forums makes this card seem worthless and a sign of casual play, which is perfectly in line with the goals of the deck.

The last thing I was thinking about is inclusion of Gisela, Blade of Goldnight. She comes down super late, but she makes the world a much more dangerous place for every other player, and a safer place for me. She does paint a target on me, but I would hope that I have the game relatively secure by the time she comes down. She makes all of my symmetric effects very asymmetrical. On her own, she is a powerhouse wincon. I have been resisting, but I think that many reasonable voices are convincing me to at least trial her. She will replace Gisela, Broken Blade as a more effective wincon.

precociousapprentice, my experience with Gisela has been quite positive. I briefly cut her from the deck to try out other cards and found that I missed her. You're right in that she is most effective after you have made yourself relatively secure... Definitely not as soon as you hit 7 mana.

I'm definitely adding Teferi's protection. As you say... Possibly best fog ever. It's price is spiking now but fortunately I have preordered all the decks.

I'm going to pass on stalking Leonin. After some thought I think he may just be cute. I will try him in my super casual cat deck instead.

I hear you with disrupt decorum. The forcing attack cards usually end up backfiring. However this one seems relatively safe unless players hold on to a resentment in future turns for forcing their hand previously. It's worth a try.

Your thoughts regarding curse of bounty are interesting. It is definitely a subtle political card. Is one gold token enough of an incentive to encourage people to attack? Could the person who is cursed resent you enough to throw everything at you?

I guess I will see about Curse of Opulence. I had the same thought regarding resentment, but I feel like it is worth a try. A single gold is a small bounty, but when I am sitting behind my fortress, it may be just the reward needed to make people attack the way I want. It could be an "attack over here" card more than a "don't attack me" card. Early game, that single gold may be what people need, and may be a bigger incentive than it appears.

Maybe I don't quite understand since I'm still learning this style of play, but what would make Curse of Opulence okay while Mathas, Fiend Seeker not okay? They both say "hey, aim your resources somewhere else"-- is it because the Curse specifies attacking the opponent while Mathas encourages killing problematic creatures?

MatsuriFramboise, for me it's because Mathas rewards your opponents with card draw which is a lot more powerful than a one-time use gold token. Yes, you draw a card too but so do 2 of your opponents...that can be risky.

It's also because I want my opponents' creatures to kill my opponents for me. Mathas is counter to that.

That's a fair point (and honestly, the notions of opponents killing opponents makes Disrupt Decorum all the more exciting for me and an auto-include once it's in my hands). I also feel that Teferi's Protection just straight up replaces Dawn Charm in the long run and will be swapping them.

Dawn Charm would seem the logical straight replacement, but I am not sure if is the right one. It is truly inferior, on almost every front, but that does not mean that there aren't better choices for removal. I am still considering, and Dawn Charm is likely to stay.

I think I need to give a better description on the entire raison d'etre for this deck. Using my opponents to forward my game plan is subtle, but central to everything in this deck.

I do understand that (and draw quite a bit of inspiration in my deck from yours in that I used it as a template and am working on my own personal tweaks as time goes on)-- but I'm quite admittedly less experienced on how to truly make it work (and advice would be more than welcome). I've had the opportunity to play it a little (and even won once with it) and like how it feels, and I have some considerations for more tweaks of my own in the coming future as I acquire more cards for it. Removing cards truly seems to be very difficult. It took me forever to finally prune down my deck enough so that it was 100 cards.

Yeah I guess you can describe it as carrot and stick- motivate your enemies to attack each other and deter them from attacking you. Avoid cards that draw hate your way if you can, but find ways to benefit from the other action on the board. I think Ogre Slumlord and Ophiomancer are two of my favorite cards on your list as they keep reproducing goodness/defenses.

My (again, inexperienced) concern about the Ogre Slumlord is that it triggers whenever any nontoken creature dies, which means when a boardwipe happens, we get a bunch of non-deathtouch rats (unless they keep it when the slumlord dies?) that makes our board state look more threatening than we'd like it to be. Am I incorrect in that assessment?

Hey precociousapprentice,

I recently bumped into Oreskos Explorer which I'm going to test in one of my decks. Might be very close to a Gift of Estates on a stick in your list. Perhaps worth trying out sometime.

Cheers

Beebles, I have considered Oreskos Explorer before, many times, but have passed it by every time. I am not sure that it replaces Gift of Estates, even though it is a sorcery speed land draw card. I depend on Gift of Estates to curve out smoothly, or to draw me three cards to discard to one of several important cards for the deck. Give. That Oreskos Explorer does not guarantee a draw of three cards, I am not sure it is right. The body is useful at times, but I am not sure it outweighs the possible decrease in effectiveness. I should trial it anyway, since I keep coming back to it, but I anticipate that it will not replace Gift of Estates. I do appreciate the suggestion, though. Thanks.

I did some editing of the writeup, and added Hour of Revelation to the Wishboard. I have been in the middle of a move, and unable to experiment with recent changes, but others have had great success with them. I am optimistic.

Taking a look at your Ixalan thoughts...I dunno...I'm not hyped about this set at all (could be because it's coming out so soon after C17). I'm not sure that any of the cards you mention are worthy of our queen's presence. They are either very expensive CMC or are weaker versions of previously existing cards. Settle the Wreckage, for example, seems like a removal spell that could really backfire. Do I really want to be ramping an opponent that much? Time will tell but so far none of the cards are jumping out at me.

I agree completely. Somewhat underwhelmed. Not sure any of the cards will make it. The only really great thing about the set will be the reprint of the Checks. I want to get my set of foils. Now will be the time.