Queen's Mighty Servants (Superfriends, primer)
Commander / EDH
SCORE: 20 | 20 COMMENTS | 7299 VIEWS | IN 15 FOLDERS
It would definitely be in if this deck was at least a bit more sliver oriented. However, primary win con of this deck are the walkers, not the slivers. The important fact for this deck is to realize that even though there is Sliver Queen as its commander, the deck has basically nothing to do with slivers. The Queen was chosen for three major reasons:a) it has all five colorsb) It is a great body for a reasonable CMC and it offers a way how to spend any leftover mana in a reasonable manner.c) When no board clear is at the ready in any moment, the Queen and the tokens can be a very good way how to protect the walkers from creatures that would attack them.
In addition, it is a great late game tool. Many other commanders just run out of gas in the late game and the Queen provides a way how to close the game should no other, better option be available.
When I was building the deck I decided to add some utility slivers that would make tokens produced by the Queen somehow more useful, but at the same time would not necessarily require me to have an army of slivers to do something. If you take a look at the deck, you'll find you that it is quite mana heavy and therefore there is the need for mana ramp - that is the reason why mana slivers are included, as they can speed the deck up a bit and can potentially create some great synergies together with the tokens from the Queen. The Necrotic Sliver is just so good that it has to be included. The same true is for the Dormant Sliver - it is just too good with the tokens.
Also, I definitely won't add more slivers (and creatures generally) into this deck as it is in the contrary with the board clears that are present in this deck. The creature strategy and the board clears act directly opposed to each other and the deck just can't afford to have an inner conflict.
To make my point really clear, I will try to give you an outline what this deck wants to do:At any point in the game, you just want to have a land drop every single turn. This deck is at its strongest times when it has 10+ mana - should the game come to that point, you will most likely win.
Early game
You only want to ramp. Basically nothing else. My very common play is that I just use Mystical Tutor or Demonic Tutor to tutor mana ramp cards, most often Cultivate as it ramps and secures a land drop the turn after it is played.
Although I wrote above that you only want to ramp, it is not completely true. At the same time, you also want to keep the bard reasonably clear. So should the board become too crowded, just clear it. The best board is when there are no creatures on the board (with the exception of your own, of course).
Mid game
Go through the deck once again. You'll find out that most of the deck is able to provide card advantage. You usually spend quite a few resources in the early game and you definitely want to refill. So almost all the walkers give you card advantage, board clears are a form of card advantage, cards that grab cards can be considered to be a card advantage card as they can give you absolutely anything your heart desires.
In that point, you just want to grind out the game. Be the one with most resources. That is something that wins gamed of EDH.
Late game
Do anything you want. By now you should have card, the mana to cast those cards and hopefully you already have some walkers on the field. Unless something really nasty happens, you should be able to win.
Apologies for a rather long reply, but I consider this to be absolutely crucial, to understand what the deck is trying to do. Whenever I want to add a card into this deck, I always evaluate it: Does this card bring card advantage? Can this card win the game? Is this card able to keep me alive long enough? Does this card combo really well with some other cards in the deck and if so, how complicated would this combo be to set up? And finally, is this card better than other cards that are already included in the deck?
After all that was said, I believe that no only I, but now you as well can evaluate that haste slivers do not bring card advantage, they are more likely to be card disadvantage because they require a set up, cannot win the game unless a very specific combination of cards are already in my hand/field which even with all the tutors can be very hard to achieve and, they definitely would not help me to stay alive longer and lastly, they definitely are not worth adding as some more important cards would have to leave the deck. As for the Intruder Alarm, it is really nice with the mana slivers, yes, but for the same reasons as are mentioned above it won't be added to this deck.
Again, sorry for this really long reply, but I felt it was necessary so that you can fully understand my point of view.
Thank you for your suggestions, though!
June 6, 2016 12:06 p.m.
In theory it would be awesome and I would definitely add it if I didn't own the duals from the 3rd edition. Thanks to them I never ever suffer from color mana issues. So the ability of the Oath is not that relevant. And as for the "Ponder" effect: the deck is designed to have more than enough card draw so an effect like this that is not ongoing is not valuable enough and is outclassed by other cards.
Thanks for the suggestion anyway!
July 9, 2016 5:51 a.m.
I knew I would have to explain myself sooner or later as for why I don't have the Chain Veil in here.
Chain Veil is no doubt great with the walkers. To be precise, it is amazing. But, there is that BUT. I often find myself in a position where I am fighting for the board and am usually happy to have 1-2 walkers on the field, any number above these is not that common. The hate is strong from other players. So, in the past months of me playing the deck I was often thinking about the possibility of adding the Chain Veil into this deck, was considering it in different situations and the general answer was a big no. The impact of the Veil is not that huge with 1-2 walkers on the field and when I have 3+ walkers facing the opponents I am usually already winning, so the Veil would be, more than anything else, just a win-more card. In addition to this, in order to generate some sick value, the Veil should be on the board longer than just one turn and, at least in my meta, an artifact is not something that would be problematic to remove. I even tested it and it was more often in my graveyard than on the battlefield.
On the other hand, Mana Echoes is an instant game-winning card. The synergy it has together with the Queen herself is outstanding and makes it a one-card combo. If I have the Queen on the board and enough mana available, no other card but Krosan Grip can disrupt this combo once the Mana Echoes hit the field (even if they have instant enchantment removal, I can just activate Queens ability in response to the removal and proceed in making an infinite army of tokens). And, usually, an infinite amount of tokens tends to be enough to close the game. I have won more game with that combo than I can remember and in my eyes it is too good to not include it.
So, these are the reasonings behind both of these cards. If you have any further questions, go ahead and ask, I am happy to help.
July 9, 2016 6:39 a.m.
Since this is a WUBRG goodstuff deck, have you thought about running Conflux?
September 21, 2016 5:23 p.m.
I have not considered Conflux just yet, mainly because of its mana cost which is rather high. High CMC cards that I include are, usually, the ones that are able to win the game by themselves. In addition to that, this deck has a ton of card advantage already (planeswalkers, enchantments, recursion).
But I can definitely see the logic behind Conflux and I will most likely test it out.
Thanks for the suggestion and the upvote!
September 21, 2016 7:29 p.m.
@Ocelot44: I have playtested the deck with Conflux in it and it felt great. Managed to cast it on T4 into T5 win, which felt rather ridiculous. Really happy with that addition, though I may have the deck too consistent right now :D
October 12, 2016 6:42 p.m.
Have you considered some of the Kaladesh Planeswalker cards?
I would suggest Dovin Baan, although I'm not sure if you like him or not because of his ultimate. Nissa, Vital Force is one I also like.
October 28, 2016 8:23 a.m.
I actually have and I am still unsure about them. Dovin Baan is an easier one to evaluate as for his contribution for this deck. I think he is not as good as other walkers I have in since at 4 CMC I already have quite a lot of walkers and I feel like the others are a bit better.
However, Nissa, Vital Force has proved to be quite a puzzle. Her -3 is the main problem I have with her. Most of the time all I have in the graveyard are instants and sorceries and bringing back a land doesn't feel all that awesome. On the other hand, her ultimate is just ridiculous. I will probably give her a try once I get my hands on a copy. I will have to make a few changes in the deck anyway once Commander 2016 arrives as Deepglow Skate cannot miss in here.
October 28, 2016 9:23 a.m.
Well, even if you are very well against adding other sliver, I do think Harmonic Sliver should make the cut.
Besides, i think a merely two counterspells are really subpar... You don't reliably hit them and they occupy some slots they could be use for more reliable stuff.
You don't love Anguished Unmaking or Beast Within?? If you run Utter End, You should run Anguished Unmaking and Beast Within
You tell us that you like card that are useful at nearly all time but you run Mana Echoes??
If you want an easier infinite combo with pieces that are useful on their own, why not run Rings of Brighthearth + Basalt Monolith?? They don't rely on colours, cost way cheaper, are useful on their own (as a great mana rock and a ramp(with fetchlands), doubler of any activated ability you have),...
Anyway, if you want some inspiration, you can check my take on the superfriend archetype here:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/atraxa-the-anhedonist-overseer-and-the-syn/
December 6, 2016 9:47 a.m.
I will not add Harmonic Sliver. To start, its ability is not optional and it may result in me being unable to play/create another Sliver unless I destroy my own permanents, which is far from something I would like to be doing. The situation described above may not occur that much as I destroy all the creatures pretty often but that is another reason for me not to play it as it may easily be just a one-time used thing which feels pretty underwhelming.
As for the counterspells, I cannot disagree more. You probably think of them as of a tool that I use to control the game, but they are mainly used as an insurance for when I want to combo off. My playgroup runs some counterspells and some other stuff that could interrupt it and therefore the counterspells are essential.
Yes, I do run Mana Echoes. Sure, it is a card that sometimes sits in my hand, but the fact that it is a 1-card combo with my general makes it really valuable. I am even able to get it off my hand with the help of some walkers, so I am not that concerned about it. It is probably the only card that is THAT situational and therefore it is far from harmful. In addition to that, the Mana Echoes combo cannot be reliably interrupted by any other means but counter magic provided I have some spare mana. And maybe you are missing it, but not only does that combo generate infinite mana, but more importantly, it does generate an infinite number of Slivers in connection with the Queen which is something that the combo you described cannot do on its own. Sure, I could run Rings and Monolith, but there is just not enough space for these cards. I even had Rings in my deck before, but it was exactly the type of card that seemed amazing but in the end it was not (it proved to be similar to The Chain Veil) and it usually was destroyed too quickly.
And no, I will add neither Beast Within nor Anguished Unmaking. Beast Within may be able to destroy anything, but the result is that it produces a threat to the walkers I have which is less than desirable. And as for Anguished Unmaking, the life cost is just too high. Against many decks in my meta, life is the most precious resource and giving it up to save a mana is just not worth it. I tend to ramp really hard and the fact that Utter End costs 4 mana has never bothered me at all.
I have been playing this deck (obviously with some changes) for about 2 years now and most of the cards you suggested have previously been in it but were later discarded because they proved to be inefficient/problematic/not as good as was anticipated. I mention this just so that I somehow bolster my statements.
December 6, 2016 10:33 a.m.
+1 for the Queen. I've never really been fond of planeswalkers, but it's good to see Slivers doing interesting things. One suggestion I offer is maybe building out the slivers a bit more:
- Basal Sliver + Sliver Queen + Dormant Sliver = draw your whole deck
- Paradox Engine + Gemhide Sliver + Sliver Queen = another infinite combo
- Heartstone/Training Grounds = always useful, and another infinite combo once Basal Sliver and Sliver Queen hit the field.
- Ashnod's Altar = a replacement for Basal Sliver
September 21, 2017 10:29 a.m.
I can definitely see all the cards and combos you listed having a home in the deck if the amount of cards in it was not limited. However, since that limitation exists I do not see it being possible for the cards you listed to make the cut.
Should I add the cards you suggested into it I would probaly include some other cards that would reinforce that particular gameplay (more ways to utilize infinite mana, ETBs, additional creature/artifact tutors and so on) in order to make it more consistent and at that point the overall constitution of the deck would have been changed too much from what the deck was originally designed to do. The other option would be to not include the support cards for the strategy you suggested which would force me to trade some of the original game play for a part of another one, which would result in having multiple both unreliable and weaker win conditions which is also a direction I am not willing to take.
September 21, 2017 5:06 p.m.
How about the following cards?
-Mirari's Wake for genesis wave,token produced from queen etc.
-Academy Rector with many boardwipe. Made your choice for Mana Echoes , Sunbird's Invocation , Doubling Season
-Reliquary Tower synergy with Seasons Past , Conflux, Mystic Remora
-Ral Zarek I read the description already and this card made hate in the group about extra turn. IMO he can fullfill the chance to end game with doubling season and too many Enchanment,PW on the board.
January 16, 2018 2:15 a.m.
Hey, first of all, thanks for both the comment and the suggestions!
Before I explain my ideas behind the cards you suggested, I feel the need to say that for quite some time this deck has been known in my group as the deck that they need to keep in check and therefore they take their more powerful decks and as a result quite good control tools presented by numerous removal spells of all kind as well as resilient threats are present in the games.
As a consequence of that a number of things are common in games I play with this deck:
creatures with strong LTB effects are usually countered or get exiled very quickly;
a lot of artifact/enchantment removal is present and as a consequence one cannot rely on these permanents staying on the board for too long - they most commonly are destroyed before you get to untap with them;
at least one good, resilient aggro deck tends to be present at the table and one is under constant pressure.
As a result, I try to include only those cards that either have an immediate impact (on their own or if they are paired with some other card the turn they are played) or cards that affect multiple things.
Because of that reason, I don't like Mirari's Wake as it doesn't offer any advantage on the turn it is played - the card itself is so powerful that it's very unlikely to still be on the board by the time my following turn starts.
Similar reasoning can be applied to Academy Rector. Although I like the potential of the card, I not only feel like I may not be able to get advantage of its effect as it is likely to get exiled, but I also think the deck lacks an enchantment that would be good enough to grab should I not have the combo ready - because I haven't drawn it by the time its effect happened or because I don't have enough mana for the rest of the cards. This could be solved by adding Omniscience into the deck, but I feel like that addition would require an even bigger change of the deck to support this plan more but I am neither sure I want to go that route nor I think I am able to find enough place in the deck.
I like where you're going with the Reliquary Tower and I agree that its effect is quite powerful, but I'm unsure that it is powerful enough to hurt the colour consistency of the mana base as that is crucial and the idea that I lack a colour in the early game because I drew a colorless land instead of a dual land is not appealing to me.
And finally, as for Ral Zarek, even though I agree that its ultimate is fun, it goes against a rule we have in our group that says no additional turn effects shall happen during our games. With that in mind, I have to evaluate only his first two abilities that are not powerful enough to make me take something else out of the deck.
I may investigate the Academy Rector scenario again sometime in the future and may test it out, but for now, I feel like it is outshined by some other synergies.
CaptSillva says... #1
Have you considered Intruder Alarm for this deck? It can allow you to create and endless loop with your mana slivers and your queen's tokens. If you do you may want to also consider a few of the haste slivers as well Heart Sliver, Firewake Sliver, and Blur Sliver.
June 6, 2016 8:42 a.m.