RB Vampires Join the Revolt!

Standard noblevegas

SCORE: 16 | 53 COMMENTS | 7467 VIEWS | IN 7 FOLDERS


noblevegas says... #1

Well, I was able to cobble together all the items needed for FMN last weekend. Turns out, Vampires are still a thing! 3-1 for the evening.

Two matches were G/W Humans centered around Heron's Grace Champion. First time this was played I was not expecting it. Afterward, I made sure to anticipate the play. For this card alone I have given increased thought to Stromkirk Condemned. Third match was Naya Superfriends - Nissa, Voice of Zendikar, Nahiri, the Harbinger, and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar all saw some playing time against me. I suspect Chandra, Flamecaller was in the deck as well but I don't think I ever saw it. Thanks to the additional discard outlets, a suite of fliers, and some great top deck draws, The planeswalkers typically never lasted very long. The only deck I lost to was in the final round: U/W Spirits Control deck. It was very low-curved, extremely fast, and quite punishing. I'll need to figure out what to do better here.

Positives: Olivia's Dragoon saw a bit more hate than I was initially anticipating. However, if they want to spend the hate on the Dragoon instead of my later place, by all means I shall let them. Geier Reach Sanitarium's loot ability was certainly a great mide-to-late game help. I even got greedy at one point and activated it when I did not have a T4 play available. Burned out an opponent's creature on a top-decked Fiery Temper because of it. I doubt I'll ever make that choice again since it was unnecessarily risky, but it was still fun just the same. Vampire Cutthroat was also solid. I had a few games where it really created a gap and applied some pressure.

Neutral: Stromkirk Occultist still seems like a solid card, however I didn't get much playtime with it Friday. It just wasn't in the draws. When I did get it out, the triggered ability didn't always work out in my favor. Not necessarily a problem, but if the play continues it may be removed. Collective Brutality did see play in a couple games, but they typically were not for game changers or tempo advantage. I also did not get to use the Escalate cost, either. Again, I will chalk this up to not being in the draws, so we'll see if it sticks around or not.

Negatives: Since I really only played one (maybe two) new deck archetypes it's a bit tough to say there were any negatives. I didn't really notice an increase of mulligans or find a time where I was in serious trouble that I could get out of with different cards or better draws. The U/W Spirits deck was really the only downer of the night as I basically didn't stand a chance. Opponent had an answer for every play on every turn from T2 until the end. Not sure if it was just really good luck on draws, or if the deck is just that insane. Never seen anything like it from control. It would be tough to beat for almost any deck (That might be why it won the night with only one game loss in four rounds).

For now the deck will stay the same. I may run it next week at FNM again, or I may switch to my Zombies deck to see what it can do first. I just know between now and Game Day, there will be a lot of practice and work. I'll even be grinding out events at Gen Con next week.

July 25, 2016 11:56 a.m.

Chatora says... #2

Thanks for the update noblevegas. I look forward to more. I will also try to update when I have any news on my deck. Sadly I mostly play only Pre-release and Game Day events and not many FNM's.

Initial impression that I got while testing with my friend is that Stromkirk Condemned is a great addition to the deck. My vampires deck leans far more towards the mana symbol b side of the spectrum, so I can reliably produce mana symbol bmana symbol b early in most games.

I tried out Bloodhall Priest as well, and found a lot of congestion at the 3-4 drop position because of it.

Collective Brutality can sometimes miss if you can't kill a creature with -2/-2, and the opponent has no instants or sorceries in hand. But it still serves as a madness enabler, and it feels great when you get to take out one of their removal spells.

Voldaren Pariah  Flip Hasn't come out yet. I suspect that the setup cost for that card is to hard. Maybe if I sideboard in another copy along with two more Call the bloodline.

I'm not sure how your games play out, but I find myself tapped out in most situations, unless I am holding one mana and a card to use on Call the Bloodline, or one mana symbol r to use with a Fiery Temper. This means that Stromkirk Occultist will nearly never allow me to cast a card with it's triggered ability.

July 26, 2016 4:44 p.m.

noblevegas says... #3

So, I have to admit this weekend took me by a bit of a surprise. After attending the first Game Day event at my LGS and running a deck other than Vampires, I didn't think the luck would be there for Vampires in the second event. However, it was.

I won my first two matches, and while I was about to lose round 3, I was able to convince my opponent to concede the match to me. I was paired down for this round so he didn't have the math to win the event. I did and was able to convince him of giving me a shot at the top spot. He did, thankfully. I played against "Red Deck Wins" for the final round. We took it to Game 3 where my opponent came out on fire. Took me down to 2 life while I could do nothing but watch. Then the tables straight flipped. He flooded out small creature spells while my deck gave me all the answers I needed right on time.

I made some last minute tweaks to the deck before playing. First I went up to 4 Foreboding Ruins. I realized this was the only way to fix a Turn 1 Falkenrath Gorger into a Turn 2 Stromkirk Condemned. This is the only tough setup play in the deck. Also, Vampire Cutthroat was taken out. While it was a solid card, I felt it was creating muddy waters in trying to setup and develop the board state for me.

I'll post more details about the matches soon (don't have my notes in front of me right now), but needless to say Vampires came out on top.

August 15, 2016 7:28 a.m.

noblevegas says... #4

Vampires gets an update for Kaladesh.

I will be honest and say I am not sure these guys will survive the location change, but I feel like I at least have to try. We shall see what comes of all this. Let me know your thoughts and opinions on the tweaks!

September 20, 2016 9:11 a.m.

Chatora says... #5

Make Obsolete can be considered as a cheap combat trick that could help blow out their creatures.

September 21, 2016 2:49 p.m.

noblevegas says... #6

Make Obsolete would be good for the side board against token generator decks. It will likely take the spot of Nahiri's Wrath. I never found a time I was bringing Wrath in. Sinister Concoction is seen as a replacement to Ultimate Price, but having it and Lightning Axe makes answering single, large creatures a bit redundant. They are potential options for that reason. I'll keep this one in mind for sure.

September 22, 2016 12:21 p.m.

casmiel says... #7

I'm probably going to proxy up some Key to the City, as it alleviates some of our T5+ weaknesses. We get:

  1. Consistent card draw

  2. A way to break through board stalls or deal the last 3-4 points of damage before running out of juice

  3. 0-Mana discard outlet with a strong upside

It also makes Disintegration a better card. All in all, it does a lot of relevant things for us, so I want to give it a shot. As for your build, I'm quite surprised by 4 Olivia, 3 Drana and 0 Bloodhall. Your build looks more midrange-y at first, but you also run 3 Copters with Crew 1. I'll probably pack a couple of Grasp of Darkness, now that Languish rotates, we might see a lot more Selfless Spirits and Archangel Avacyn  Flips. I think it's a good idea to pack MB removal that doesn't care about indestructible and it does hit quite a lot of targets in KLD as well.

September 23, 2016 12:04 p.m.

noblevegas says... #8

casmiel, At first I was a fan Bloodhall Priest when it was spoiled. However, when I had time to review it, I found there were two problems: It had no evasion and it was basically offense-only. So, if you were behind it wasn't helping you beyond being a 4/4 body. Combine that with clogging up the 3-drop and 4-drop spots while not being comparable in play-ability and it was not a good card for this deck.

4 Olivia, Mobilized for War was because she sees a great deal of hate. Also, having 4 gives me the greatest chance of hitting her on turn 3 and brutalizing my opponent with T4 Drana, Liberator of Malakir (thus why she is 3-of), and T5 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet off Olivia's triggered ability. When that happens, the opponent has an extremely small window to recover. Combine this with my removal-heavy spells and this deck can be oppressive.

Key to the City did hit my radar as it does similar in scope to Geier Reach Sanitarium but in a more favorable order. The only issue I have with it here is where to fit it without disrupting the deck's tempo.

Grasp of Darkness is also on my radar for a return to the deck. I know I had it in SB and removed it for Sinister Concoction, but part of me has considered reversing course on that decision for similar reasons. Overall, I don't see Archangel Avacyn  Flip seeing much more play than what we had during Eldritch Moon, though. Avacyn's big play was being a one-sided boardwipe for 5 mana. At the time there wasn't much that compared. White will likely move toward straight control which means fewer creatures to trigger her. in U/W Spirits, sac-ing Selfless Spirit in response to casting the new Fumigate seems like a better play. Market seems to agree as Avacyn's value has dropped about 8% since spoilers season began for Kaladesh.

September 23, 2016 12:56 p.m.

Chatora says... #9

I will continue to follow this deck.

September 23, 2016 1:38 p.m.

casmiel says... #10

I can see why you don't like playing Bloodhall Priest... I built my Vampire deck lower to the ground than yours, trading your mid-late bombs for more early aggression. I think both directions are viable with KLD now and have their own strengths and weaknesses. I just enjoy the reach it offers, the ability to ping face and planeswalkers as well feels good. Haste-ing out a Bloodhall Priest on Hellbent with Olivia just feels really, really good. It's a good one to play when my 1-2CMC creatures are losing steam.

I like your T3-5 plans, but I'd still be worried about having 2 of those Legs in my starting hand. 3 Olivia seem fine to me, I'd only play 4 of a Legendary if the card is absolutely vital for the deck to work or involved in a major combo... which didn't seem right to me in my build.

I'd play the key as soon as the unblockable gets relevant or I get flooded with Mana. It's also an option if you don't have a T2 Dragoon or no double-black for Condemned. I'm not saying it is a must have in the deck, but I didn't really have a lot of chances to play or see it in action, and on paper it seems pretty decent. It also survives Fumigates along with your Copters and gives you the ability to quickly rebuild.

I think the KLD Meta is still very unclear. Avacyn certainly got a power-up with the removal of Languish... and I wouldn't trust those pre-set price swings, look at what happened to Gisela prices after release. I think it is still pretty early to make a call on the meta, but Grasp will definitely stay top tier removal, as it hits everything relevant (Vehicles, Indestructible) but hexproof.

I think we can agree that Vampires gained a lot from KLD and rotation overall though!

September 23, 2016 3:24 p.m.

noblevegas says... #11

After playing a pair of prereleases this weekend (4-0, 1st out of 42 and 2-2, 16th out of 33), I stumbled upon Key to the City as an potential surprise for Vampires. I expected this card to be a playable card for the Kaladesh format, but, after seeing it work this weekend, I became extremely curious as to it's playability with Vampires.
Basically, I realized this was a "strictly better" version of Geier Reach Sanitarium:
Discard outlet for Madness without the mana cost
Optional card draw - something this deck has always needed
No loot advantage potential for opponent

So, I'm placed this in the MB and moved Harsh Scrutiny to the SB. Sinister Concoction has been dropped entirely. I'm looking at the idea of this being an aggro removal deck that pivots to hand disruption for decks with more narrow lines for bigger creatures.

September 25, 2016 12:58 a.m.

noblevegas says... #12

Adding Key to the City has me a bit worried I might be light on removal (only 7 "good" pieces - 9 total). So, with that in mind I took a look back over the new standard to see what can be useful.

Avacyn's Judgment is back on the radar. Eldritch Moon brought around more discard outlets making the madness a bit more relevant and reliable. So, it's been added to the Maybe pile.

Burn from Within and Grasp of Darkness were ideas at one time and even saw SB play but ultimately were removed since they had little upside. They probably still has little upside but with the loss of some premium removal to rotation, it's always good to review options.

Incendiary Flow is a early-game option. It does work against the triggered ability for Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet but it's a 2-drop spell that will hit most creatures. Downside is also the fact it's a Sorcery.

Tears of Valakut has always been on my radar but simply was not played since the number of fliers in Standard was fairly low. However, with the visit to Kaladesh comes quite a few new fliers that have Standard relevance. Overall, in standard the only relevant fliers that Tears cant take down on its own are the new Leviathan, Emrakul, Bruna, Brisela, and Ormendahl. There are other creatures that Tears would miss but they are very unlikely to see play.

Not sure what the plan is at this point for these cards. I need to see what the new meta holds first. For now, it is likely I will actually play Draft tonight at FNM for Release Day instead of Standard, but we shall see what holds for the evening.

September 30, 2016 2:14 p.m.

noblevegas says... #13

So, here are the early results for RB Vampires with Kaladesh:First FNM was 3-1. Largely they seem to still be a success...for now.

The only real factor was being unable to pull enough Key to the Citys to play them. So, instead I ran Avacyn's Judgment in the mainboard. I also included Grasp of Darkness in the SB over Lost Legacy for the same reason.

Match 1 was against a budget BW deck. Played it before and the only issue I had here was getting to Red mana. I attribute this mostly to just being luck of the draw as it smoothed out through the rest of the night. However, I will look at any need for adjustment just in case. 2-1 win (Game 2 I bricked hard on the missing red and it cost me).

Match 2 was against a GW Tokens deck. I was able to keep up the aggro well enough to keep my opponent off his game, answering his threats with removal as soon as I could get it. I made sure to balance straight removal (Unlicensed Disintegration) for larger creatures and using items like Avacyn's Judgment to take on multiple smaller ones. 2-0

Match 3 was my only loss of the night against a UW Control deck. The classic control of counterspells and boardwipes overwhelmed me here. I got my opponent down to 4 and 6 in Games 1 and 2 respectively, but was locked out by then and could not come back. I'll have to look this one over to see what can be done to meet this challenge a bit better.

Match 4 was against an experimental deck revolving around Eldrazi Displacer, Gonti, Lord of Luxury, and the latter's ability to steal cards from your opponent and use it against them. It looks like this needs work as it was a bit awkward. 2-1. Only loss came to the Eldrazi Displacer, Brood Monitor and Pious Evangel  Flip infinite life combo.

Overall the deck played smoothly, and performed well. Can't wait to see what else it can do with some of the variants above in mind.

October 3, 2016 4:29 p.m.

noblevegas says... #14

Well, as I suspected, Innistrad's Vampires were not up to par with the brightness of Kaladesh. I made a complete Sideboard overhaul before the most recent FNM to convert the deck from an aggro, burn-based deck to a more mid-ranged hand attack deck. This was helpful against other more aggressive decks as well as control. I increased the land to 24 because of fixing issues I have been having. Mostly this seems to have abated.

The deck still played strong at FNM with only one match suffering from bad draws (G2 I Kept 6: 3 lands - 1 dual - with T2, T3, and T4 creatures. I then drew no lands, all Kalitas copies and both Pariah copies - not even a discard outlet could be had. G3 was a mull to 4 with 2 lands, 1 Olivia, and 1 Harness Lightning. No land until T6. I played 3 cards total. Insanely bad luck).

At Game Day, the deck bricked for the first two matches (Against the eventual 1st and 3rd place decks, so it's not likely I would have wont had it played out correctly anyway), but I recovered for a respectable 2-2 finish. Entertainingly, before the final round I had a OMW% of more than 70%. 7% higher than the next player ranked by this statistic. So, the odds were not really in my favor.

Overall, I have thoroughly enjoyed the Vampires. They will get a nice vacation to do as they please while I have fun experimenting with other deck ideas and getting some time in limited formats. I will hold out hope that something else new comes about for Aether Revolt and the Amonkhet block, but I suspect it may be time to retire the vampires before long.

Since the start, the deck has been amzing in performance. It's lifetime record is now 48-21-1 (68.6 MW%) which is pretty darn incredible for an essential home brew. Thanks to all here who helped make it what it is! Here's hoping for one last hurrah in the future!

October 24, 2016 11:10 a.m.

Chatora says... #15

I really enjoyed your deck and your regular feedback. I will follow your future decks to see if there is anything I like.

I have since gone off B/R Madness Vampires and I have been playing W/B Control ever since Lukas Blohan won the previous Pro Tour with it. Playing my own version of the deck, post-rotation.

October 24, 2016 2:39 p.m.

noblevegas says... #16

Well thanks for the follow and the feedback too. Admittedly I am not all that great at deck-building. This is only the 2nd deck I have build to hold such success. The previous being a green ramp deck after the release of Khans of Tarkir I called Flying Hydras. I am playing some net decks for now to get a better feel of Kaladesh. I suspect I will have new deck ideas when Aether Revolt comes out. Holidays get busy for me so I won't have a lot of time for new brew testing.

October 24, 2016 8:38 p.m.

noblevegas says... #17

They're ba-a-ack! Vampires seem to gain a small boost and so they join the revolt on Kaladesh!

January 11, 2017 12:36 p.m.

Chatora says... #18

January 12, 2017 8:54 a.m.

noblevegas says... #19

Chatora, no. Don't get me wrong I was excited at the prospect of a vampire on Kaladesh. However Yahenni doesn't synergize well with the deck.

Its first ability won't work while Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet is on the battlefield.

The second ability would only feed off Kalitas' zombies and they are better spent on Kalitas' ability instead.

It lacks evasion like flying you would hope for. It's own expertise card kills it on curve.

It just doesn't fit here; better suited for a control-type deck instead.

January 12, 2017 6:30 p.m.

Was looking to polish up my pre-kaladesh vampires and found your deck, it's quite interesting. So few questions on card selection since you seem to have quite a lot of experience piloting it:

  1. I immediately thought Fatal Push for this deck when I saw it, but wondering if you have enough revolt triggers. Surprised to see you're not running either Indulgent Aristocrat and especially Insolent Neonate.
  2. Heir of Falkenrath  Flip was one of my favorite cards before and a good aggro + madness enabler. I understand while copter was legal it was basically strictly better, I'm thinking of trying to work in maybe in place of 4th copy of olivia and 3 of drana plus the Yahenni's wipe I'm not that crazy about in this shell. Also helps reduce curve a bit. Also I like idea of having a potential turn 4 synergy off of olivia into heir + stromkirk (see below). Thoughts?
  3. Surprised to see number of people using Asylum Visitor over Stromkirk Occultist. Visitor is only potentially better when trying to either play out turn two or when hellbent. It's weaker, can't push over weenies and is less reliable card "draw". Mimic I see as the ideal turn two play and a turn three stromkirk after mimic is better than visitor as well.
  4. How good is Falkenrath Gorger in this shell? Pre kaladesh he always felt weak but I can see how Key to the City really makes him better both letting him get through and reliable madness enabler for the turn three drops. With Fatal Push inclined to try Insolent Neonate at the 1 slot but I can see gorger being pretty good now.
  5. For Voldaren Pariah  Flip how often do you get mana screwed being able to madness her out? And how often do you actually use her flip ability? I can see the synergy with kalitas definately and she does seem to fit over the Bloodhall Priest I used to use in more aggro/hellbent strategy. She also seems to get bumped up from mimic (though a 5/5 priest is also quite good) and fact her true cost puts her out of push range. I figure the evolving wilds probably helps get the 3rd black by at least turn 4, curious what your testing how shown or if you actually hold her back till late to use as boardwipe anyway.
  6. Whats the best and worst matchups for this deck? Obviously keeping in mind new set and bannings :)

Btw I agree on not using Yahenni, Undying Partisan I'm thinking of trying him in a counters/aristocrats shell instead where he seems to fit better. He could maybe be a sideboard slot if there were matchups where he fit better than kalitas and espescially where indestructible is big. He feels overcosted for this deck.

January 13, 2017 11:54 a.m.

noblevegas says... #21

RecklessReanimator:

1. Between the 4 Evolving Wilds, the activated abilities for Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet and Voldaren Pariah  Flip, and the 12 creatures that will come in at base-1 toughness, I feel there should be plenty of chances for Revolt to be achieved. It shouldn't take much.

2. Heir of Falkenrath  Flip is definitely still good, especially if you are still more focused on hard Madness enabling. For my deck, I only have Fiery Temper, Asylum Visitor, and Voldaren Pariah  Flip as hard Madness cards. The rest require Falkenrath Gorger to be on the battlefield first, so I am taking a more slightly balanced approach in favor of big-creature support.

3. I have played Stromkirk Occultist in the past and found that it doesn't work in aggro. When you move into a longer game and have a larger land base it becomes better. Before Turn 5 an exiled card in an aggro build likely is a land (potentially disrupting land drops) or a card that isn't playable yet (22 cards for CMC 2 or 3 and less mana-efficient since exiled cards can't be cast for Madness). On curve (whether for Madness cost or otherwise) Occultist disrupts its owner's aggro tempo. I prefer Kalitas or Pariah as they are Aggro finishers; more threatening to the board state and require an answer almost immediately.

4. Falkenrath Gorger is still very good when paired with Olivia, Mobilized for War. Olivia's triggered ability allows you to play and hasten/pump multiple vampires, forcing opponents to have more answers more quickly when you can stick to your curve. If fix my curve to hit my designed play:
T1 Gorger
Turn 2 Mimic declaring Vampires
Turn 3 Olivia as a 4/4
Turn 4 Drana as a 4/5 with haste (and a Temper to the face if available)
Turn 5 Leathal or Kalitas as a 5/6 (with another burn spell)
Even without the burn it's still lethal in the air on Turn 5 through Olivia and Drana alone. You'd be surprised how often I can do much of this. It is quite reliable. Neonate certainly helps the Revolt mechanic, and my build here will always consider it as I make tweaks to the deck down the road. I always look back at cards I have previously dismissed when making fixes.

5. Voldaren Pariah  Flip hasn't been too difficult to fix for Madness based on how I use her. Turn 3 Madness is certainly hard but I like to hold her for when her activated ability can immediately go off and either swing the tempo back my way or severely disrupt my opponent's board state. Overall, she is here to keep Tempo-Control and Midrange matchups in check. I have looked for ideas to replace her to really speed up the aggro (see bottom).

6. Best matchups are still counter-spell-based control and most other aggro. Some midrange decks are possible depending on what the early game is like. If you can hit the curve and keep a good tempo going, these won't have time to setup much in the way of a response. You'll out-pace the control type and your removal should keep you ahead of aggro or at least face-to-face with it, but the latter all comes down to tempo and better card draw. Worst matchups are midrange, energy and tempo-based control (U/W Flash or Spirits). Anything that can out-pace you buy enough time to get into a late game means you have the disadvantage and need to close quickly. Without much card draw here, the odds are against you. Decks that disrupt your tempo will also typically be bouncing the core of Olivia, Drana, and Kalitas. Olivia is the pivot point: if she goes you just lost a couple turns of advantage. This is why I run a full playset even though she is Legendary. In a game where I am ahead I can pitch the extra copies to enable the battlefield version's triggered ability. In a game where I am behind I can try to keep the dispruption minimal.

I actually pulled Yahenni, Undying Partisan as my Prerelease promo at my LGS's Midnight event this morning as well as Yahenni's Expertise in a pack. Along with plenty of other Aetherborn and some minor support I ended up R/B and found I may be discounting it a bit too soon. While its triggered ability does not work well in concert with Kalitas, her activated ability was very strong. I never got to play Expertise into Yahenni itself, but the potential value has some quality upside. I hadn't fully realized that while Yahenni may die to its own Expertise card separately, if you make it the free card you cast, you have a very solid position since the -3/-3 is applied before she ETBs. If your curve-out pumps allowed Olivia and Drana to be above 3 toughness, you could potentially one-side board wipe for lethal. I may revisit my decision here as a way to go, and at that point, Yahenni would be a very strong candidate to be played.

January 14, 2017 9 a.m.

noblevegas

Thanks for taking the time to answer all my questions. I agree with most of your points, gonna elaborate on few. So I have done some quick deck testing in golgari with push and I found on average draw getting auto revolt isn't as easy/often as one would think if relying largely on cards like Evolving Wilds. I hadn't really thought much of how Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet can trigger (used to seeing him played in modern and usually nothing to sac if opponent is smart). However, both he and pariah are late game plays so won't necessarily be up till turn 5 or 6 with revolt. Since this is aggro and have other instant spell cards to deal with cat lady and such I think its probably fine in this shell.

Heir is good and glad to hear you still think she's usable in more aggro focused build. Personally that's why I plan to use her as vampires is more my aggro deck not mid range. I can see the Yahenni's Expertise backfiring or causing you to have to play out your hard a certain way and I'd likely just want to drop a 3/2 flyer instead. I'd rather the expertise in sideboard.

Stromkirk...I know what you mean. I came across this testing Abbot of Keral Keep in a W/R humans pre rotation and finding it would just mess me up frequently as I'd want it turn 2 and then half the time I'd lose my 3rd land. Why I liked stromkirk is unlike the abbott unless you're playing off olivia with haste first time attack can do so with mana open pre land drop. Still what can suck is lack of using madness on the card unlike Asylum Visitor draws. I'm still inclined to test it though because: 1) its better off mimic turn 3, 2) I think 1 toughness may be much worse in this set with some cards that may get played, 3) opponent needs revolt to remove with a fatal push, 4) trample is good/fun. I may try a split 2/2 though

Yeah you sold me on gorger, and he's even great with Heir of Falkenrath  Flip letting you freecast other Vamps off it. Getting him through was a pain before but I like can now use Key on him if opponent doesn't have flyers. If they waste a push on him (which they would almost never do on neonate) you're likely to be well off.

Ok so makes sense you leave pariah to later...I was watching some stuff on marvel decks (I pretty much skipped kaladesh standard) and I can see this would be basically your one way out of that unless you just burn them out. I already liked her avoiding push entirely and the fact you "could" get her out turn 3/4 is nice. If I recall correctly if opponent kills her in response to you activating the ability you lose creatures and she never flips...so she does have that sort of merge card like risk. I guess Grasp of Darkness and instant burn would be the main worries there.

On the matchups have you tried against aggro with new set yet? Have some crazy new stompy like creatures in green and humans and few other variants got upgrades. I like how vampires can just fly over others usually, and thankfully that won't be changing much aside from new vehicles. I imagine, not sure if you mentioned, but the new lifelink vehicle will be a pain to directly deal with here unless can just kill the potential crew cards.

On yahenni, I pulled her also in my prerelease but my black was sadly weak and even then I am not sure how much value I would have gotten with how games were going. I just checked gatherer to see rulings on expertise as I was confused why you'd use and then drop yahenni post board wipe. I see it sees cards in play that may die, so it is fine then any opponents creatures die and it pumps. I may consider trying in golgari counters deck again knowing that. I still am not sure about her or expertise main in this deck. She's just a 2/2 for 3 and doesn't fly. You also don't really have stuff you'll want to chuck to her except zombie tokens but then kalitas is keeping her a 2/2. I can see maybe running her as a turn faster kalitas and 0 kalitas main deck and hope to pump her through removal or her expertise. I think aristocrats decks may be more a thing post bans so I'd prefer kalitas main if gonna use something as that is a hard counter to certain strategies. I kind of wish they at least made her a 3/3 base or flying....she feels so meh power wise.

Lastly on sideboard I have a feeling artifacts will be even more a thing with aether revolt, I feel some hate in sideboard will be a good idea. Currently all 15 spots is basically creature/PW removal and burn.

January 16, 2017 1:49 a.m.

noblevegas says... #23

RecklessReanimator, all good points.

I know triggering revolt will be a bit tough in this deck, but it is aggro. So as I typically see it, as long as my attacks have advantage with little downside, I'll always be swinging in. Yea, I might lose a creature or two, but that will aide the effect. Fiery Temper is always still there to pick off what I cant with Fatal Push, and I do have sideboard options if that's not enough.

Yahenni's Expertise is a card I do question here, but because it's new and potentially very powerful in the right conditions I do want to try it and see what it can do. I did the same with Key to the City when it first came out. only played two-of in the deck, and quickly saw the potential rise. I kept Key at three-of, however since I didn't want it to potentially disrupt Turn 2 tempo at the time. Here it would be fine but I still prefer Mimic at T2, of course.

You do have good points regarding Stromkirk Occultist and it can be a card to reconsider if my current build doesn't quite work out. Metallic Mimic does provide it slightly better value: 4/3 Trample for a potential 2 is quite good - basically as long as the exiled card isn't a pivotal piece at the time, it should be fine.

Pariah is a solid late game play, but you are right that there is a potential to lose 4 creatures and get nothing out of it. Typically, at those points you watch your opponent's open mana and time it correctly. However, if the deck does play correctly (and in late game there should have been plenty of time to setup, you could be making Voldaren Pariah  Flip land as a 5/5 Flier (Mimic and Olivia ability) thus forcing your opponent to 2-for-1 since even a Lightning Axe requires a discard unless they pay massively. That's why she's staying in. Also, I typically will pitch the Zombie tokens from Kalitas as my first option since I am basically getting those right back after the transform occurs on Pariah. Like I said, it's always about the line of play and timing.

I participated in 3 prereleases this weekend and all 3 of my decks were aggro-based. There was also a lot of aggro decks to play against - a couple of control, too. So I got to see what a great number of the new cards can do. It will be interesting to see if Vampires can keep up. I love that this deck has essentially survived the addition of 3 new sets since it's inception. That's typically unheard-of in Standard. Even my favorite home-brew of "Flying Hydras" when Khans came out didn't survive as long. It was dead by Dragons.

Admittedly, I have not yet focused on Sideboard. I simply moved a few things around. With the Ban list last week, and so very many new archetypes coming out, I have zero idea what the metagame is. I will be adjusting for artifact hate, but I'll only be able to get that in red. Black doesn't pay attention to any of that. So, I'll need to make sure to balance it appropriately so as not to disrupt playability if my mana requirements shift too hard. shock likely won't actually be there come next week. Always a fun card, and it can do work but I already have a fair amount of burn and evation, so I'll need that focused elsewhere (like artifact hate as you said). Collective Brutality may also move as that saw little play except against control decks, where this has advantage already.

January 16, 2017 8:32 a.m.

noblevegas:

I think biggest issue post release with Fatal Push may be getting enough of them as they are likely to be sold out for a while :) . From what I've seen of box openings only likely to get about 2 of an uncommon per box . Also hope mimic stays low $ as I want for several decks.

I'm definately looking forward to testing with Key to the City, I remember when EM came out and we were so happy to get Stromkirk Condemned. It was the BB casting cost of that card that actually is what scared me of pariah FYI...so many messed up turn 2s. That and it could just die half the time. Reminds me...more pileup on Asylum Visitor hehe, she has bad synergy with the Key as if you choose to pay the 2 you get it during untap step before upkeep so you won't be hellbent.

Per Stromkirk Occultist while it was limited/sealed maybe my best card in prerelease was Renegade Freighter. Man has power creep come long way since Juggernaut. It's a 3cc 5/4 trampler on offense and it just steamrolled over weenies/servos. A frequent 4/3 or even 5/4 trampler (with olivia + mimic)...seems fun at least to try.

Btw I for some reason temporarily forgot as a vampire pariah can be up to 5/5 herself, and yeah instant speed removal at that is basically down to 2 cards. I'm definately gonna try to run 2 copies and I'll just keep track of how she plays out in hands I draw her.

Yeah I'm glad they printed cards like Metallic Mimic to passively beef up the tribes of past sets. I think of Vampires as sort of like in between modern affinity/burn, trying to dump hand fast and 0 opponent quickly and those strategies usually stay relevant unless hated out. Now its becoming closer to merfolk with 3 kinds of "lords" :). I'm also interested in rebrewing humans in modern/standard with new cards as well.

Sideboard so I think that having some anti-control hand disruption is good but if Collective Brutality isn't good here then probably worth trying Transgress the Mind in its spot for now. Not sure how relevant exile is in this meta but actually could be relevant vs. angel version of Aetherworks Marvel. That should be pretty good vs flash deck and can take out all planeswalkers as well and board wipes. For artifact hate from what I see options include Destructive Tampering which could maybe be relevant for 2nd part, but I think I'd try out Release the Gremlins. Likely to cast for 3 usually but 5 is doable and also helps out tempo by giving a threat. One idea is to run Asylum Visitor in side against control (I used to keep it in my side for that), swap out maybe fiery temper for them and get another threat. I'd probably take out the Incendiary Flow unless you have decks you need to exile creatures as you have enough burn/removal. I like Unlicensed Disintegration more as its instant, guaranteed removal and high chance of 3 to the dome as well. One other card idea for MB or SB is a planeswalker...thinking either Liliana, the Last Hope for a recursion element (relevant ultimate also), or Chandra, Torch of Defiance. Chandra I think I've seen a list or two using a couple of copies, it does pump up the budget a bit but I'd say all of its abilities could be relevant. Liliana also synergizes well with Yahenni's Expertise btw if you wanna try that out. She can come down and -2/-1 something that is left at 1 toughness, or just recur something of yours that just died on an empty board. Could help in letting game go long as well. I wouldn't use more than a copy or two of either.

January 16, 2017 5:17 p.m.

noblevegas says... #25

Sideboard updated.
Collective Brutality will stay for now. Since control decks and some pump-based aggro decks gained momentum going into Friday, I think these will likely still help. Also synergizes nicely with Yahenni's Expertise for slightly larger creatures.

Incendiary Flow is cut to two. I've got a great deal of removal and evasion, so this would likely come in against Superfriends decks and some control as well for direct damage.

Release the Gremlins does seem like a solid answer for Aetherworks Marvel decks as well as Electrostatic Pummeler so it would be beneficial to have some removal that can be used to feed Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet, too.To the Slaughter stays in since Planeswalkers are getting more popular this time around. Dilerium will be tough to put online for the dual effect, but a we-ll timed Slaughter will still be beneficial at 1-for-1.

Transgress the Mind still seems helpful to slow control and midrange decks at the outset.

Unlicensed Disintegration is still a great card and could get back to MB. It would be helpful as spot removal, but for now Fatal Push has the value advantage.

Part of me is also curious of using Wrangle in the sideboard. I figure a two-of that allows me to steal an opponent's creature late game and then sac it to Kalitas seems like fun. I've also given some thought as to Kari Zev's Expertise for the same reason with up-side (Imagine your opponent's horror when you steal their Marveled Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger, mill them with it and then sacrificing it to Kalitas before their next turn). Double red in a deck that's more black-focused may be tough to pull off, but they'd never see it coming.

I'll work on finishing assembly of this on release day for FNM and see what happens.

January 19, 2017 9 a.m.

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