Is it ok that I moved the discussion to your thread? I have been playing almost exclusively against Eric Bonvie's Prossh deck and the Damia Dreamcrusher (Tooth and Nail combo) minus Imperial Seal. Both decks are highly tuned with Damia being extremely competitive. Oblation and Chaos were in the deck when I played in a more varied environment. Command Theory's list loses to Gaddock Teeg and a resolved Blood Moon (both of which I have experienced). What would you remove from his list? Force of Will was my first inclination but it can be used to prevent these spells. You just felt the need to include Oblation. Has that been enough?

HansenWK had a thread on Narset. He plays the creatureless, Proteus Staff vesion. His last update in the Fall included Wheel of Fortune, Time Spiral and Timetwister. I have a Wheel of Fortune. The objection to this card is that it refills opponents hands. I have found it also wrecks opponents hands. He plays several more mana artifacts than we do (Fellwar Stone, Mind Stone, Gilded Lotus, and Talisman of Progress, and all three Signets). So, he is unloading a lot of mana rocks early and needs to refill his hand. What do you think about this card for Narset? Unlike Time Spiral, this would definitely be used to fuel our Narset cast.

In a multiplayer game, a Gaddock Teeg or Blood Moon can be a problem for most of the decks, and therefore not only you but also the other affected players are going to try to remove those. You asked me if one permanent removal card is enough and i would say that at least you still have one. and with mystical tutor and long term plans, you can get it when needed. With the fixed amount of combo component (extra turn, extra combat, orbs, ramps, omniscience, etc.), the decision for rest of the spaces you have is really a question of more rampings, counterspells, or removals. Use more ramp cards if you want to out race some fast deck, counterspells and removals agianst combo decks. You decision should really be made according to the types of deck youre playing against in your play group. I sometimes play with my friend one on one with this deck (even if it's not a legal dual commander deck but whatever lol) and ramping is more important in this case because if he managed to cast a for example nekusar earlier than my first attack with narset, it can be a trouble for me. I dont think drawing cards is necessary for our decks. we all know that this deck runs on luck and the top four cards on the library not cards in hand XD

I agree with you to a point. Competitive players do not play Teeg at all and I have seen one semi competitive deck play Blood Moon. Semi competitive decks will be more than willing to let Teeg resolve and possibly Blood Moon. They know Narset must outrace the table. Semi competitive decks get obliterated by BUG Combo, Zur, Azami, Sharumm, and Arcum. This deck is a glass cannon. All the above lists are far more resilient. I have trouble believing this deck could win against a table featuring three of the above listed decks. Let me know if you find any reports that confirm or disprove this hypothesis.I must say that your analysis is correct in that there is a balance of bombs, ramp and counterspells. I am trying to find the ratios and cards to make this deck viable in a competitive environment if that is possible. Thank you for responding to my posts. You are a better player than me and I have learned a lot from reading your deck explanations and answers to my inane posts.

Thank you. Do u have a decklist of your narset? I'd love to have a look at it if possible and see if i can make some improvements to mine!

My list is identical to Command Theory's with the exception of Force of Will, Tolaria West, Boros Signet and Izzet Signet. These replaced Capture of Jingzhou (do not own), Winter Orb, Lightening Greaves and Stronic Resonator. My mana base includes Ancient Tomb and Forbidden Orchard and I believe several of the fetchlands for a total of 36 lands. I do not play Eiganjo Castle, Crystal Vein, Tarnished Citadel, Gemstone Mine and Gemstone Caverns.

How often do you use Simian Spirit Guide, Rite of Flame, Desperate Ritual, and Pyretic Ritual to cast Relentless Assault or Seize the Day? Command Theory's orginal win con with Enter the Infinite involved being able to cast Omniscience with mana built entirely from within the deck. Your wincon using Fury of Horde to cast Omniscience through Narset's attack may make it possible to replace at one of those four cards. I would like to use something that is valuable outside that specific combo. I am experimenting with removing Pyretic Ritual for Mox Diamond.

I don't know if mox diamond is a good idea for my deck since I've got only 34 lands including 6 fetches. Those 4 red cards are useful even if i dont need to cast omniscience from my hand. As i said, i want to make my deck as fast as possible. And i dont care if i have one two or even no cards in hand after casting narset because with her onboard i am just going to play with cards in my library (have to make sure that narset wont be countered).

I should have been more specific. Command Theory was using Narset's attack to cast Enter the Infinite and then using those four red cards with the mana rocks, Chrome Mox, and Lotus Petal to cast Omniscience from within the deck.

The issue I have is do we need to occupy four slots in the deck with these type of cards. Take for example the card I removed Pyretic Ritual. I am going to guess you never used that card to cast Narset. How many times have you used the signets to fix your mana to and to get Narset out a turn earlier?

You could play Boros Signet, Fellwar Stone another counter like Force of Will or some removal. One thing I learned from the Damia Dreamcrusher deck is you want to avoid cards that are dead outside the combo. We have four cards that are only situationally used to cast Seize the Day and Aggravated Assault. That situation arises when you have already cast Fury of the Horde.

I picked Mox Diamond because it can get you early mana and if Enter the Infinite has been cast it will net you one colored mana. It is definitely in the test stage. It probably should be Oblation or another counter spell. I could be way off base so feel free to set me right.

I think you kind of misunderstood why i included those red cards. I didn't drop them because they make my deck faster, not because I need them to cast seize the day and relentless assault. My experience with this deck was that when I had a pyretic ritual in my opening hand, 90% of the time I could use it to cast Narset. Narset costs 3RWU to cast and pyretic ritural's RRR is not a problem for me. For examle, if i have mana crypt, land, land, land, cast pyretic ritual then booom! Narset! Or land, ancient tomb, shimian spirit guide, mox, ritual then boom! what i'm saying is that narset costs 3 colorless mana to cast and I included those because I want to cast narset as soon as possible. And RRR really isn't a problem (3RWU-RRR=1WU). The reason why in the description i said we can use those cards to cast seize the day and relentless assault is because we have those cards in the deck, i didn't include those because we need them to cast seize and assault.

I used to have FOW, misdirection, and pact of negation in my decklist but i finally dropped them because they all have some weaknesses. FOW and misdirection require a blue card in hand and i can't always have one. And the pact obviously has more restrictions. I have considered mox diamond but I'm not sure a 34 land including 6 fetches should use it.

lets compare signets with those 4 red cards:1. signets are permanent and red cards can be used only once adding 1 mana.2. signets cost 2 manas to cast and generates 1 mana and red cards generate R more than its casting cost, which means when using signets, it will benefit on the next turn and red cards benefit instantaneously.3. signets can turn one colorless mana into one with color.(itself generates also one with color)

I think both are great and as long as we control their ratio well, they can be very powerful!!

I went back over all the posts and you were clear. I had been using the rituals specifically to cast Omniscience after Enter the Infinite resolves. I play partial mulligans so those cards were not being kept if they were in my opening hand.

Why is Dispel not Swan Song?

Because a 2/2 bird can block narset and might end up with a situation which i can't attack with narset due to that damn bird.....

A friend of mine uses Proteus Staff and no creatures to set up instant win turns with Narset's ability on the stack, it normally wins turn 5... I am biased I know, but I think that is a great direction for a competitive Narset deck. He also uses early draw/mana fixing to help get her out asap.

the problem with a creatureless Narset deck with staff is that you have to give up including some very powerful creatures in this deck like generator servant, simian spirit guide, and grand abolisher. Other than that, you have to first have a creature to sacrifice and it may waste me a turn a two. this deck is so consistent that even without the help of the staff, i can be able to win with one or two attacks. and also, this deck is very fast, i once won on turn one lol.

Holy crap! Turn one? Do you remember how you did it?

as i remembered, it was a turn one chrome mox, lotus petal, lion eye diamond, land, mass hysteria, and shimian spirit guide. and then turn one attack with narset revealed a jingzhou, and the extra turn attack revealed enter the infinite and game set....

cheater!!

nananana~~~hiahiahiahiaGill you

Omniscience, Past in Flames

Omniscience, Past in Flames

cast your entire library twice

interesting idea, however, omniscience only allows you to cast spells "from your hand" without paying mana costs...

nice to see a competitive deck that's actually competitive. Have an upvote.

thank you for the support!!