Lol. That's basically what I'm seeing too. I have Autumn's veil in the sb too, but it does seem... underwhelming. The problem with just siding in negate is that the deck is giving them more counters at the same time, and have sided out fog effects (in all likelyhood). So.. yeah. Maybe Nihil Spellbomb to negate card:Runechanter's Pike?

Man this deck is great....until I use a Surgical Extraction on your Fog

what's that? Noxious Revival ? okay, Mental Misstep ...I can do this all day buddy :P

@Inces_Velus Yes, I'm very impressed. :P

Good sir this deck is sweet and you sideboard some of my favorite cards in it Witchbane Orb and card:Grafdigger's Cage, i should build this it looks fun!

ya, that is the problem with the deck, because your not dealing damage...unless u get a thrun and that can't even do any justice, I can use phyrexian mana all day...once october rolls around you won't have to worry about that, but you will have to worry about burn spells, so I suggest putting into your sideboard 4x Flashfreeze ...until it rolls out, and then you're kinda screwed against burn decks XD I would suggest something like adding in Primordial Hydra ...you not taking damage, and then when it ramps up (as you should have plenty of mana in your pool sitting around) you can summon a 4/4 or even 5/5 hydra and two or three turns later...win con against burn decks! can't outburn a 120/120 hydra (yes that happened to me :3)

@Inces_Velus While Flashfreeze is not at all a bad idea, I am running 4x Negate and 3x Witchbane Orb in my sideboard, which shuts down virtually all of my red worries except for Inferno Titan and Hellrider . For those two nasty fellas, I have hopes that Tamiyo, the Moon Sage , Beast Within , or even a sideboarded Karn Liberated or Volition Reins can take care of them, at least one at a time.

Not going to lie: decks with counterspells, decks with burn, and decks with recurring zombie life loss shenanigans (card:Geralf's Messenger+Birthing Pod +Restoration Angel = omg) are all bad matchups for plucky ol' Turbofog. Which is to say: most of the current metagame.

White weenie and green stompy though?! Those decks are dead, lol.

see, you would hate the decks I run as they always mix control and aggro...which usually people say "you'll never make the combo work" but as I have pulled off everytime the wins...I can make aggro and control work, so when I suggest Primordial Hydra it is not me being nice with a thought...it is a must for this deck...the ability to let that hydra "sit" allows that ability to make a 120/120 trample EASY! and with counter spells to protect it.....can you say rape the enemy? XD it also makes for a nicer meta game against people who play those decks because you will sooner or later be over powered

Also, I know it's rotating out, but it's cheap...ever thought about adding card:Venser's Journal into this deck as with tamiyo you get everything back to your hand allowing for a larger hand than normal

@Inces_Velus Fair points about Primordial Hydra , though I think you could convey the power of a 120/120 trampler without bringing up rape. If you'll excuse the tangent, "rape" as a word and with all its context is too powerful and far too wrapped up in a serious societal problem to be associated with reducing an opponent's life total to -100. I beg your forgiveness if no one has ever objected to the use of it before, but because it is capable of triggering unwanted and traumatic memories in people you might not expect, it's probably best if the hydra restricts itself to just tearing enemy planeswalkers apart and eating their faces, with, you know, squirrel- and various other woodland creature-based condiments. Like ketchup. /end tangent

If I get around to editing the deck again (I haven't played it or altered it in two months), I'll definitely look into adding Primordial Hydra , as well as card:Venser's Journal. The journal has been sitting in my maybeboard awaiting just such an occurrence, actually, and thanks to a couple of ridiculous sealed pools at prerelease tournaments, I now have seven(!) hydras lying around, gathering dust and dried leaves (I store them with the Forest s, obviously. You should see the water damage and wet rot that my blue and black cards get into).

Honestly though, I think I might be about done with the deck. Maybe the archetype will get some support after rotation, but the loss of Rites of Flourishing and the annoyance of playing turbofog will probably mean a different deck comes out of this one. Then again, who knows. A week from now, I might be thinking obsessively about Fog again!

Moonmist is a pretty iffy card. If you play against anything with Huntmaster of the Fells  ^Flip in it (or just Werewolf Tribal), it's not only dead, but an advantage for your opponent.

-4 Moonmist , +1 Blunt the Assault , +1 Clinging Mists , +2 Beast Within .

As it stands right now, this deck gets annihilated by enemy Planeswalkers before sideboarding. Beast Within is perfect for TurboFog since you don't care about any creatures. Beast Within also helps you deal with Inferno Titan , which is probably the biggest threat against TurboFog in Standard.

Hokay, I've been getting enough recent suggestions that I suppose it's time to dust this thing off and give it the update it's been needing for the past months, at least until things start rotating out this fall. Yes, the deck is still going to die to everything. But at least it can look like it's trying to not die.

@zandl Agreed, on all points. I'm going to make those changes at the very least, and probably others, so mayhap there will be an update in a few minutes. It would be nice to get this deck current.

Added the easy to remove but otherwise plucky Fog Bank to stall things a bit early on, and 2x Reliquary Tower , so I can hang on to as many spells as I can draw, in addition to making the changes suggested by zandl two posts above.

Thank you all for the continued interest in the deck!

@Inces_Velus Sorry, no Primordial Hydra this time. I'm intending the above deck list as a pure fog-mill deck, but one of the intentions of the deck is to spawn additional variants of the archetype. If you'd like to build a hydra version of your own, go for it! I think it's got potential, as long as you account for all the spare removal spells that will be hurtling toward your hydra's many heads. I imagine Vapor Snag followed by Snapcaster Mage +Vapor Snag every few turns will be terribly annoying for the big fella. So...Ring of Evos Isle ? For that matter, Invisible Stalker +Ring of Evos Isle would also be spiffy, if you were into such things.

Have you seen my TurboFog deck? You might like some of the ideas and concepts it brings to the table.

Zandl's Fogwalkers

Nice, zandl, I approve of your build. Looks like the biggest difference is that you have Pristine Talisman , Glimmerpost , and Karn Liberated in place of where I have Snapcaster Mage and Fog Bank .

I'm too nervous about letting Snapcaster Mage go, crutch as he is, because a chunk of the games I lost were to a Negate that came down when I only had one Fog effect available in hand. His inclusion gives me a necessary out.

However, I really like Pristine Talisman over Fog Bank now. The wall will just get killed by whatever removal the opponent draws, for lack of any other targets aside from chump-blocking snapcasters, and the talisman has the added benefit of ramp which can be desperately important in the early- to mid-game. Plus, as you mentioned in your deck description, it's a buffer against burn. So I think I'll be making that change.

I appreciate the assist, seriously. I will emblazon your name within the hallowed halls of my deck description, honored Green Master.

Emblazon away, Green Peon.

Aww, I was hoping for more of a...Green-Blue...Quartermaster. Or an, er, an Aquamarine Sergeant-at-Arms!

Mayhap a Simic Steward?

Have you ever thought about card:Alchemist's Refuge? It'd be hilarious to Flash in a 'walker at their EOT or better yet, a Rites of Flourishing so they don't get the first benefit from it.

Also, why no love for Noxious Revival anymore?

Totally should run Moonmist , then lol when you flip back their delver.

instead of thought scour why notnuse mind sculpt?

card:Alchemist's Refuge would be okay, but Flashing in Rites of Flourishing in order to avoid your opponent getting a benefit is pointless. TurboFog doesn't care that Rites comes down on the third turn.

Noxious Revival is a bit awkward. Why not just use more Fog s over it? Chances are you'd be getting Fog s back anyways.

Moonmist flips all Werewolves, too. Against Huntmaster of the Fells  ^Flip (or Werewolf Aggro), it's horrible..

Thought Scour is a can-trip. It replaces itself when you cast it. Mind Sculpt may mill for more cards, but it's a Sorcery and makes you go down a card.

Thought Scour is teh sex, and really helps you get to those essential Rites of Flourishing , Fog s, and lands when you really, desperately need them. The mill is mostly incidental, but does allow you to kill with it should you get a chance to use Tamiyo, the Moon Sage 's ultimate.

Moonmist , like Terrifying Presence , is just too risky. Sure, it sometimes works out really well for you, but it's not worth the danger of Huntmaster of the Fells  ^Flip , which remains a popular, dominating card.

@Nephilim I knoooow, I got rid of Noxious Revival ! The whole "top of its owner's library" thing started to get a bit annoying. Snapcaster Mage does the effect better, in my opinion, even if it requires a bigger mana investment, because you get the same flexibility along with a free chump blocker.

A more budget-friendly alternative to Snapcaster Mage that I would still like a little bit better than Noxious Revival is the newly reprinted Revive . It's not an instant, but the fact that your target spell goes directly into your hand is good enough for me.

Any thoughts on Undead Alchemist ? I recently rediscovered this card (bothered to read his text) and don't see why it wouldn't be great for a mill deck.

What about Talrand, Sky Summoner ? He'll keep putting up flying chump blockers every time you cast an Instant or Sorcery.

If you are worried about things like hellrider and need a panic button, you can side splash some white and run terminus as your oh s*** button. Unlike the tide, it won't reset the entire board so card advantage and walkers are still in, plus you can use noxious revival or reclaim, to miracle it if you need.