Sounds like quite the puzzle. Good luck. I’ll be looking forward to what you discover.

SeekerofSecrets, TheAlexGnan, tlhunter07

So, the deck has been performing quite well. After taking out into the meta I've made a few changes. Opts are out, more removal is in, and man do I love playing 4x Anger of the Gods.

But I still have 1 sideboard spot left. Once upon a time I was toying with including 3-4x Leyline of the Void, but it's too narrow and expensive. Not going down that route. I'll take my chances that Hollow One is the breakout degenerate deck of the summer and won't be around next summer. Humans is neutral to good, Affinity would probably be insane if I had experience in the matchup (seriously, I never see it). RG Tron is okay to bad, Eldrazi of any kind is awful, Burn is good, Storm is fantastic. Mardu Pyromancer I don't have a good feel for, but I think it would be okay to good if I could figure out the matchup. Jund and Control are both decent, but draw-dependent.

With all of that, Liliana, the Last Hope and Search for Azcanta  ^Flip are my top considerations, with Stormbreath Dragon or possibly Goblin Rabblemaster as secondary options. I think I want another card to bring in against Jund and Control. But I really don't know. Any thoughts?

Against Jund Engineered Explosives can wipe a lot of cards off the table. However, Vendilion Clique and Ancestral Vision are more versatile against Control/Jund. If you only have one slot left a single Vendilion Clique is what I would run. Ancestral Vision is something you want mainboard and more than one generally.

Of course I just traded away my EE and vendilion clique not too long ago.

Vendilion clique is a decent clock against Tron, especially because I can play it their end step after holding up counter magic. I like that.

I originally decided against clique because it's very soft to removal, especially from jeskai control. I also didn't find it super impactful. But it's still a good proactive play that I don't need to drop countermagic to cast.

I think search for azcanta is the stronger card vs control and jund, but v clique is better vs Tron.

Engineered explosives is the best option, but so expensive. I'll wait for the reprint.

Lili would be the best in the meta I'm currently in (no Jund, no control, all aggro), but when I leave in July I'll be back in a more balanced meta. Maybe I'll get Lili now, then trade it when the meta shifts?

I'm liking the thought of vendilion clique a lot. Extra threats for when I cut delver are always good. Darn it, I think I'm even more undecided now.

Thanks Chas!

Hahaha! You're welcome. Search for Azcanta  ^Flip is really good against discard and midrange decks. If you're looking at an aggro heavy meta though, Anger of the Gods should take care of that. I wouldn't over SB for aggro. Maybe swap Countersquall in the mainboard for Rakdos Charm. It punishes go wide strategies (ahem might conflict with Young Pyromancer a bit...), helps against tron and jeskai control, and it plays nicely with Snapcaster Mage too.

I hear Damping Sphere stops Tron reasonably well. I haven't actually tested it out, I just ordered my playset last week.

Chasmolinker Damping sphere is good against Tron (I've tested quite a bit) but it's a very narrow card. I don't even know if I'd board it in against Eldrazi.

How does Rakdos charm help vs jeskai? Spending a whole card to exile their graveyard doesn't seem worthwhile. In general I don't think it's powerful enough to play. This deck would prefer to attrition rather than race, especially against the go-wide decks (Pyromancer, humans, etc).

TheAlexGnan So far anger of the gods has been a huge standout card. I haven't felt the need for anything stronger, except against Hollow One. Some games humans can make things larger than 3 toughness, but that's more a matter of correct timing with Anger of the Gods. I could see damnation working against Hollow One, but vs Humans I worry about getting locked out of playing it between my land count and Thalia, Guardian of Thraben.

As for Ceremonious Rejection, it's very good against Tron, but if Eldrazi gets out Cavern of Souls, then it doesn't really work.

Congrats on your tournament! That's awesome. Ad Nauseam is a super winnable matchup too, although depends heavily on if we get enough countermagic and if they get what they need. I thought you'd sold out of paper magic.

I'll be playing this tomorrow night. I'll add an update with my results.

Rakdos Charm isn't perfect for jeskai. But it's flexible enough to be used in multiple scenarios. Exiling their graveyard isn't great but it gives you a mainboard answer to Tron, affinity, and go-wide decks that Countersquall doesn't. (Other than countering Karn Liberated but there is already decent counter magic for him.) Rakdos Charm just seems like a better flex option than Countersquall for the mainboard. If you need more counter magic you have 2 Countersquall in the side board.

Too often Rakdos Charm would be an 0-for-1. It's flexible, but it's only fantastic in very specific scenarios or against very specific decks. It would do nothing against humans pre-board because I can't race them. It's even worse against Burn. Countersquall is possibly my favorite card in the deck.

TheAlexGnan that's awesome! Where in the US were you?

I've been testing against Tron a bit more and it's still a struggle post-board even with 4 Ceremonious Rejection. Rejection is amazing, but Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger is a very difficult card to beat. And because of Sanctum of Ugin, they have a lot of ways to find Ulamog. My current approach of trying to counter everything they play after they get Tron online isn't really working. I could try Fulminator Mage or more Field of Ruin or Molten Rain, but I've never found land destruction to fast enough to matter. And Surgical Extraction doesn't seem reliable enough.

Delver has been under-performing. It doesn't beat tron or KCI. It dies all the time. I think I boarded it out most of the rounds tonight and didn't wish for it in any matchup except Jund when he had Leyline in play. For context, I didn't board in Anger of the Gods once, and I still found myself cutting Delver from the deck. It's great when I get 2 of them or when the opponent stumbles and doesn't have removal, but those situations are scarce and I am probably winning those games anyway. When I board it out I definitely feel light on threats, but it still doesn't feel like what I should be playing.

I'm considering Thing in the Ice  ^Flip instead. Bouncing a full board of Humans or Young Pyromancer tokens sounds pretty funny. It dies equally much to Push, except it doesn't die to Bolt or Walking Ballista.

If I switch to Thing in the Ice I might switch over to a discard package again - Thoughtseize and Inquisition of Kozilek. They're very good at plucking away a Fatal Push or Reflector Mage on turn 1, opening the door for turn 2 Thing. Maybe a 4-2 Seize-IoK split? I'd want to cut Spell Snare, but I'd like to keep Mana Leak.

I'm not sure where Thing is worse than Delver. Perhaps vs KCI, but even then I doubt it.

The real question is how do I split between Young Pyromancer and Thing in the Ice? I don't think I want more than 4 between the 2 of them. 2-2 split? 3-1? 4-0? I have no clue.

I'm a huge fan of TiTi but I haven't play tested it in grixis so balancing it with your delve treats could become difficult. I would test 4 TiTi, 4 snap, 4 Cryptic Serpent (you've really sold me on this card) and maybe two young peezy? I know it's odd to play grixis without tas but having an unflipped thing and an early tas can become problematic and bouncing serpent back to your hand, while not ideal, isn't detrimental because it can just be recast for 2 mana. I also really like the idea of the discard suite. I also think that it's better to go all in on thing because they're great in multiples and you really want to hit it on t2, seeing your first just gets worse as the game goes on.

But at the same time it sound's like you having success with the current set up X)

The current setup is okay. It sometimes has a good night and cashes out, but I also play in more tournaments than I write about. It has some bad nights too.

Delve threats and thing in the ice play well enough together. By the time I flip thing I probably have 4ish lands in play, so playing tasigur again isn't too difficult. Besides, I still have a 7/8 in play and they have no creatures. Without thing, the delve threats are much easier to cast than serpent. They come down turns sooner.

The fear with cryptic serpent is graveyard hate from the sideboard. Relic of Progenitus or Nihil Spellbomb will prevent you from casting serpent. Tasigur, not so much. I've cast tasigur through plenty of relics in my day.

If bouncing the delve threats becomes problematic then serpent is definitely a card to consider, but for now I still think tasigur is better to play.

There are still a few things I'm uncertain about. Namely, is thing in the ice better than young pyromancer? Or would I just be better off playing Grixis pyromancer? Also is it possible to play counterspells and discard in the same deck? There are a lot of games I've won just by having mana leak. In particular, it's amazing against Tron. But turn 1 discard to clear the way for thing is also essential.

I've thought allot about thing vs peezy and I honestly just think it depends on your metta, I think peezy might have a slightly faster clock in a vacume but thing is easier to protect and flipping one is normally game against a deck like humans. I tend to think about the two like peezy being a small short term investment while thing is a long term one. I honestly love having them both in my deck!

I also think that 3 leak and a discard suite is fine! It seemed to be a decent balance when I was testing esper

Why don't grixis delver decks run remand? Is it because you need the threats to not just be delayed but to be gone forever hense more permanent counter magic? The way I see it, you have board removal. Why not go for more value cards like remand.

I personally don't play it because anytime I would cast it I'd prefer Mana Leak. And there are a lot of cavern of souls being played so countermagic isn't great right now, so I'm pretty sure I don't want both.

For me, I rarely try to tempo people out with delver. There's also a lot of removal of all sorts, so the first delver usually just dies. And if I don't have a threat on the table then I definitely want to be playing hard answers, not delaying the problem.

Remand is great value, but snapcaster and k-command are also great value. Only decks like Junk can out-value me anyway. Incidentally, remand is great vs lingering souls, however nobody plays junk and Pyromancer is fine post-board.

And for what it's worth, I have no idea what other Grixis delver players are doing these days. Probably because I'm among the very few. This is just what I play.

Good answer. For some reason I was opperation under the reasoning that your deck was more of a control deck then a mid-range proactive type deck with a good suit of backup permission. Seeing as you aren't as a controly of a deck I think you're completely justified in running Mana leak over remand. You just want to keep the board clear so you can kill your opponent. As a u Tron player our early and mid game revolve entirely around getting to our endgame asap where generally whatever threat we play will instantly stabalize us. For that reason we run remand as it cantrips and propels us into the late game where we're almost sure to win.

That makes a lot of sense for u-tron, and you're exactly correct on the difference between the 2 decks.

@ToolmasterOfBrainerd: Okay. Yah just gotta put it out there, I absolutely love your deck :)

I know Delver decks typically run 20 lands. That being said, what is your opinion on running more fast lands, specifically Spirebluff Canal?

Chasmolinker I think that adding another Spirebluff canal is a great idea. Sure, sometimes I'll draw too many fast lands, but at the moment I feel like I don't see them often enough. I don't know what land I would remove. I'm pretty set on trying out creeping tar pit until I see that it's bad. Maybe cut another fetch land? I'm pretty sure I want exactly 20 lands because I get a healthy mix of flooding and starving.

IzzetFanatic thanks! It's a lot of fun.

Hahaha. That round when you win 2-0 before they even get to cut your deck and they spend the remaining half hour telling you what’s wrong with it. Haha. Glad to see you’re still successful with a fair deck. Nice write up. Do you take notes after the rounds?

Yeah, it was a bit annoying at the time, but in retrospect it was pretty funny.

I've had this problem with a storm enthusiast before. It was a game shop owner that was telling me about how my storm matchup was terrible. Everything basically boiled down to 'storm can kill or bounce everything you have' and justified that things like damping sphere were bad because storm can just bounce them. I just don't see it. They have to draw all of those bounce spells, but also draw enough gas to combo off through my counterspells. Sounds like a fine matchup up me.

I don't take notes but I usually have a pretty good memory of what happened. I remember a lot more than I write, but I get bored of writing pretty quickly.

Honestly, round 1 vs KCI was the most interesting matchup of the night. Rakdos control was cool, but I beat him through Leyline of the Void, which shouldn't happen if his deck is good.

Can you think of any improvements to the deck? I have a bunch of store credit to burn and with school starting I won't be able to use it until next summer if I don't use it soon. I want to speculate on cards I might use. Maybe another Liliana, the Last Hope? I think she's going to keep going up in price. And in the right meta she's insane.

I pulled the trigger on a second Liliana, the Last Hope and haven't had the chance to use it yet. Not the right meta currently.

I would look at Search for Azcanta  ^Flip, Logic Knot, Vendilion Clique, Fulminator Mage, Bloodghast, Grim Lavamancer, Death's Shadow, Scalding Tarn, and Spirebluff Canal. Any of those that tickle your fancy would be good or the deck imho.

I already have a full set of bloodghast signed by Sam Black and a set of altered faithless looting. And I got 2 grim lavamancer before they got too expensive for legacy. I feel comfortable that I can get vendilion clique for the same price next summer. It's seen so many reprints.

I'll pick up another Spirebluff Canal. It's not too expensive and I want to play another anyway.

I should probably look at Search for Azcanta  ^Flip for the mainboard of this deck again. It's a great way to flip Delver of Secrets, fuel delve threats, and pull ahead in the late game. My late game is already pretty good and it can't help flip Delver until turn 3, but it's still a really good card. I know a lot of Grixis players like it. It doesn't rotate out of standard for another year, so it's price probably won't change much, but standard cards are so volatile.

I could build UB Death's Shadow in legacy with what I own and store credit, except for the Underground Seas, which can just be basic lands instead. I could also get a good chunk of Die Pigs ($350 budget midrange). I've wanted to play a Boros or Mardu Nahiri deck for awhile.

I've also wanted to own an Aluren for a long time and I think the store sells them for $29. And a Sword of Feast and Famine in case I need it for legacy, and I could play it in EDH if I don't.

So many options. None of them perfect, but so many are tempting.

It's going well! I've been playing a lot of magic this summer with decent success, both in modern and legacy.

My list definitely has been moving closer to control, especially with the additions of Creeping Tar Pit and Thoughtseize. And I'm definitely warming up to Search for Azcanta  ^Flip, and even considering picking up a few copies.

What about Cryptic Command and Delver and Azcanta in the same grixis deck? Too far? Probably. What about 4 Young Pyromancer? We can show those Mardu players what a cantrip looks like. I don't think they quite understand.

I can't wait to see the spreadsheet of your results.

Last night I actually beat Hollow One 2-0. Game 1 turn 1 on the play he played Faithless Looting, discarded 2 Bloodghast, cycled a Street Wraith, and then played a free Hollow One. I still won that game. I played Pyromancer, made tokens to block with whilst Dreadboring his turn 3 Flameblade Adept, used my Tasigur to eat his Hollow One when he did a full swing, Mana Leaked his Gurmag Anglers, and eventually got there by having enough tokens to block with every turn and swinging with Tasigur. It was a crazy game. Game 2 his hand fizzled when he drew a lot of Lightning Bolts, which I think Hollow One is supposed to sideboard out, but I'm not certain. I finished 2-2 for the night with a disappointing loss to Affinity.