Hmm...good points made by both of you. I'll keep it on the back burner, but I do tend to shy away from infinite combos. I'd rather win the straightforward way, though many others prefer not to.

Added in a few more ramp cards like Mana Vault and Basalt Monolith . Trying to up the speed to make the deck a bit more competitive against faster decks. Took out a few cards that didn't see much use, so we shall see if the updates make a difference. So far adding in Sin Collector worked well, and may end up putting in a few of the white counterspell cards like Lapse of Certainty and Dawn Charm .

Rather than white counterspells is say run black hand disruption. Not familiar enough with the color but it has to be there. I think the ramp will help a lot, maybe take out couldron of souls for some more? Also, replace monolith with guilded lotus or thran dynamo and day of judgement with wrath of god? You don't mind lack of can't regenerate until you do. And I'd replace keyrune with signet unless you plan to use it as a creature often.

Probably not going to get a wrath of god unless someone has it for trade since in all the times I've used it not a single person was running regeneration. And with all the exile in the deck I'm not too concerned. The monolith is in there since I don't have an extra of either of the other two artifacts, so we'll see if that becomes much of a factor...and yes, you should know that I get use out of the keyrune. That's the whole reason it's in there honestly. And Cauldron of Souls is a substitute for Lifeline , so unless it seems like I'm getting no use out of it it's going to stay. I'm kinda surprised you'd suggest taking it out since it's so handy for recursion and all I have to do it tap it.

the recursion on cauldron only works once, and you have much better recursion tools in there. I don't think i have ever seen you actually sacrifice keyrune, but if that is the goal you could run Thunder Totem as well. I'm planning on foiling all the mass removal and "big spells" in jenara to start so if i wind up with the foil full art wrath of god i'll be happy to trade you my other one. It doesn't come up often but there will be a point vs something like asceticism that you will really want it.

Probably. It's funny how phased out regeneration as an ability became once things started getting "indestructible" or getting "exiled." Used to be extremely powerful. The keyrune works well because it's useful for mana of both color and is a creature, and gets me a white spirit in addition to a sac outlet for Teysa, so I supposed it's got 3 abilities. If you do end up trading that wrath, let me know.

Besides, the recursion on cauldron works for as many creatures as I want, so in a pinch I can at least get double use out of sacking creatures to Teysa as well as their ETB or ETG abilities.

i don't deny that cauldron has uses, but i think that you might have to start asking the rough questions i had to ask myself if you want the deck to run faster, and get rid of some of the stuff that is "good" but not "great". you have a really high 5 drop curve and i think turning cauldron into something like Orzhov Signet could shift the curve a bit more aggressively.

The curve is a bit misleading since I have so many large cost creatures that hardly ever get hardcasted. It could still get cut though, so I'll do another reassessment after I get a few games in with the current edits.

Just dropped in a False Prophet for times of necessity when you really need a quick board wipe, hopefully by sacking a few creatures first.

so ridiculous that it exiles stuff, i hate to say it but that card does work in a deck that reanimates so well, especially since it doesn't exile itself like most cards that exile at the cost of the permanent.

Definitely gets the job done when you need it to. Honestly, this deck is pretty much done aside from the few cards in the maybeboard...though it's going to take me a while to find the lands. Not many people have w/b high dollar lands available for trade. On the fence about All Hallow's Eve too, though the idea seems very useful, especially late game when I have a few things in the graveyard. Magister is a maybe though since I'm not totally sold on the voting mechanic. I think I'd have to see how that all plays out first.

A few sac outlet suggestions I use in my Teysa: Mind Slash , Infernal Tribute

hereticloki This deck is more about gravedigging rather than sacrificing. I have a deck that does that, I will kill you till you die and it runs both of those. They work great in that deck btw.

ever think about running dredge like Golgari Thug ? could be an interesting way to ditch cards to the graveyard. also Necroplasm is a way you could wipe tokens the turn it drops and small creatures in proceeding turns, as well as turn things like Vampiric Tutor into an Entomb when you want them to be.

I have, but dredge is a little too unpredictable. There are many cards in the deck that I wouldn't want in the graveyard, and the tradeoff isn't good enough. What happens when 4 recursion spells get dumped in the graveyard while I have a hand full of large costing creatures? If it was discard from your hand, then that would be a whole other story. Necroplasm also take a turn around to kill anything worthwhile since he only gets counters during your upkeep. I am looking for a Vampiric Tutor though. I think that would be a good addition.

Necroplasm nukes all CMC 0 creatures the turn it comes out, which would be all tokens and 0 drops, since it checks at end of turn and would have 0 counters. if you were going to run dredge i would say do it on a creature that has another major utility such as that to be a "i can if i want to" option instead of something like Stinkweed Imp who's sole purpose is to dredge.

Not sure how I missed the "converted mana cost" part, but yes, now I see how that would be useful. Makes for a pretty big target though. I'll have to give it some thought.

Picked up a Path to Exile and swapped out the Gift of Immortality . Too many people run exiling spot removal for it to be that useful. Recursion ends up working better in that regard, hence the inclusion of Footsteps of the Goryo which can turn an Ashen Rider into a 3 cost double exile. Ditched the Witchbane Orb since True Believer is much easier to grab out of the deck and there are so many graveyard exiling cards out there that it's just going to have to be a downside to the deck style. No sense taking up valuable slots just to protect against something that I can't really stop anyway. Relic of Progenitus negates it all anyway.

you should just try to get an exception to run ashen rider as your general.

Seriously.

I wish you lived near me Freezerboy. I would love to play against this. It has come a long way since I first saw it.

Thanks man, it's the first deck I've wanted to put the extra time and effort into getting it just right.

I know you are going for recursion and types of effects; have you considered Whip of Erebos ? Also, looks like you are foiling it out. I may have some foils you lack. I will have to check.

i think the goal is infinite recursion and whip only lets you recur it once. I've seen him play ashen rider out of his graveyard 6+ times in one game easily without using any sort of combo. plus 8 mana for a resurrect is really costly. Yawgmoth's Will could be a really good power play to get mileage out of revives and small creatures, just no sac tricks that turn.