Nevermind... no good way to break it yet that is competitive in modern. Best that I have (as far as a deck I would be interested in playing) involves This plus Grand Architect + Painter's Servant + Semblance Anvil ... but that's just not realistic
March 4, 2016 2:06 a.m.
FullmetalWes says... #3
Hey btw, have you ever considered running something like Train of Thought? Once you have the combo going, if you don't have a wincon piece you can draw into it.
March 10, 2016 1:36 p.m.
That's certainly an interesting idea, and a good suggestion.
I think the problem is that, while it can act as a wincon, the decks current set-up makes it so that Artificer's Intuition would be just as powerful in most infinite scenarios, and more powerful in non infinite scenarios. I don't have a need for more intuitions, but Train of Thought would be a fantastic replacement in a deck which was less artifact-focused.
March 10, 2016 2:12 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #5
Ask yourself, what's the difference between Train of Thought and Blue Sun's Zenith?
March 10, 2016 2:21 p.m.
FullmetalWes says... #6
Blue Sun's Zenith is one spell that can be countered, Train of Thought is made into multiple spells that can only be countered by something like Counterflux. Plus if you really just need to draw a card to get to the combo it's easier to pay 2 than 4.
March 10, 2016 2:25 p.m.
Being able to be fetched at cmc = 2 is also a boon, but yes, it serves much the same purpose as zenith. BSZ is an instant, while train is harder to counter. Both are reasonable can trips, given that they work as wincons.
March 10, 2016 2:46 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #8
Okay my comment was pretty unclear and came off more sarcastic than I intended. Basically, all the reasons that you cut BSZ from the deck apply to TOT as well, making it a good card, but more of a win-more card in this deck.
March 10, 2016 2:54 p.m.
ScruffySpydr says... #9
I'm just gonna leave this here.
Leyline of Anticipation + Pili-Pala on turn 2 + Grand Architect on 3= infinite mana on the declare attackers step and now your deck is at instant speed.
March 27, 2016 7:02 a.m.
It's powerful in a combo situation, but the leyline is a dead card outside of the combo. The deck can't be adjusted to play at sorcery speed and then brought to instant speed by leyline either. It would become too reliant on leyline.
Basically: leyline doesn't let the deck do anything it can't already do. Granted the deck might win at instant speed more often, but at what cost? I either sacrifice removal, consistency via cantrips, or board presence. All three of those are elements which the deck just barely holds its ground on.
I would love to include the leyline, but I just don't think there is room.
This all said, I'll still test leyline to see if it improves consistency enough to be worth aforementioned sacrifices.
March 27, 2016 12:11 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #11
It could be a sideboard card. Definitely not in this current meta, but if counterspells become a thing in modern, Leyline could become a fantastic sideboard option.
March 27, 2016 7:37 p.m.
Ok so with tezzerator (Sword of the Meek
+
Thopter Foundry
control) and U/R delver on the rise thanks to Sword of the Meek, and control decks being on the rise due to Ancestral Vision (which is too slow for this deck) I'm going to need to re-tool here.
My first thought is that I need more Engineered Explosives, as it takes care of thopter tokens and the like quite well. I'm not certain of this though, as artifact hate like Stony Silence will be going up (due to tezzerator) so maybe I need to add some Declaration in Stone to the main board, maybe as a two of, instead. Both work well against SotM decks, given that they are creature based.
My second thought is that maybe it's time for Myr Superion to get either side-boarded or removed. Flying creatures are going to become more common, and unless eldrazi decks stick around in strength, I won't need a huge blocker like that; maybe I could use fliers instead, or just more removal. If superion does go, Leyline of Anticipation might better replace AEther Vial since superion was the deciding factor in making vial superior prior.
Painter's Servant would drop from the side-board. I'll wait for the meta to solidify before messing with the sideboard though.
The other option I have available is to run the Sword of the Meek
+
Thopter Foundry
combo myself. The components conveniently fall at cmc=2, and work quite well with infinite mana. Heck, maybe Painter's Servant stays in the sideboard, because he would also enable GA + thopter sword as an infinite combo.
Thopter sword combo would mean cutting superions and vials, and I won't know prior to testing whether it does all that much for the deck.
Long story short, anyone have any thoughts?
April 6, 2016 2:11 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #13
I like the idea of adding Thopter Sword to this deck. Although I don't think you need Painter's Servant because Thopter Foundry makes blue tokens already.
April 6, 2016 2:46 p.m.
Oh indeed it does... I missed that. Ok so adding thopter sword to this means cutting superions and... Cutting vial feels real bad, but I become too light on creatures to really justify it after cutting superions.
definitely can lose hangar back. So that's 4 not counting vial, 8 counting it. Since I'm down to 12 creatures I kind of want the leyline, but then it doesn't work with transmute as well as vial.
I could cut chalice and cut intuition, then maybe also cut longbow and trinket Mage...
April 6, 2016 3:18 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #15
I still like longbow and Tez in here even post-changes. I agree with cutting Superion, Vial, and Hangarback. I don't like Leyline in here.
If you add Thopter-Sword, play 2 Sword of the Meek and 3 Thopter Foundry, no more. Maybe you can get by on 2 Foundry, but you don't want 4 of each.
Declaration in Stone seems extremely bad to me. If you want thopter-foundy hate, sideboard Extirpate or Rest in Peace, the former of which seems better to me.
April 6, 2016 3:35 p.m.
Well... With that 5-set swap I think I'd just go for cutting hangar back, superion, and some 5th card.
April 6, 2016 6:02 p.m.
The more I think about thopter sword the less I like it. It has to be good outside of the combo, even if I don't have both foundry and sword, given that they won't be 4 ofs and aren't easy to fetch.
This means more artifacts for the foundry, at which point I want at least one more Artificer's Intuition both for consistency and discarding sword, and that means cutting into my removal and cantrips, turning Serum Visions into Mishra's Bauble, Path to Exile into more chalices and explosives, and turning some number of lands into Mox Opal because now I might as well just go for early metal craft.
The deck just starts feeling like a tezzerator which was rehashed to include a true infinite combo for funzies. Maybe what I do is cut Pili-Pala in favor of Thopter Foundry and superion for SotM, and then continue on. I still have two GA centered infinite combos at that point (GA foundry and sword = infinite thopters, life, and colorless mana; GA + tez + staff), but I can drop some of the pili style combos for something more powerful. Another intuition here, an Astral Cornucopia there... You get the idea.
April 6, 2016 9:24 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #18
I somewhat agree. Running Thopter Sword would make this into just a janky Tezzerator, which is not what you want.
However, I do think a middle ground (on a new decklist to keep this one intact) is worth a shot. I think the most optimal starting point is: -4 AEther Vial, -3 Myr Superion, +3 Thopter Foundry +2 Sword of the Meek +1 Artificer's Intuition, +1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas.
April 6, 2016 9:41 p.m.
I think I would go for 4 foundry 3 sword and rebuild the list from there. I agree on making a new list though. Seems like a good idea.
April 6, 2016 10:39 p.m.
While I realize you are trying to get nutty with the combos, have you considered something like: Turbo Architect
May 16, 2016 9:40 p.m.
Friend, I fail to see how I am being more nutty with combos than the list provided. Yes, the list you provided will likely assemble it's combo components a turn or two faster, but it has absolutely no game plan against aggro decks, which is a huge problem. Cards like BSZ and Jin gitaxis are next to useless outside of the combo. I suppose I it ultimately comes down to preference of lists, but this deck is built the way it is so that it may best handle aggro decks, and does not worry overly about beating other combo or control decks because the pili pala combo is already fast, hard to disrupt when played intelligently, and wins instantly when assembled.
Summatively: yes I have considered lists like the one linked. I have foregone them because they are too polar for my taste: they can't lose against control, go 50/50 against other combo decks, and almost cannot win against aggro.
May 16, 2016 10:54 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #22
I really need to alter out my modern decks. I actually have a few alters in paper that I made (I just did my 2nd Nighthawk last weekend) but I always forget that Tappedout has alters on it, and it makes the deck look so much better. I'm going to go alter-digging now.
May 16, 2016 11:16 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #24
All done with Rocket Science. I ended up using quite a few of your alters. I'll have to try and scan then upload my own Nighthawk alters since I'm very proud of them, but that might be more work than I'm expecting.
DuTogira says... #1
Already trying to find a way to break this card combined with Grand Architect in a deck that doesn't even use Pili-Pala. If anyone has any ideas, let me know.
March 4, 2016 1:48 a.m.