Melira, Sylvok Outcast will let you go infinite with persist and a Spawning Pit

Yes, you really should be using Melira here, it makes it so easy to abuse persist.

maybe ill make a separate deck for her. there are ways of abusing melira to much greater lengths than this. but she does not fit into this build very well.

I am aiming to manipulate the -1 counters to my benefit. so eliminating them will not help me very much..

thank you for the suggestion though. I appreciate the input =)

Well actually Master Biomancer already lets u go infinite, as the +1/+1 counters cancel out the -1/-1 counters, then just add in a sec outlet (Spawning Pit) and bam your done

Oh wow, I had no idea. I had to look it up.

121.3. If a permanent has both a +1/+1 counter and a -1/-1 counter on it, N +1/+1 and N -1/-1 counters are removed from it as a state-based action, where N is the smaller of the number of +1/+1 and -1/-1 counters on it.

Yep, how cool is that :P

Snazzy... But kinda cripples Power Conduit if it and Master Biomancer are out

I really like this except for what Dark_Void pointed out. Still very awesome.

I would remove 1x Spawning Pit for one more Gyre Sage, add in one more Hallowed Fountain in place of 1x Stirring Wildwood and lastly consider removing Mana Tithe. Mana Tithe is nice but a hand with a Tithe and a Path to Exile means I can't get to the point where I'm playing the deck the way it should be played fast enough. In place of the Tithes I would add the fourth Path to Exile and then either Strangleroot Geist or Spellskite. Spellskite will help a lot more vs Twin and Strangleroot will help more vs Jund since jund has Abrupt Decay, Tasigur, the Golden Fang and Liliana of the Veil.

I know many of you are probably thinking "How the heck is Geist Valid against Tasigur scrub!?" Well if you playtest the deck you'll see that early we are trying to set up 2 or 3 card engines and then T5 slam down a Sigarda, Host of Herons who blocks like a pro and creates a distraction from our combo pieces here. What this means is if the opponent is on the play and swings with a Tasigur T4, we have played possibly as little as 2 cards so far. Sometime one of them was an artifact as well. So having Geist increases our ability to blow the first swing of Tasigur while we are trying to get mana to land Sigarda. Mana Tithe can also just counter Tasigur, but if he is played on T3 by a jund player they were likely planning on keeping up Bolt mana in the first place, hence, Mana tithe may be insufficient.

The weakest card I see is Spawning Pit. Maybe I don't know the deck well enough, though.

I don't like three Mana Tithe in a deck. I'd say it's a 1-of at the most.

I'd run another Gavony Township if you could fit it in.

That was one of my first thoughts. I think it's a fine thing to side "in" against board wipes but other than that it's the only card besides Mana Tithe that i'm iffy about.

how you lose the -1-1 counters? i dont see how if a creature with perist die get a -1-1 counter, then if u put a +1+1 counter on him the creature have a +1+1 counter and a -1-1 counter.. then perisit didnt work

Just with the artifact power conduit i think melira is much better

You lose the -1/-1 counters by using Power Conduit....

then you put a charge counter onto this thing, then you sacrifice another creature to put a -1/-1 counter on it and a charge counter onto Spawning Pit and can make a 2/2.

Melira would ruin this deck. The Power Conduit is used to remove -1/-1 counters from creatures with Persist so that they keep eating Lightning Bolt, Lightning Helix and other spells, as well as keep on chumping Tasigur, the Golden Fang and tokens until Sigarda, Host of Herons is able to fly over whatever ground forces the opponent has.

I really don't see how Melira, Sylvok Outcast would, or could, 'ruin' this deck. The biggest difference is that the conduit is just once per turn, while melira is a permanent effect, and, as has been mentioned goes infinite with many of your creatures, and you could even get infinite life with it on turn 4.

Neuz this is the rule: 121.3. If a permanent has both a +1/+1 counter and a -1/-1 counter on it, N +1/+1 and N -1/-1 counters are removed from it as a state-based action, where N is the smaller of the number of +1/+1 and -1/-1 counters on it.

DaftVader yeah its a cheaper Master Biomancer (which is y is sees play

so um.. thanks for the feedback XDi didnt expect even half this response.

i will do some more in depth playtesting of melira. my hope is that she will make me that much more safe from spot removal of biomancer in the midgame. my worry is she could cause some dead hands, since she wouldnt fit the board with a power conduit. so one of them would have to wait.

kengiczar pretty much summed up everything for me lol. there was something i wanted to clear up though.

basically, it's the melira vs biomancer debate..Since melira will almost never be hitting on turn 2 in this deck anyway, biomancer is strictly the better card. melira makes my creatures unkillable. in turn, this gives the potential for infinite life. that's it. thats all she does to benefit me. the downside being that she makes Power Conduit a dead draw. biomancer does the same thing, and has great synergy with Power Conduit. but in addition, he makes my other creatures bigger. in combination with Vines of Vastwood you can buff your field for +4/+4 the instant your opponent tries to kill him (hows that for a win condition). just as well, every time you put a counter on him, either from Power Conduit or from Gavony Township, everything you play or replay from persist after that point will receive the same bonus. lastly, he is much less likely to die to burn.

as for the other edits you guys suggested, i like pretty much all the other suggestions (some more than others), so i will playtest them tonight once i update my deck library to include the new, modern, collected company decks. ill update things as soon as im done. and then ill start getting a sideboard ready.

and of course thanks to all of you for the suggestions and comments. you've helped me understand my own deck that much better. Whether i agreed or disagreed with you, its still a huge help! =D THANK YOU!!

so, heres the update. Mana Tithe is gone entirely from mainboard, in it's place we have 3 Strangleroot Geists, cuz those little guys can do some work. because of that change, there was no way i was curving my mana further towards w/u. so instead i playtested running 2 Gavony Township and i loved the result. if biomancer gets killed, this just acts as another way to keep my persist creatures alive.

i balanced the artifacts slightly too. Culling Dais just doesnt work out as well when it comes down to raw ability to sac creatures. (which btw, the ability to dodge Path to Exile by sacrificing is just awesome)

as for melira. she will be sideboarded. she seemed to be helpful against decks with a lot of spot removal. (i.e. most black decks.) but she doesnt seem to give me any more advantage than i aleady wouldve had in other games. and against burn, she suffers. being vulnerable to both Magma Jet, and Shock.. not to mention Pillar of Flame. she is just too squishy to be mainboard in the current modern meta. biomancer can soak up a bolt and a pillar, and then using vines is soooooo worth it.

anyway, im probably going to tweak my numbers on creatures a little bit once i make a sideboard, but for the most part i think im happy with this as a final build.

thanks again for all your help, everyone! but please, keep giving me ideas, if you think of anything =D

Dromoka's Command would be good either in the main or at least in the sideboard. Currently this deck is shut down almost completely by Rest in Peace post-board, so make sure you shore that up somehow.

Yea, I was trying to work out dealing with Leyline of the Void as well. I was thinking enchantment hate or wrath would be good, but I'll have to playtest it.

Thanks for pointing that out =)

master biomancer should be a 4 of. It combos infinitely with persist creatures and its pretty solid in general.

Nice deck, reminds me a bit of the counter mash-up experiment I put up here recently, but more fleshed out. +1 for using persist with something else than just Melira.

I think Heartmender would be great in this deck, unlimited persist

ill be honest, i didnt even know that card existed XD

ill give it a whirl in here and playtest it. im worried it will be a bit too slow, since its cost is the same as biomancer, and it's effect only triggers on upkeep. we'll see how it fairs tho.

anyway, ty for the suggestion and kind words. always appreciated! =)

Watch how Kulrath Knight is going to screw up your day. +1 counters still apply to his ability >:)