U/G(Simic) Pioneer Merfolk

Pioneer Shoku

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swearwolf says... #1

Cool list. The counters version is compelling, but I don't know if it works in practice. I'll have to do some play testing. Try out River Sneak, Deeproot waters, and Kumena. I think the synergy between those three cards is so strong.

January 2, 2018 8:15 p.m.

Shoku says... #2

Thanks swearwolf, I play a Merfolk deck in Standard currently and I found that Deeproot Waters is great with River Sneak with the right hand and is also great with Metallic Mimic, doubling the token's power and toughness and becoming unblockable with a Herald of Secret Streams. Most of the time though, Deeproot feels like a dead draw because it doesn't do anything the turn you play it. If i can play a few River Sneaks on turns 2 and 3, turn 4 Deeproot Waters is basically the game if you play a Kumena's Speaker with it. Most of the time the deck doesn't do that though. With Rivals coming soon, I'm very excited to try everything to try and make Merfolk work. I think Deeproot Waters may actually be strong enough with Kumena, Tyrant of Orazca. Thank you for the advice!

January 2, 2018 8:31 p.m.

Shoku says... #3

xoorath very true! I'm liking the token strategy a lot more now

January 4, 2018 7:05 p.m.

Deeproot Waters turns on Kumena's draw ability with one merfolk spell, so it's fantastic. Honestly I think Seafloor oracle is just better than Herald of Secret Streams because you're going to want as much card advantage as you can get, and if you have Kumena or river sneak you are already guaranteed to get in. Drawing a card is so much better for you than making a couple of your creatures unblockable, because Metallic Mimic is a huge removal target and that's your only consistent way to get +1/+1 counters.

January 4, 2018 10:06 p.m.

Shoku says... #5

I_am_not_Batman I'm inclined to agree with you, in Ixalan the only thing making Merfolk somewhat work was the +1/+1 counters on them making them unblockable, 8 lords and Kumena's last ability aren't enough to make Herald of Secret Streams work. Unless tomorrow we get a Merfolk that makes the counter build more viable, I think Seafloor Oracle is going to replace Herald, at least in my list.

January 4, 2018 11 p.m.

FlabbyAbs says... #6

Love this list. I want to be careful not to compare all merfolk lists with Modern but it seems like Silvergill Adept is an auto 4x of. Standard is slow so it's pretty much a free card.

I'm on the fence about Seafloor Oracle or Herald of Secret Streams. Right now Merfolk don't have a way to consistently get through blockers. But the counter theme with Merfolk is really good with counter spells.

January 5, 2018 12:55 a.m.

Darsul says... #7

Hey Shoku,

all in all I think all the 4 drop merfolk don't hold water (sorry, couldn't stop my self);

Herald of Secret Streams, Better in EDH then Type 2

Forerunner of the Heralds, 4 drop that dies to shock well, every thing no thank you.

Seafloor Oracle, In theory ok but, when gold fishing a deck with it makes me wonder how many creature you are willing to send over just to push damage through on turn 4 to draw a card and whats the crack back from that choice. I fear it will always hit the board too late or other cards like Vanquisher's Banner or Lifecrafter's Bestiary do better.

in short turn four I feel would be best spent casting 2(qty), 2(CMC) drops over 1(qty), 4(cmc) drop but, what do i know.

Metallic Mimic vs Deeproot Elite, Mimic doesn't trigger Deeproot Waters (on EBT) and Elite dodges artifact removal. Now if your running say the banner or Bestiary you may just run mimic too eat artifact removal, not sure that's where you every really want to be but, it's an option.

The biggest issue facing merfolk I see are the gods and flyers. Finding answer to flyers isn't hard but, the gods how ever are another story. what have you found that works?

GL HF

January 5, 2018 1:45 a.m.

Shoku says... #8

Unsummon is definitely good, I did have it in the sideboard but removed it for Kumena. Will probably make it's way back in once things have stabilized a bit.

January 5, 2018 11:27 a.m.

Dragonon says... #9

@Darsul Actually, Metallic Mimic triggers Deeproot Waters because it already enters the battlefield as a Merfolk (You name his creature type before an actual ETB would trigger). Therefore, your argument is invalid.

January 5, 2018 8:07 p.m.

Dragonon says... #10

Oops. Like you say it, it sounds like it would triggger on ETB (I know many people who make misstakes on the Mimic ETB's). Your absolutely correct, my misstake.

January 5, 2018 8:10 p.m.

McKendry2 says... #11

I feel like standard merfolk is in a good place, if the game wasn't so aggressive right now. Your creatures are all generally small at start and are prone to red, white, and black removal. I think one of the strongest includes in the new set is actually Swift Warden. Swift Warden actually has a sizable body for a merfolk and if you remember how effective W/U spirits were back in Shadows Over Innistrad block, the two strongest cards were Flash creatures that acted as anti-removal( Spell Queller and Rattlechains ). Merfolk have now taken up the Tempo strategy from where Spirits left off, but are lacking a critical control color. The fact that we can have a QuellerChains effect IN GREEN is a blessing.

January 5, 2018 8:20 p.m.

McKendry2 says... #12

Don't dismiss your 4-drops. They are going to be necessary for Merfolk to have a decisive finisher. You can really easily cast out your entire hand with 1,2,and 3-drops and then you're vulnerable. Kumena, Tyrant of Orazca and Herald of Secret Streams are a potentially game winning combo. The new Seafloor Oracle and Riverwise Augur are fantastic utility cards. Running a single of both can provide you necessary card draw and card value later in the game. Who doesn't love a Brainstorm in standard?!

I'm a lover of value Flash creatures, so I even run 2 Snapping Sailback as the top end of my Merfolk deck. Nobody expects you to be able to produce an actually usable 5-drop in Merfolk tribal (I'm look at you Wind Strider), It's got the biggest body in your deck, and casting it turn-5 for a surprise block will both seriously hurt your opponent's board state for your next attack, but the Sailback's Enrage trigger functions beautifully with your Herald of Secret Streams, turning into a 5/5+ Unblockable Beater. Dinosaurs are just bigger, scalier Merfolk :D

January 5, 2018 8:30 p.m.

Darsul says... #13

@ McKendry2

Personal I feel with Herald of Secret Streams that Tempest Caller is better, both open the door for a big swing but, the caller doesn't have restriction but, only good for the turn. Herald while always on it has restriction they you can't always meet. While yes we all would love to cast Brainstorm in standard, Seafloor Oracle is nothing like that. It's more like Synapse Sliver or Bident of Thassa. That said Mist-Cloaked Herald does make the Oracle look better. I don't think the real problem is how aggressive the format is ATM or the amount of removal ( i mean we're in blue right?). It's we need consistency, the mana fixing isn't great, what do you run counter spell support or combat tricks support and the biggest missing link is (i feel) we need 1 more 2 drop bear with Merfolk matters(a.k.a merfolk cost 1 less to cast or the like) and evasion (hex-proof to dodge removal or unblock-able or death touch you get the ideal). On top of hating on the 4 drop I also, don't like Merfolk Branchwalker, becoming a 3/2 doesn't do much (can trade with Winding Constrictor now), exploring doesn't do much (doesn't trigger something) and if you get a land your opponent know you got just land.

January 6, 2018 7:25 a.m.

Shoku says... #14

Darsul I think McKendry2 was talking about Riverwise Augur. It's a 2/2 for 4 mana that Brainstorms when it ETBS.

January 6, 2018 3:36 p.m.

Cloudypie says... #15

Have you been trying out water trap weaver? In modern, it's been working great since as a tempo aggro deck, effectively removing a creature and adding one of your own is a huge swing. Also it allows you to push through damage against decks like god pharaoh's gift and bristling hydras and big dinosaurs.

January 6, 2018 8:21 p.m.

Shoku says... #16

Cloudypie I haven't, no. I did used to run Tempest Caller before Rivals, but Herald of Secret Streams seemed like the better option. Now though without Herald and with less of a +1/+1 counter theme, I might consider running it again.

January 7, 2018 1:46 p.m.

Hashdaddy says... #17

@Shoku I've done some extensive testing for the fishys for standard and personally I've found that Tempest Caller works out better than Herald of Secret Streams. Namely because once the etb happens your opponent cant stop the swing in that follows whereas with Herald he is susceptible to a kill spell and your swing is now block able. Tapping your opponents creatures also grants some ease of mind for any abilities they may want to use before combat. Here also the addition of Merfolk Mistbender was something that merfolk really needed to get competitive. Your decklist is the first one that I've seen that seems to be heading in the right direction. What is your opinion on Spell Pierce and Expel from Orazca? The combo potiental from Expel is nice along with the toolkit use to get some board clear from a god or planeswalker or whatever has landed.

January 7, 2018 2:19 p.m.

Shoku says... #18

Hashdaddy I love spellpierce, it together with Admiral's order gives you a lot of control over your opponent, i don't know if i would run Expel from Orazca over unsummon though. I will definitely look into it though.

January 7, 2018 9:16 p.m.

Shirubaurufu says... #19

So I'm doing something very similar to this, though without so many two drops and using the Jade Bearer in the main board.

My original iteration of the deck did have the Merfolk Branchwalker and Metallic Mimic as well as the Kopala, Warden of Waves and River Sneak in the main, though I eventually cut the Branchwalker, Mimic & Sneak out (most recent iteration saw Sneak come and go) to run Kumena's Speaker, Mist-Cloaked Herald, Blossoming Defense and Jade Bearer in the 1 slot, given that the Bearer is strictly better than Jungle Delver and even if the Bearer is a vanilla 1/1 for 1, it's still a decent play.

Now, I'm not saying Branchwalker, Mimic & Sneak aren't good, they really are and if they work for you, that's perfect cool.

The variation I'm currently using has 12 2 drops, being Silvergill Adept, Merfolk Mistbinder and Deeproot Elite which, to me, causes Branchwalker & Mimic to add some clunkiness to the deck and the board, given I'll be stuck with multiple two drops in hand and maybe not have enough land to get everything out when I would want it.

As far as the Mimic/Elite plan, I tried it out myself for a little while and eventually settled on Elite, as it's already a Fish (for Kumena's Speaker) and can add counters to itself. Though I will say that having a Mimic & Elite on board isn't insane, as the creature you play gets a counter then you get to put a counter on something, but it just adds to the confusion of what do you want first: Elite or Mimic? Which is why Mimic eventually ended up leaving, not only because of individual cost, but to cut down on decisions like that, as Fish is a deck that you want to know what you want to play when, not have to make a call.

As far as Deeproot Waters go, how often are you drawing into it with starting hand vs a few turns later? Also, another card I suggest is Hadana's Climb over Kopala, Warden of Waves main and push Kopala to the side, due to requiring to be against a deck with lots of targeted removal, like Fatal Push or Unsummon and adding 2-3 Herald of Secret Streams given your +/+ counter production is insane.

Though another question I have to ask is by what turn do you normally kill your opponent and how often are Kumena & Kopala useful to you being a 2/2 split?

Have you tested the list with any of the cards in your maybeboard yet? What were the results if so?

One last question I have is how well is your deck performing with 19 lands?

Mine, which you can find on my profile if you want to look, runs 22 and sometimes ends up getting not enough mana, but eventually pulls through in some cases (though if I'm stuck on 2 mana for too long against an aggro deck like WB Vamps, I'm screwed.)

I highly doubt Standard Fish will end up having a specific list that ends up doing well, and can be variated multiple times over and still be good. Maybe not tier 1, but tier 2 or 1.5, just enough to give the bigger dogs a run for the money.

January 8, 2018 1:37 a.m.

Shagoth says... #20

People really underestimated Mist Cloaked and Deeproot Elite. They were the best cards in this deck, and people said that a one cmc unblockable was underpowered and that the two drop slot was clogged, but the synergy of these two swinging for and unblockable 5 points of damage from that little guy was tough when it was backed by an impressive army.

January 8, 2018 4:28 p.m.

Shoku says... #21

Shagoth When I first saw Mist-Cloaked Herald I immediately knew it would be good. I remember when Ixalan first game out and people were playing around with Merfolk, I saw a lot of Slither Blade despite it not even being a Merfolk.

January 8, 2018 4:50 p.m.

Shirubaurufu says... #22

Shagoth the reason people say the two drop slot is clogged is due to Merfolk Branchwalker, Metallic Mimic, Deeproot Elite, Silvergill Adept, River Sneak , Merfolk Mistbinder, as well as some others i'm sure i'm forgetting, that are available to the Fish tribe in the current standard meta. That's why Fish is such an odd tribe to build with right now, lots of different ways to go about it.

January 8, 2018 4:52 p.m.

Shoku says... #23

Shirubaurufu There are so many 2 drops in the tribe, and honestly the all seem strong. It seems weird to think that before Rivals, the best 2 drops in the tribe are now some of the less good ones.

January 8, 2018 4:55 p.m.

Shirubaurufu says... #24

Shoku You definitely aren't wrong. Though before RIX, Fish as a deck was thought impossible and incapable of withstanding the pressure from the others, not just the big dogs. But now, it gives me hope.

January 8, 2018 5:05 p.m.

Shoku says... #25

Shirubaurufu you are definitely right about not standing up to the bigger decks, my past couple of FNMs have been on the slightly sad side.

January 8, 2018 5:11 p.m.

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