Coward_Token: Hey, thanks for throwing in some ideas. I'll probably avoid putting sorceries and instants in the deck since they're nonbos with the commander, except for Primal Surge as a finisher. With it I can get Combat Celebrant/Scourge of the Throne/Breath of Fury + Mortuary + permanent haste source (there's tons of them!) and probably finish from there with huge hasty beaters and endless attack phases.
Why Godo, Bandit Warlord? It only untaps samurais! Could fetch vigilance equipment though.
Not sure about Lantern of Insight and Extractor Demon, they need to be out together to really work. I like Aetherworks Marvel, definitely works well with the rest. Will get Scroll Rack if I can afford it, at least I already have most of the more expensive cards listed or am able to get them for cheap.
June 17, 2018 1:02 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #3
Yeah I used the wording "to some extent" about the replacements because they all have some restriction and/or need to be supplemented with something else (Godo needs vigilance, Breath needs some kind of creature engine etc.). Primal Surge + e.g Gravepurge sounds like a lot of fun, eheheh.
June 17, 2018 3:01 p.m.
PaulaTicks says... #4
Liliana Vess works very well with your commander, tutor up whatever permanent you want then swing with your dragon to play it for free.
June 17, 2018 4:45 p.m.
Coward_Token: I'd like to avoid supplementing with other cards when there might be better options out there, but I'll keep them in mind :)
PaulaTicks: Woah, that's perfect! Thanks!
June 18, 2018 12:33 p.m.
Coward_Token: I found a less janky way of endless combat steps with Primal Surge, just roll out Grand Warlord Radha + Savage Ventmaw + Aggravated Assault (cheaper) or Hellkite Charger (expensive) + any haste source + enough creatures to pay for extra attack steps. Some cards that might show up along the way can help protect the attackers such as Vigor, Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and Cauldron of Souls. You can also get enough mana to recast Squee, the Immortal as sacrifice fodder and/or tap Feldon of the Third Path to get "endless" copies of pretty much any non-legendary creature in the graveyard, for example fun stuff like It That Betrays to really hammer down that victory.
Although it's most likely a guaranteed win if Primal Surge resolves, I'd probably not like to make the deck tutor it up and cast it consistently because it'd turn boring quickly for everyone.
June 19, 2018 5:04 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #7
Yeah I didn't mention those as they're not unique to the commander, but hey redundancy is usually a good thing. I'm personally not a huge fan of neo-Squee; in my own deck I'm looking more into token generators that trigger each combat for the purpose of feeding the commander, e.g. Grave Titan and Goblin Rabblemaster.
June 20, 2018 12:43 a.m.
kothoped kills you if anyone can sacrifice at instant speed by decking yourself
June 21, 2018 1:59 a.m.
Coward_Token: About trying to make endless combat phases with Combat Celebrant and/or Scourge of the Throne using Vaevictis Asmadi, the Dire, Mortuary wont put them on top of the library until after Vaevictis's ability fully resolves, and Haunted Crossroads can't put them there while Vaevictis ability resolves. To get around that there's two things you can do:
- Alternate between them because if both attack and add another combat phase, no creature will untap for the second one. This ends when you can no longer trigger Scourge of the Throne because you have the most life.
- Sacrifice one of them with a free sacrifice outlet in response to Vaevictis Asmadi, the Dire's ability after resolving the extra combat phase trigger and bring them to the top of the library before his triggered ability starts resolving. You will have to sacrifice something else to Vaevictis, but it wont matter if it's a creature token. Combat Celebrant can do this endlessly but Scourge of the Throne ends when you have the most life.
Second alternative is the truly endless one (until your opponents lose the game, as long as they can lose the game that is), but it means you have to supplement your deck with a free sacrifice outlet that doesn't disrupt the combo. That is usually not a bad thing to have, so I'm considering it.
Tentacprf: Great catch! I'd really like to avoid that and it's very possible that it can happen in my meta, so thank you for pointing it out!
June 22, 2018 1:51 a.m.
baddkaarma says... #11
Cool deck, I noticed a lot of chatter about Combat Celb/Scourge of the Throne but don't see them in the deck. Any reason why not?
June 29, 2018 9:15 a.m.
baddkaarma: Good question! Seems like I got stuck just thinking about having to supplement them for a janky endless combat phases combo so I forgot that they themselves benefit the commander and the deck greatly just by doing their thing. I'll put them in the maybeboard until playtesting shows how well the deck fares in my casual meta. They'll probably be included in the next revision!
June 29, 2018 10:43 a.m.
ownagefactory says... #14
Something to note. Primal Surge is a may ability. You only repeat if you choose to put the permanent on the battlefield. You can just surge till you hit a combo/protection then stop to help prevent drawdeath or a Cyclonic Rift blowout. I also find Warstorm Surge a great alt-win for primal surge to combat tax (Sphere of Safety or Collective Restraint) based pillowfort strategies.
June 29, 2018 6:47 p.m.
ownagefactory: Good points! Overextending with Primal Surge is a real risk that you have to take in account when playing it, and those risks depend on the meta. Luckily in my meta I don't have to take Cyclonic Rift or pillowfort strategies into account, most I ever see is Ghostly Prison, Propaganda and wraths that affect everyone. I've put in a lot of recursion and protection to be able to deal with and come back from a lot of wraths.
June 30, 2018 4:12 a.m.
Coward_Token says... #16
The most straightforward answer I can think of when it comes to avoid being blown away by Cyclonic Rift is first setting up some kind Instant hate, e.g. the aforementioned Conqueror's Flail, War's Toll or maybe Price of Glory.
June 30, 2018 6:58 a.m.
Coward_Token: Conqueror's Flail stops Cyclonic Rift from being cast during your own turn, the player casting it could just do it during another opponents turn. I really like War's Toll and Price of Glory to solve the instant problem, especially the second one as I think it'll draw less hate because it's easier to play around but still stops most instants.
June 30, 2018 8:55 a.m.
Coward_Token says... #18
Oh I figured that since you've got Urabrask the Hidden in the deck as a haste source for all your creatures, the plan was to just straight up kill everyone on the turn Primal Surge is dropped
June 30, 2018 9:08 a.m.
Coward_Token: With Conqueror's Flail they can respond to the equip with Cyclonic Rift. I'd like to win when playing Primal Surge, which is why I also have Garna, the Bloodflame as a haste enabler, but I think it's boring if it's a guaranteed win. Tension will grow as I dump more and more permanents until I have the combo, then someone might save everyone dramatically with a well placed spot removal or I win. Sure it might be a setback, but I'll be in a much better position than my opponents.
If you don't like that way of thinking, you can make a version where the combo is even more protected.
July 2, 2018 11:28 a.m.
Hi i like your deck a lot , i am trying to build my own, you gave me a few good idea's. My deck is primal surge too, outside of your commander do you have trouble with removal?
My deck is more of a land matters deck /token deck if you want to take a look still thinking about adding more aristocrat cards: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/woe-unto-the-conquered/?cb=1531914882
Some cards thar you might like (unplaytested):
some tutors permenants : Sidisi, Undead Vizier Brutalizer Exarch Dimir House Guard Mwonvuli Beast Tracker (you don't have to many targets for this one but if you ever add gitrog it can get it too.)
as for haste : Hammer of Purphoros, Need for Speed more lands matter enablers meybe not for you deck.
trying out : Champion of Stray Souls Krav, the Unredeemed Temporal Aperture thy well prob be changed
July 18, 2018 8:43 a.m.
hejin: Hey! I'm glad that my deck serves as some inspiration, just sorry that I wont be playing Primal surge anymore because it wasn't fun to win with it. I think I'm doing well with the removal I have now, but I'm keeping cards as Acidic Slime, Reclamation Sage, Seal of Primordium, Noxious Gearhulk and Ravenous Chupacabra in mind because it's possible that I'll need some of them.
Not a big fan of tutors for this deck except if they're a permanent who puts the card on top of the deck, and Mwonvuli Beast Tracker tutors too few creatures in the deck to be viable.
I really like Need for Speed! It'll be a great addition as the deck is now going towards a lands theme.
Champion of Stray Souls is a really greedy card, but if it's cheated out it might just be good enough! This deck doesn't put out enough creature tokens to make Krav, the Unredeemed good. Temporal Aperture doesn't fit in well with what the rest of the deck is doing.
July 27, 2018 4:50 a.m.
@Wihito Yes after some playtime i am going to remove most of the cards i mentioned moving more to a lands deck as well. And maybe primalsurge could be removed aswel not becous it's cheap but i want some sorc and instances in my deck.
The win i had with surge was in a 3 player game where it was 2v1 becous one player was in a mindslaver lock s i didn't feel bad at that point :D.
July 27, 2018 8:28 a.m.
MoronPlayz says... #23
Maybe Ruric Thar, the Unbowed would be good since commander ability cause you to put permament on battlefield (dont cast it).
August 21, 2018 1:11 p.m.
Brhodes1119 says... #24
You have Hua Tuo, Honored Physician in under performers? Every time I get him out, he does work for me. And I'm really glad to see someone else put Grim Flayer in this deck. I was baffled at how few decklists included that one.
August 25, 2018 3:04 a.m.
Wow that's a nice build!! I built one myself but quit playing it because of the hate it drew just taking it of the deck box. I also got Chaos Wand used on me, needless to say it took about 70 cards to get to Primal Surge and he used it to win the game. But your build is convincing me to it it back together but add more fun elements.
Coward_Token says... #1
You seem to have the only Dire deck that's public at the moment (I have my own private one), so I'm going to go ahead and spew my ideas here:
Commander + Combat Celebrant + Mortuary + a haste source gives endless combat steps. The Celebrant can to some extent be replaced by Breath of Fury, Scourge of the Throne or Godo, Bandit Warlord. Mortuary can to some extent be replaced by Haunted Crossroads or Bone Harvest/Footbottom Feast/Gravepurge. The combo is pretty easily disrupted so Conqueror's Flail or something is probably recommended.
Other interesting topdeck cards I can think of include Lantern of Insight, Extractor Demon (combine with the Lantern to get rid of hostile topdeck bombs), Aetherworks Marvel and Scroll Rack
June 17, 2018 10:50 a.m.