Actually a Tribal deck is considered a heavily themed deck based on specific creatures etc it doesn't have to conform to being 100% that said creature just an fyi. Eladains done an amazing job at making this deck a Vampire Tribal deck.
January 14, 2015 12:22 p.m.
Ya, Ulturas kind of hit it on the head. I mean it's super nitpicking to say a deck isn't tribal when 23/30 creatures all share a sub-type. Even Mikaeus, the Unhallowed who is an undead lord, and Erebos, God of the Dead fit with that subtheme even if they're not specifically vampires. If you're looking at this deck you obviously have some interest in vampires and/or tribal decks. It's quite easy to swap out those 5-7 creatures for other vamps, but you're going to greatly weaken the deck because of the abilities you're losing in the process.
Gray Merchant of Asphodel - I don't think it really needs to be explained how good this card is in a mono-B multi-player deck. Even dropping him at 5 devotion (Which is pretty much a worse case scenario) in a 4-player game (which I play) you're looking at a 20pt life swing for you.
Crypt Ghast - Essentially Cabal Coffers or Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx with a body, but without a 2 mana cost to activate the ability. Or consider it a much cheaper version of Nirkana Revenant without the pump ability.
Rune-Scarred Demon - Tutor on a body with evasion. Nuff said.
Bloodgift Demon - Card Draw. Like Crypt Ghast this takes a great ability, similar to Phyrexian Arena, and puts it on a body. Or if you play Two-Headed Giant you can allow your teammate to draw a card when needed.
Royal Assassin - Really the only card I'd ever consider replacing out of the "non-vamps" in the deck. That being said this guy can buy you multiple turns if you get stuck on 3/4 mana. He HAS to be dealt with before they can swing in on you or their best creature just keeps getting picked off. Vigilance creatures being the obvious exception.
So, yes this is not a 100% vamp deck. If that's what you're after it should be easy enough to make the few substitutions.
January 14, 2015 2:27 p.m.
I do like Liliana of the Dark Realms and she has some nice synergy with cards like Lashwrithe and Nightmare Lash. I do think I would still prefer Liliana Vess and her tutor ability, and it's hard to make multiple cuts at this point.
January 18, 2015 4:41 p.m.
Have you thought of Massacre Wurm? He seems he might be able to have some synergy with your commander and Exquisite Blood. I would also look into Bloodchief Ascension.
January 24, 2015 9:11 a.m.
I have actually toyed with Massacre Wurm a bit. He's nice as a sort of faux-Drown in Sorrow with a body. The downside is that it's just for that turn. For the same cmc Ascendant Evincar gives me a similar, yet constant, effect to slow down token/weenie decks and also pumps my other vampires. It could still prove superior in certain situations though. Like any time Wound Reflection in on the table. I may have to toy with swapping it in for Royal Assassin or something to test further.
I had Bloodchief Ascension in here for a very long time, but I kept encountering 2 issues. #1 If I got it out early it became the priority target for any enchantment removal, which my playgroup runs a fair amount of. #2 if it comes down late, say turn 5/6, it just doesn't feel like I get much value out of it. It's still a really solid card, but I feel like it may be better suited for 1v1 as opposed to say 4-5 player games which I tend to play.
January 24, 2015 9:31 a.m.
Fair enough but I was thinking of the sac caused from your commander with Massacre Wurm lose 2 life everytime a creature dies. Also nice when you board wipe since I see you have many in here. Not trying to push it on you just massacre wurm has done so much work for me. Plus with it stacked on top of the others you already have even large creatures will fall easily.
January 24, 2015 1:17 p.m.
Oh no worries I didn't take it as pushy at all. It's an extremely solid card that does have some nice interactions.
January 25, 2015 1:20 a.m.
griffstick says... #11
Need to add Dictate of Erebos and Grave Pact. I also would consider runing "card draw by death cards" like Harvester of Souls, Grim Haruspex, and Dark Prophecy. Those cards have synergy with your commander. If you add Mortuary to any of the "draw cards" above, then you will always get you creatures back ,without missing your draw step. Additionally if your ok with ruining the vamp theme throw in Massacre Wurm that fucker killed me after i played Army of the Damned. 26 loss of life.
I had a vamp deck like this before amd it was fun. But it wasnt good enough to win. So i ditched the vamp tribal theme and did black theme. Dark Flavor if you want to check it out. Hopfully ot helps you with more suggestions.January 27, 2015 12:11 p.m.
Massacre Wurm Is already on the list to go in, just need to acquire it and decide what to cut.
That aside, I won't be going away from the vamp theme on this deck because it is very fun for me. I've got Oloro, Ageless Ascetic and Nekusar, the Mindrazer decks that are a little more "competitive', although I hate using that word. This is just a fun deck with my favorite tribal flavor. Not really looking for infinite sac combos or things of that nature, but I appreciate the input.
January 27, 2015 12:25 p.m.
I'm having the same issue with knowing what to cut and what not with my B/W lol.
Here are my thoughts anyway there's stuff like Royal Assassin he takes a turn to setup unless you run something with haste a smart player will get rid of it quickly (it's on turn 2-3 give or take earliest you can bring it in most exile/spot creature removal cards only cost 1-3 mana) doesn't really offer anything when you can bring in Massacre Wurm which works insanely well with your deck and procs your Exquisite Blood/Sanguine Bond infinite Blood Artist as well, a lot in here has so much synergy with it.
I'd consider Falkenrath Noble it's more expensive mana wise than Blood Artist but because having both in your deck no one is going to want to board clear so it forces them into a hole of using Exiles or spot creature removal, which can be a double sided blade but if they only Exile one of them you still have the other one as backup.
Coat of Arms can work against you too depending on who you're facing but I think I remember you talking about how your group ran a lot of artifact removal, I'd say it's definitely one to think about though.
Also Underworld Connections kinda pointless as well when there's better card draw like Necropotence when you already have life gain drawing cards is no issue whatsoever a simple Strip Mine and Underworld Connections is gone. I also thought you were running Necropotence?
Sorin Markovs -3 --> Blood Tribute by far it works with Exquisite Blood as well. Imagine your opponent being on 70 hp as an example they lose 60 hp you gain 60 hp from it whereas Blood Tribute only does 35 damage to opponents and you gain 35 hp in that instance, but with Sorins you also put them in an extremely bad position. His ult can also break the game lol.
Another suggestion as well if you're running Thespian's Stage is to run Vesuva too 3x Cabal Coffers from dropping a basic is too easy.
Anyway just my 2 cents.
January 27, 2015 2:12 p.m.
I agree on Royal Assassin, he's on the short list of cut-able cards. He can buy you a few turns if you get hung up on 3/4 mana, but would be one of the few easy cuts for sideboard cards once they're in my possession.
Necropotence is amazing. That's solely an issue of not having one in my inventory and it being someone hard to find via trades. It should be in the sideboard, that's on oversight on my part. Underworld Connections is actually the placeholder for when I do acquire one.
I really like Coat of Arms mainly because I'm the only tribal player in my normal play group. They tend to favor voltron, artifacts, and things of that nature. So the downside is relatively small. It would just feel so wrong to play tribal without one of my favorite anthems.
No arguments on Sorin Markov whatsoever. It's similar to Necropotence where I just need to get my hands on one. This isn't a deck I run out to weekly edh events or anything so the upgrades just sort of happen as the opportunities present themselves. Plus, Sorin Markov is a much more reliable finisher set-up.
Haha, for some reason I always assumed Cabal Coffers was legendary. I feel a bit silly looking at it now.
Solid recommendations. I really appreciate it.
January 27, 2015 3:02 p.m.
griffstick says... #15
Idk if you read my last post but since your commander makes people sac Dark Prophecy, Grim Haruspex, and Harvester of Souls would draw you quite a few more cards then any of the others can
January 27, 2015 3:15 p.m.
I did read your last post, and replied. This isn't a sac themed deck though. Anowon, the Ruin Sage is my commander because he fits the tribal theme, not because I'm building around him. I've even played Erebos, God of the Dead as the commander a few times just based on matchups.
I'm also not a huge fan of relying on a combo (Sac effect+sac=draw) just for card draw. It always feels a bit clunky and unreliable UNLESS it's a sac-themed deck with multiple sac outlets and benefiting effects, which this is not. Yea, you can tutor for them, but I could just as easily tutor for Phyrexian Arena, Bloodgift Demon, Erebos, God of the Dead, etc.. and be fine.
I do appreciate the suggestions though. It's just not what I'm going for with this particular deck.
January 27, 2015 3:25 p.m.
DarkRequiem says... #20
On a budget, ok. But Demonic Tutor exceedes the $10 limit and you have it there. That's why I suggested it.
Anyway, Black Market and Greed are great in a vampire deck.
Some very useful vampires are Bloodghast (more so if you have a way to sac him while Butcher of Malakir is in play), Baron Sengir (most thematic vampire ever!), Falkenrath Noble (counts as a 2nd Blood Artist), Sengir Nosferatu (quite hard to remove), Shauku, Endbringer (great spot removal on legs) and Soul Collector (more so if paired with Onyx Mage) albeit this last one is more for fun and giggles.
February 4, 2015 5:14 p.m.
$10 budget aside from stuff I had on hand. The Demonic Tutor is just the revised version I lucked into via trading.
Black Market just takes a bit too long to ramp up for my taste. Mana hasn't been an issue thus far between things like Cabal Coffers, Crypt Ghast, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, and Nirkana Revenant.
Similar reasons for Greed being absent. I haven't been in need of another card draw engine.
You hit the nail on the head with Bloodghast he really shines with sac outlets, which I don't really run besides Anowon, the Ruin Sage and Sheoldred, Whispering One and they're both pretty susceptible to removal. He could potentially be of more use in 1v1 games, I just tend to play 4-5 player edh.
Baron Sengir suffers from the same problem as Soul Collector in that people are super careful not to feed them, so to speak. They almost require deathtouch equipment or "fight" cards to really get them rolling and cuts are getting tricky.
The Falkenrath Noble is the one card I've gone back and forth on from your list. It may slide in for Blood Seeker at some point. It's always nice to get that value on a board wipe.
February 4, 2015 8:34 p.m.
canterlotguardian says... #22
Magus of the Coffers could be useful. It essentially gives you another Cabal Coffers in the deck.
February 19, 2015 3:05 p.m.
I do like the Magus of the Coffers I just don't think I need much more mana acceleration. Between Cabal Coffers, Thespian's Stage to copy the coffers, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, Crypt Ghast, Nirkana Revenant, & Caged Sun there is quite a bit of ramp.
February 19, 2015 3:21 p.m.
You got my vote, looks like a fun build indeed! The only thing I noticed was Underworld Connections, which I would probably cut for Dark Prophecy.
February 23, 2015 1:56 p.m.
Underworld Connections is currently a placeholder for Necropotence. Just need to get my hands on one. I do like that Connections gives me the option of drawing though instead of Dark Prophecy just in case A) I can't afford the life loss (highly unlikely, but possible) or B) I already have a full hand with no Reliquary Tower in play. Again unlikely, but having the choice of when to draw is a little more appealing then letting my opponents dictate it to some degree.
I do appreciate the feedback though. Thanks!
Lunning155 says... #1
I'm sorry but the deck doesn't seem to be tribal do to the fact that tribal consist of one kind of creature. This has demons, vampires, spirits, zombies, a god, and some humans. To be considered a Tribal Vampire Deck you only need vampires in the deck.
January 14, 2015 12:11 p.m.