Viga-BOOM! (Primer + SB Guide)

Modern nbarry223

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nbarry223 says... #1

Replacing?

June 17, 2014 3:27 p.m.

PrimeEpoch says... #2

Not sure tbh, probably Destructive Revelry and something else.

June 17, 2014 7:13 p.m.

nbarry223 says... #3

Honestly, Qasali Pridemage isn't nearly as useful as Destructive Revelry in this type of build. The fact that I can cast Destructive Revelry through a resolved Blood Moon is big, instant speed is even bigger. I'm very hard-pressed to have the mana for Qasali Pridemage through a Turn 3 (or earlier) Blood Moon

He's useful mainboard as a beater on a stick; but in the side, the body isn't all that relevant since when he goes in, it's to remove things.

June 17, 2014 9:37 p.m.

dunn086 says... #4

I didn't include Scavenging Ooze in my mainboard, I don't really feel it's that useful in most of the matches I've faced. Maybe it's because of my meta game here i guess? (mostly Affinity, Trons, Burn).

June 17, 2014 10:21 p.m.

nbarry223 says... #11

So I was revisiting my manabase to see if I needed to tweak anything to support some of my changes making the deck a little more black reliant, when it dawned on me just how much Manamorphose has to offer this deck (ironically adding it in made me cut the black costed cards I added in the first place).

I ended up taking the advise of Earthsfire and cut cards making room for the 3 Manamorphose I wanted (perfect guess by the way, 4 was too much) and actually ended up with an extra slot available. I've tried a 4th copy of Lotus Cobra and Manamorphose but both felt like they were really bad in multiples or on their own. I also tried a third copy of Glittering Wish (which I've done before) and that felt like it slowed me down too much against the more aggro decks.

As of now, I have Abrupt Decay in the main and I put in Hide/Seek in the side since I've always wanted to give it a shot, but just couldn't find the room for something who's slot is done better by Destructive Revelry in almost every scenario. Basically there's a free slot floating around in the side/main and I haven't really found what works yet. I think I might give the singleton Hive Mind that dunn086 is using a shot also, even though I'm really against it, being utterly useless without a pact. I'm really surprised nobody suggested Manamorphose and I never thought of it myself earlier, it's been working really well for me (there's not really much of a downside to it, haha).

I still need to playtest more to find something that works for that last slot though. I've been unable to thus far, and wouldn't mind more suggestions if anyone has any. I'm currently just going through my maybeboard that I've been considering, even though I doubt I will find anything there (there's a reason they weren't included in the first place).


Also, @dunn086 if lifegain is a major concern you in your meta, Rain of Gore might be worth considering for your wishboard. Be careful not to kill yourself with an Elderscale Wurm ETB effect if your life is under 7 with that particular choice though (when he enters you gain the life that your life gets adjusted).

June 18, 2014 4:23 a.m.

Earthsfire says... #12

Curse of Echoes over Hive Mind , it's 1 cheaper and it only affects your opponents spells.

June 18, 2014 11:39 a.m.

Earthsfire says... #13

Considering your ramp, that would actually help you out quite a bit against control.

June 18, 2014 11:39 a.m.

nbarry223 says... #14

I don't think I've ever lost a best of 3 control match honestly (that wasn't twin, or Kiki-Jiki, but those are combo control). I think Bow of Nylea would be slightly better against control (and a lot more versatile, so useful against other decks too) simply because of the low casting cost.

That is definitely a very interesting option though, I'll probably give it a shot for the hell of it.

June 18, 2014 11:59 a.m.

xzzane says... #15

Untap.in seems to be out of whack at the moment. Shame we couldn't finish our duel, fascinating deck. +1 from me!

June 18, 2014 3:04 p.m.

SwiftDeath says... #16

I really like Gaddock Teeg in the maybeboard it helps against decks like Pod and Splinter Twin and even takes your opponents off of Cryptic Command being searchable through glittering wish makes it a great card for sideboard and can be a great way to shut your opponent off if they can't get their combo pieces going.

June 18, 2014 3:08 p.m.

nbarry223 says... #17

My problem with Gaddock Teeg is that he is so easily removed. The decks he would impact generally have a multitude of ways to remove him in the mainboard. So he's usually a slightly hard to cast 2/2 body that just eats removal and buys me a turn usually, which isn't all that bad; but most of the time, he is irrelevant to their strategy.

Right now, I'm really trying to find my last mainboard card, and it's basically between Gaddock Teeg and Bow of Nylea with Garruk Wildspeaker closely behind, basically neck and neck with Engineered Explosives - I've pretty much decided against Trade Routes as mainboard material because it just doesn't do enough in the early game, and is only really useful against control, which I have enough options against already.

It's almost a 4 way tie of what card to use, and I do always have the option to move Scavenging Ooze back to the main if I can't really find anything (his gravehate becomes relevant in non-grave based decks, so he isn't that bad of an option). I really like the potential of Bituminous Blast too, but I've yet to be able to cast it in a beneficial situation. The fact that my deck is so fast makes slower cards like that a bit sub-par when they'd be simply amazing in a more control oriented Glittering Wish shell.

At this point, I'm just looking for a good solid card or two that fits well and is (hopefully) useful against a lot of different deck types. I have enough "silver bullet" type cards already I think, right now I'm looking for more general usefulness (although more hosers aren't bad if they address something I don't already address).

June 18, 2014 4:37 p.m.

nbarry223 says... #19

I've settled on Bow of Nylea mainboard for now, but I still feel there's something better out there. It does gain me life to stall (against most decks) so it serves the purpose of what I want my "extra" cards to do fairly well, while becoming a threat against certain strategies with the other modes, so it is my best maindeck choice atm, that I am aware of anyway.

I'm still quite open to suggestions for either board though, so do not hesitate to suggest something just because this boardstate looks "solid" right now. Scooze is free to replace the bow and free up a slot in the side, but I'd love something to replace the bow main, if at all possible.

June 18, 2014 6:52 p.m.

dunn086 says... #20

What about replacing Bow of Nylea with Thragtusk ? It's really good against decks with board wipe or aggro decks with it's gainlife ability and also a huge blocker. But the main contribution of Thragtusk in this deck would be for Mosswort Bridge 's power requirement.

June 19, 2014 2:48 a.m.

nbarry223 says... #21

Thragtusk is pretty much outclassed by Thrun, the Last Troll in my particular build. Thrun, the Last Troll might not gain me 5 life, but he is a hell of a lot harder to deal with, and can't be countered either. Also, the lower CMC is sometimes relevant, and the difference in power is pretty much irrelevant, as I am generally only activating a Mosswort Bridge with a Primeval Titan out.

June 19, 2014 3:37 a.m.

nbarry223 says... #22

So I'm thinking maybe I can try out Vinelasher Kudzu as my form of Tarmogoyf and see how it goes (maybe a strong offense is the best defense). I'm not quite sure how effective it will be against decks with a decent amount of removal, since it comes out as a 1/1 all the time, unlike goyf, so it is more vulnerable to red decks. I'll definitely give it a good testing though, I'm thinking it is worthy of two slots if it turns out as good as I am hoping.

June 19, 2014 11:33 p.m.

nbarry223 says... #23

So Vinelasher Kudzu was absolute crap. It just didn't fit in with the strategy, and didn't get big as fast as I envisioned (plus no trample, so could be chumped for days).

Right now I'm looking at tutoring, ramping, card advantage, and attack deterrents. Hopefully I can find something better than Bow of Nylea so this isn't all a total waste of time haha.

So far, Mwonvuli Beast Tracker and Ohran Viper are looking promising.

June 21, 2014 1:18 a.m.

Scorprix says... #24

For multi-colored cards for Glittering Wish : Necrotic Sliver , Meddling Mage , Qasali Pridemage , Vexing Shusher , Voidslime , Castigate , Harmonic Sliver , etc...

For the mainboard: Noble Hierarch , Simian Spirit Guide (Allows for a turn 1 win!), Pact of Negation , Thoughtseize , and don't add Lightning Bolt because it's too cliche'.

June 21, 2014 4:27 p.m.

nbarry223 says... #25

Necrotic Sliver - 6 to blow something up is too much. I already have something I can wish for to deal with any type of permanent, short of a land or planeswalker, which aren't much of a problem usually.

Meddling Mage - too easily removed, my same problem with Gaddock Teeg

Qasali Pridemage - used to have it mainboard actually, but I like Acidic Slime better since it lets me kill lands too, which allowed me to cut that slot in my wishboard.

Vexing Shusher - vulnerable to removal, and I don't really need any help in control matches, my mainboard is strong enough.

Voidslime - forecasting counters just cuts down on their value so much...I've tried them, and since I have to reveal it, they just get played around while I slow myself holding mana open.

Castigate - 4 mana to eliminate a card is just too much.

Harmonic Sliver - done better by Destructive Revelry


Noble Hierarch - I'm actually currently testing this one, and it is a forerunner with Beast Within / Mwonvuli Beast Tracker / Ohran Viper right now.

Simian Spirit Guide - it's more of an all in approach, which I'm trying to stay away from. It might allow slightly more explosive plays, but you also run out of steam a lot faster. It just doesn't fit my current build type.

Pact of Negation - It's dead until I have 5 mana, so I try to stay away from it.

Thoughtseize - really rare to have a turn 1 black source, and it takes away other plays in later turns, but I'll give it a try nonetheless, haven't considered it as an option honestly.

Lightning Bolt - wasn't planning to haha.

June 21, 2014 5:05 p.m.

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